Disgraceful Wine Lists

[Michael McNally]

I was at one place about 8 months ago and the wine they poured into my glass straight from an unopened bottle was actually warm. Suffice to say the wine was terrible.

I'd have to say that any wine "poured" from an unopened bottle would be terrible - probably extremely dry, not to mention tasteless and without much of a bouquet. Of course the restaurant probably made a fortune on the bottle.

Mahmoud.

Oh very droll, Mahmoud!

At least you could drive home!

Cheers

Michael

[Ozzie W]

I was at one place about 8 months ago and the wine they poured into my glass straight from an unopened bottle was actually warm. Suffice to say the wine was terrible.

I'd have to say that any wine "poured" from an unopened bottle would be terrible - probably extremely dry, not to mention tasteless and without much of a bouquet. Of course the restaurant probably made a fortune on the bottle.

Mahmoud.

Oops! I left out the part where they used a Coravin

[George Krashos]

My pet peeve is the amount of current vintage red wine being sold at 300% mark-up, when it simply isn't ready to drink. I get the fact that restaurants have to pay storage costs and holding stock is static money but I would love to go to a restaurant and see a 10 year old wine that someone purchased for $30/bottle and was being sold for $90-100. You store your wine somewhere, surely you can find room for an older rotating lot of 20 or so dozen that have some decent bottle age on them. But as I know nothing about the restaurant business, I'm sure there are a plethora of good reasons why this isn't feasible.

-- George Krashos

[sjw_11]

My pet peeve is the amount of current vintage red wine being sold at 300% mark-up, when it simply isn't ready to drink. I get the fact that restaurants have to pay storage costs and holding stock is static money but I would love to go to a restaurant and see a 10 year old wine that someone purchased for $30/bottle and was being sold for $90-100. You store your wine somewhere, surely you can find room for an older rotating lot of 20 or so dozen that have some decent bottle age on them. But as I know nothing about the restaurant business, I'm sure there are a plethora of good reasons why this isn't feasible.

-- George Krashos

Mostly because the average restaraunt is not in business for 2-yrs, let alone for 10!

[felixp]

Good article by Huon Hooke, but I had to laugh when I read the sommelier's comments below. What a typical sommelier, really has no clue.
I am sure many on this forum have had similar experiences to me, when a customer with a good wine knowledge makes an inquiry about a particular wine, only to see the sommelier back down sharply, and clam up when he/she realises any embellishment of the facts will be quickly picked-up on.

I have a son who is a chef, and has worked in several of Melbourne's "fancy" restaurants, for want of a better expression. In most of these, the true value of a sommelier is to steer the inquiring customer towards a wine that either they have an abundance of, or a wine that will maximise the restaurant profit.

In 1984, I took my then girlfriend, now ex-wife , to Glo Glo's in Toorak, then a formidable establishment, to pop the big question. IN those days, pre-CGT and when you could still charge a meal on tax, they had a superb wine list, as did many many fine restaurants. After wading thru an enormous wine list, I spied the 62 Grange for $55, which was a real bargain, and asked the sommelier over to order the bottle. Clearly, they did not want to part company with that stock, and to my amazement, he started to drone on about how we might feel the wine was much too "big and bold", and tried to turn my attention to a Prince Albert pinot, which he thought would be much more to the liking of this young couple. I literally had to argue for five minutes to get my wine, pointing out what a bargain the wine was, and that I had no interest in drinking a (in those days) thin bottle of dish-water from Geelong. I even remember telling him that at $55, the 62 was a far better bet than the 55 Grange was at $155!!! (wouldn't you love to see those prices now!!!) The wine was reluctantly decanted and served. He was a complete tool, and I guess that was the night, almost 30 years ago, when I lost all respect for the position of a sommelier. Try as I might, the experience actually really put a dampener on the whole evening, and I can remember the exchange I had with this guy as if it were yesterday.

[Cactus]

Just on the comments earlier about international experiences->

In China, I spied Koonunga Hill for 600Rmb, almost $100. I didnt go for anything Aussie, it was all like that.
I ended up buying a bottle of French red, for which I am blissfully ignorant of how much I overpaid.
You have to be careful up there. Sometimes they refill bottles with the local stuff, or switch.

[marsalla]

The problem for somms is that the good ones you dont even notice, and the bads ones you cannot forget

[damonpeyo]

Was in Helsinki, Finland couple years ago, spotted a Bar selling Coopers Pale Ale Stubbies for 12 Euros for 375ml Stubby....while average price for pint of local beer was roughly 7-9 Euros.

Following night went to a local restaurant, they had Jacob's Creek Shiraz for 32 Euros, while the bottleshop down the road sold them for 15 Euros, as all bottleshops are owned and controlled by the Finnish Government, not sure these days.

No wonder why Estonia is doing a booming business in the bottleshop trade from the Finns, Swedes, Danes, etc taking a couple hours Ferry ride there and back, ridiculously cheap.

[TravisW]

Was in Helsinki, Finland couple years ago, spotted a Bar selling Coopers Pale Ale Stubbies for 12 Euros for 375ml Stubby....while average price for pint of local beer was roughly 7-9 Euros

So, 30% more for an excellent beer shipped from the other end of the world compared to your bog standard Finnish lager. Sounds fair. €12 for a beer in a bar up in Scandi-land isn't too bad. There's a chain running through Europe from expensive beer up North, to cheap excellent beer in the Centre. It goes from Norway-Sweden-Denmark-Germany-Czech Republic... but the Germans deny crossing the border for good Pils.

Cheers, Travis.

[Chuck]

Can't agree more with the comments however one wonders if they have to charge these prices to cover the cost of running a restaurant which I believe are very high. Making a profit is a bonus. We try to dine at BYO places or plead our case quietly (birthday) before secretly bringing the bottle in so other diners don't see it. It works sometimes even if the corkage can be expensive.

Carl

[daver6]

Several years ago was at Roast in London. They have a rather lengthy wine list that I didn't feel like wading through as was with some other work colleagues who liked wine, but not that into it. We decided some Viognier would be a good option, so I asked the somm to recommend one. His first question was whether I wanted a red or white Viognier.

[rossmckay]

Several years ago was at Roast in London. They have a rather lengthy wine list that I didn't feel like wading through as was with some other work colleagues who liked wine, but not that into it. We decided some Viognier would be a good option, so I asked the somm to recommend one. His first question was whether I wanted a red or white Viognier.

Bring your finest bottle of Viognier Rouge my good man

[Peter Schlesinger]

Kanga Rouge anyone? Vin tres ordinaire. Much more expensive than vin ordinaire.

[tarija]

I have a BIG problem paying 3x (and more) retail and generally will not go back to a restaurant where i felt ripped off.

In Australia, wine and beverages subsidise the price of food.

Most people are relatively savvy re. food prices, and will look at a menu to see what prices are like. Most people don't know much about wine/beverage prices, or rather they don't want to feel like cheapskates when they're out on a date or celebrating a birthday - hence they will still buy a bottle of wine at a restaurant. The latter reason is why Champagne markups are so high - despite the fact that there is an endless supply of NV Champagne in retail land, people still buy Champagne in restaurants for celebration purposes.