JO site

wiggum · Post by **wiggum** » Wed Apr 08, 2009 6:00 pm

I know that I will stir up a bit of a debate with this one but I am a little frustrated with the number and consistency of the flow of his recent notes posted. I have been a paid user of his site for a number of years and what has occurred during the last 6 months or so is most unlike his early history and work ethic. I would like to see regular tastings and particularly those at or around about release time so i can capitalise on bargains and specials etc - not wait until they have come and gone. Further I noticed reading his hardcopy book (not mine) that as an example, Voyager Cab/M 2004 is in the book but not up on his site ( I hope this is just a one off and not an example of ongoing sloppy work). I have tried to be patient and resist posting this note but time has come. What does everyone else think?

Below is a list of latest notes and frequency.

date issued title type
23/03/2009 Hardys HRB D637 Shiraz ($40) tasting note
14/03/2009 Penfolds Bin 311 Chardonnay 2008 tasting note
14/03/2009 Penfolds Bin 128 Shiraz 2007 tasting note
14/03/2009 Penfolds Bin 407 Cabernet Sauvignon 2006 tasting note
14/03/2009 Penfolds Bin 138 Grenache Mourvedre Shiraz 2007 tasting note
14/03/2009 Penfolds Kalimna Bin 28 Shiraz 2006 tasting note
14/03/2009 Penfolds Bin 389 Cabernet Shiraz 2006 tasting note
16/02/2009 Delamere Pinot Noir 2007 tasting note
10/02/2009 Windy Peak Pinot Grigio 2008 tasting note
10/02/2009 Auroch Tempranillo 2006 tasting note
10/02/2009 Pipers Brook Gewurztraminer 2008 tasting note
10/02/2009 Pierro LTC Semillon Sauvignon Blanc 2008 tasting note
10/02/2009 Stags Leap Viognier 2007 tasting note
21/01/2009 David Hook The Gorge Shiraz 2007 tasting note
21/01/2009 Andrew Thomas Sweetwater Shiraz 2007 tasting note
12/12/2008 Mountadam Riesling 2008 tasting note
12/12/2008 Yellow Tail Shiraz 2007 tasting note
12/12/2008 Monte Antico 2006 tasting note
21/11/2008 Paul Jaboulet Aine La Chapelle Hermitage 2004 tasting note
21/11/2008 Guigal CÃƒÂ´te-RÃƒÂ´tie La Turque 2004 tasting note
21/11/2008 Guigal CÃƒÂ´te-RÃƒÂ´tie La Landonne 2004 tasting note
21/11/2008 Guigal CÃƒÂ´te-RÃƒÂ´tie La Mouline 2004 tasting note
21/11/2008 DuMOL Syrah 2006 tasting note
21/11/2008 Penfolds St Henri Shiraz 2005 tasting note
21/11/2008 Schubert Goose-Yard Block Shiraz 2004 tasting note

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dlo · Post by **dlo** » Wed Apr 08, 2009 6:27 pm

Totally unacceptable and a complete waste of money subscribing with this atrocious rate of information flow. My subscription is about to expire and unless Jeremy can come up with some great reason as to why he deserves my money I won't (ever) be renewing again.

Mark G · Post by **Mark G** » Wed Apr 08, 2009 6:35 pm

For a reviewer he is doing everyone in the industry a disservice ... break down the current tasting notes:

The 6 Penfolds on the 14th March - oh hurrah, someone tasted them for us :roll:

4 pricey Rhones in what appears to be a formal tasting of 7-8 wines

1 Yellow Tail Shiraz

and a random assortment

So out of 22 tasting notes in 5 months he has provided you with information on what exactly ... not much at all. I know he's had our wine for a while, but I'm not going to be holding my breath...

Cheers

Mark G

ross67 · Post by **ross67** » Wed Apr 08, 2009 6:58 pm

Vote with your wallet Wiggum and don't re-subscribe....i agree not good enough.
I find his Wine Annual very helpful though.

ross

Red Bigot · Post by **Red Bigot** » Wed Apr 08, 2009 7:40 pm

I've been a longtime fan of JO and a subscriber to his site for a 4-5 years, preferring to subscribe rather than buy the book. If things don't improve I'll not re-subscribe and will look at the book as a possible buy instead.
Halliday at least posts all the notes from the new edition of the Wine Companion soon after it is released and adds 100 TN a month. Halliday and Wine Front look pretty safe on the subscription front, JO looking pretty shaky.
I note he's released a new book in Chinese and will be travelling to promote it. Useful stuff to the Aus Wine Industry, but not a lot of use to current Aus Subscribers.

dave vino · Post by **dave vino** » Wed Apr 08, 2009 7:49 pm

Winefront do that in a week.

RogerPike · Post by **RogerPike** » Wed Apr 08, 2009 8:35 pm

My subscription has lapsed. It was not a difficult decision.

Roger

wiggum · Post by **wiggum** » Wed Apr 08, 2009 8:55 pm

Ross67

I sort of did vote with my wallet about Mid last year. But a few months later I relented for one last shot and renewed. It's a bit of a pity as he used to be so reliable and informative. P.S. Did anyone pick up his flagrant attempt to rent out his new office/premises in the leafy eastern suburbs? mmm

Daryl Douglas · Post by **Daryl Douglas** » Wed Apr 08, 2009 11:22 pm

Red Bigot wrote:I've been a longtime fan of JO and a subscriber to his site for a 4-5 years, preferring to subscribe rather than buy the book. If things don't improve I'll not re-subscribe and will look at the book as a possible buy instead.
Halliday at least posts all the notes from the new edition of the Wine Companion soon after it is released and adds 100 TN a month. Halliday and Wine Front look pretty safe on the subscription front, JO looking pretty shaky.
I note he's released a new book in Chinese and will be travelling to promote it. Useful stuff to the Aus Wine Industry, but not a lot of use to current Aus Subscribers.

Don't know why for sure but probably because of my exposure to this and the other forum, I gained the impression that JO was inconsistent in his opinions/ratings, particularly compared to those of other critics so have never seriously considered subscribing to his site.

I only subscribed to TWF when Gary Walsh joined Campbell Mattinson in the enterprise. So far it's been worthwhile, it's interactivity makes it good value.

I was an early subscriber to Winepros, having been exposed to Halliday through The Australian newspaper and still have a dim memory of Len Evans talking about wine on ABC tv in the mid-1960s. When Halliday released his Wine Companion site I was chuffed. Not interactive but probably the most comprehensive (Australian) wine site available, excellent value for the cost. It would be interesting to know how many of the TNs/ratings of the 100 monthly are actually prepared by his (whatsisname?) understudy but there is a consistency that's reassuring. BTW, if you can get the right batch-bottling of the humble Jacobs Creek shiraz/cab 06 for $6/btl, it's a great value quaffer, bbq wine and still pretty good at $9. 90pts from JH is close but it is a drink-now red.

Brian's site is worth the original subscription cost (reminder to self to renew), has led me to some very good bargains from different vendors. Morris Rutherglen Shiraz 2001 (prior to the intro of subscription) and Possums Vineyard (Blewitt Springs) McLaren Vale Shiraz 2005 readily spring to mind. The Morris is long gone, have two left from a dozen of the Possums, excellent value for $10.50/btl delivered.

This Auswine site is the best of the etailer fora for me because there's more interest in Australian wines rather than imported, it seems less elitist and posters seem to more appreciate discussion of everyday wines.

I must include Ric's site. The tour diaries are a wealth of down-to-earth information and the articles are interesting indeed. Seems to be in a bit of a lull at present but I've changed ISP in the last few months so need to resubscribe to the free newsletter.

Cheers

daz

mf · Post by mf » Thu Apr 09, 2009 12:31 am

I have actually mentioned this on another forum but given the inactivity on his site I emailed Jeremy Oliver about it (another person had done similar).

He was very prompt in responding and gave some good reasons as to what the issue has been which sounded very reasonable. He also said that it is his intention to do something for existing subscribers due to the lack of recent activity.

I actually suggest that before you cancel your subscription (unless you are thinking of doing it anyway) that you send him an email and at least give him a chance to explain (of course you could then cancel anyway). I was thinking of cancelling and have not done so given his response (luckily I gave him a chance before I did this - I was not going to but occurred to me that it was at least giving him an opportunity to explain).

griff · Post by **griff** » Thu Apr 09, 2009 12:46 am

mf wrote:I have actually mentioned this on another forum but given the inactivity on his site I emailed Jeremy Oliver about it (another person had done similar).

He was very prompt in responding and gave some good reasons as to what the issue has been which sounded very reasonable. He also said that it is his intention to do something for existing subscribers due to the lack of recent activity.

I actually suggest that before you cancel your subscription (unless you are thinking of doing it anyway) that you send him an email and at least give him a chance to explain (of course you could then cancel anyway). I was thinking of cancelling and have not done so given his response (luckily I gave him a chance before I did this - I was not going to but occurred to me that it was at least giving him an opportunity to explain).

Nice of him to reply. Perhaps there are a few subscribers of a similar opinion. If so then he may want to address the issue on his site for all the subscribers?

cheers

Carl

mf · Post by mf » Thu Apr 09, 2009 1:15 am

I asked him why he did not do this (similarly thought it would be a good idea) - there was a reason he was uncomfortable doing this. Don't mean to be cryptic but I kind of figure if somebody has liked his website for years that it at least makes sense to ask him what is going on before cancelling (which doesn't mean his response will necessarily satisfy someone).

GraemeG · Post by **GraemeG** » Thu Apr 09, 2009 8:25 am

I let my sub lapse about a year ago.
He's presumably busy with other things - clearly the website was a low priority. Fair enough, but I won't subscribe in that case. Doesn't lessen the value of the printed Annual, which I'll continue to buy.
A man can only have one business model - and can't have everything as a high priority.
cheers,
Graeme

dkw · Post by **dkw** » Thu Apr 09, 2009 9:31 am

I didn't renew my JO subscription last month as last year was my first online subscription and I was very disappointed with his posting rate.

I've given GW's site a go this year as I used to read it often before it came subscription only. Haven't regretted the switch for a minute.

Cheers,

Dave.

pstarr · Post by **pstarr** » Thu Apr 09, 2009 9:36 am

I contacted Jeremy by email in January this year, in the lead up to renewal of my subscription on 19 February. Jeremy replied to say that a new website was being built, but was overdue by several months, with a new target date of going live in February this year.

He mentioned that "Subscribers will also be offered an extension to their existing subscription by way of compensation for what you accurately describe as 'quiet' activity."

No new site appeared, nor did any email offer of a subscription extension by 19 February, so I let my subscription lapse.

I have not heard anything from Jeremy since then.

I would have preferred to continue my subscription, and would have done so if the extension offer or an update of a new site were forthcoming.

Gary W · Post by **Gary W** » Thu Apr 09, 2009 10:02 am

We (www.winefront.com.au) are happy to open up our shop for anyone who wants to check out our merchandise (so to speak).
You can log in as user Auswine with password trial - noting capitalisation.
This log in will self destruct on Fri 17th April - so seven days from now.

Happy Easter from The Wine Front
Gary Walsh & Campbell Mattinson

jeremy · Post by **jeremy** » Thu Apr 09, 2009 10:12 am

So many with the same story on JO, on this site and in discussions outside the internet. I'm an unashamed evangelist for The Wine Front myself. The service is almost ridiculously good. Joined when GW moved from Winorama too. Subscription cost paltry for what you get. IMHO of course.

Mandingo · Post by **Mandingo** » Thu Apr 09, 2009 10:45 am

I let my subscription lapse last year and wont be looking to renew.

I am however an unabashed fan of his Annual and will continue to buy it each year as I have since he started out. I like his palate and he is very consistent imho.

Michael McNally · Post by **Michael McNally** » Thu Apr 09, 2009 11:13 am

Gary W wrote:We (www.winefront.com.au) are happy to open up our shop for anyone who wants to check out our merchandise (so to speak).
You can log in as user Auswine with password trial - noting capitalisation.
This log in will self destruct on Fri 17th April - so seven days from now.

Happy Easter from The Wine Front
Gary Walsh & Campbell Mattinson

Opportunist! Rapacious capitalist!

Seriously though, admire the move. Bloody good idea for generating subs.

TORB · Post by **TORB** » Thu Apr 09, 2009 12:59 pm

A bloody pity! I been been a long time JO fan, but his recent lack of activity is disappointing.

Assuming the new site info is correct, by not communicating with his current client base, and offering something for the lack of activity, at the rate he is going, by the time the new site is up, there will be a lot fewer people to read it.

Old saying - your best customers are your existing customers.

My subscription is due in days, and if someone like me won't renew, its pretty grim.

Also, FWIW, in the old days when Campbell got behind (on a couple of occasions) he sent out an email of apology and extended the subscription for free.

Daz, since the end of January there have been 8 stories on TORBWine, some of them fairly lengthily, and about 5 Snippets (and I hope to have a 10,000 word story finished sometime next week or the week after.)

Craig(NZ) · Post by **Craig(NZ)** » Thu Apr 09, 2009 1:17 pm

personally i cant see the need to pay money for any wine sites on the internet. never have, never will

winetastic · Post by **winetastic** » Thu Apr 09, 2009 1:23 pm

dave vino wrote:Winefront do that before breakfast.

Fixed your post

jeremy · Post by **jeremy** » Thu Apr 09, 2009 1:56 pm

Goes without saying that TORBwine is excellent although new to me and I have to admit, a little daunting. Scared of saying something stupid and having my head taken off

Red Bigot · Post by **Red Bigot** » Thu Apr 09, 2009 2:15 pm

Craig(NZ) wrote:personally i cant see the need to pay money for any wine sites on the internet. never have, never will

Personally I find some information is worth what you pay for it, and that includes some of the information you pay nothing for.

platinum · Post by **platinum** » Thu Apr 09, 2009 3:17 pm

Mine was up for renewal last November and I didnt re subscribe. I buy the book every year which is handy and thought its enough for me and what i need. I am subscribed to winefront which is value for money ++++ my only beef being that I dont want my full surname up if I reply to a topic so I tend not to contribute as much as Id like. Perhaps Gary can change or shorten it?

Gary W · Post by **Gary W** » Thu Apr 09, 2009 3:30 pm

platinum wrote:Mine was up for renewal last November and I didnt re subscribe. I buy the book every year which is handy and thought its enough for me and what i need. I am subscribed to winefront which is value for money ++++ my only beef being that I dont want my full surname up if I reply to a topic so I tend not to contribute as much as Id like. Perhaps Gary can change or shorten it?

You can change it yourself. From the My Profile option on the front screen (once logged in). Remove your last name. Change 'Display Name Publicly As' Save. http://www.winefront.com.au/wp-admin/profile.php
GW

dazza1968 · Post by **dazza1968** » Thu Apr 09, 2009 3:52 pm

Its interesting reading because i cancelled my membership 10 months ago for exactly the same reasons . I found alot of updates came thru slowly and i used his site as a guide to purchase wines before they were well and truly sold out! I also respected the way he would without concern cain the larger wine producers for something substandard in his opinion.

As a rule he has been correct .

For me he assisted in purchases and also in not buying .

Mind you when a great wine is found its too late when its sold out ! so hey no renewal was warranted

Regards Dazza

pizzler · Post by **pizzler** » Fri Apr 10, 2009 7:37 am

And all this time I thought a JO site was porn...

JO used to write for Tanzer's IWC and was an early source of inflated scores for Shiraz wines. It doesn't appear that he's changed his colors any.

pstarr · Post by **pstarr** » Fri Apr 10, 2009 9:28 am

Pizzler, I would suggest that Jeremy Oliver is not that known for handing out high points scores. Lengthy drinking windows, yes, but points inflation? Not in my experience.

TORB · Post by **TORB** » Fri Apr 10, 2009 10:47 am

pstarr wrote:Pizzler, I would suggest that Jeremy Oliver is not that known for handing out high points scores. Lengthy drinking windows, yes, but points inflation? Not in my experience.

Agreed. And the funny thing is, that the more I drink the older wines in my cellar, the more I realise his predictions were normally pretty damn good.