Ahoy me mateys...... Its Sunday

[TORB]

Hi Good Peoples,

That time of the week again. Please let us know what you have been drinking. Lists, vibes, and tasting notes all welcome.

[Loztralia]

Last night we had, for the first time, the 06 Ata Rangi Pinot Noir. It certainly packs a lot of complexity for such a light bodied wine. Very fruity for a Pinot, cherry and lemon zest on the nose. Cherry and berry predominant in flavour with very, very subtle tannins. It's been a while since I drank a really nice Pinot and so it's good to be reminded what the point is.

Incidentally, this was sampled in the brasserie at the Lord Nelson in Sydney. Not wholly a top notch joint but I was impressed with the wine list's pricing - I think it's the first time I've seen a Grange at under $500 on a restaurant list and certainly not anything as old as 1985 like they offered here. I think the Ata Rangi was $108 which isn't at all bad as markups go.

[Mike Hawkins]

1990 Penfolds Bin 90a. I've had this wine many times and this was undoubtedly the best showing yet. It has an almost perfect combination of power, elegance, length and complexity. Its still quite tannic and has years in front of it - at least 10 years till it peaks and then should hold for a further decade minimum. This will be tough to beat for WOTY, it was that good.

2002 Petaluma Shiraz - I loved the spiciness of what was a cooler vintage. Really nice wine.

2004 Penfolds Bin 389 - this was a less than perfect sample. It was far more astringent than previous samples.

2005 Kalleske shiraz - primary and syrupy and went pretty well with rare rack of lamb. Funnily enough, it tasted ok with sticky date pudding as well.

[winetastic]

Majella Coonawarra Cabernet Sauvignon 2005
Vibrant aromas of blackcurrant, liquorice, menthol and spices. The palate is led by powerful and juicy blackcurrant fruit, plenty of super fine tannin and a little lingering coffee on the finish. Its robust, well balanced and very long - excellent Cabernet and good value at around $30, 93/100.

Mount Pleasant Rosehill Shiraz 2004
Inviting aromas of cherries, blackcurrant, nutmeg and clove. The robust palate is filled with rich dark fruits and berries, chocolate, pepper and cedar oak. Definitely full bodied, not overly “huntery” and a touch warm on the finish, 88/100.

Rosemount Show Reserve Shiraz 2004
Smelling of coconut oak, plum and spices, this Shiraz has an approachable tannin structure, however somewhere along the line it’s soul was ripped out and replaced with a brittle oaken heart. In short, it tastes like an acceptable but generic red wine, 86/100.

[Wayno]

Saltram Mamre Brook Cabernet Sauvignon 2004
I have an arsenal of this stuff buried in cardboard in the cellar and I think I am pretty happy about that.
It doesn't seem to have shifted too much since last taste which was quite some months back - still very tight and austere, tannins quite rigid, however there is a lovely cedary, tobaccoey quality about it that sets it apart from it's price range peers. I suspect this will take a lot of time to soften into shape, my only hope is that the fruit doesn't drop away too dramatically before that time. I suspect it could have done with a decant.

[Tucker Wine Studios]

Dutschke Willow Bend Shiraz Merlot Cabernet Sauvignon 2006: Plummy fruit, sweet vanilla and chocolate, firm tannins, great mouthfeel, wonderfully gluggable wine;

Yalumba The Virgilius 2007: Fairly sweet (fruit not sugar), ripe and opulent, highly enjoyable;

Chandon Vintage Brut 2003: ...aaaahhh, what a treat on a hot Friday evening after work when nicely chilled...

Waiting for the cool change,
Mario

[John #11]

2003 Serafino Shiraz (not the Sharktooth)
Satsuma plums, dark chocolate, lots of subtle spicy cedary / vanilla oak (is that an oxymoron?), pepper and licorice. All well integrated, and drinking very well now, but could easily go another 5-10 years.

Lovely archetypal Mclaren Vale shiraz.

2003 Chateau Larose-Trintaudon (Cru Bourgeois Superieur)
From Haut-Medoc
60% CS 40% Merlot
Still very young, and took ages to open up, but well worth the wait.
Gobs of red and dark fruit, cassis+++, red and black berries, some graphite and tobacco, and lots of heavy trodden earthy, cedary nuances. A generous and lasting finish, with the smoothness only a quality merlot component can give. Tannins already well integrated.

A very cheap Bordeuax red that easily beats many Aussie Cabs.

Cheers.
Enjoy.

John

[9redpens]

Irvine Zinfandel Merlot 1998.
The lightest colour I think I have ever seen, but by no means a disappointing wine. Sour cherries with decent length. Interestingly the Zinfandel in the wine was from a young vineyard and perhaps is now the source of their Zinfandel Reserve?

Binder Mitchell Baroota shiraz 2002.
I picked up stewed fruit; perhaps the fruit was too ripe. I’m happy with these as quaffers.

[steady]

Evening all... long time lurker, first time poster. Please be gentle

I've been getting into a bit of fizz this week.

D'Arenberg Peppermint Paddock.

This has been on my to try list for a couple of years so I took the plunge and bought a bottle the other day. The colour was quite something... a deep, striking violet that stained the glass. It was well balanced and had pure fruit flavour. Probably the best example of a Chambourcin I have tasted to date.

Veuve Amiot NV

We visited Veuve Amiot a couple of years ago and so this one evokes fond memories. Balanced acidity and subtle toasty characteristics; this was a hit with everyone who tried it. For a $12 French bubbly, it is seriously good value.

I am currently drinking what (I think) is a blend of Zema Estate Cabernet 2004 and Nashwauk Shiraz 2006. We had a bit of a do the other day and in my wisdom (read: drunk) emptied the contents of the last remaining bottles into one and stuck it in the fridge.

TN: Surprisingly good

[JG]

penfolds bin 28 2004
my first from a 6 pack, coming along nicely, better than i had expected. had feared might be a bit stewed on nose, but extremely enjoyable, brighter fruit that i remembered,layers of texture and flavour. nice finish.

kooyong clonale chard 2007
have had a few of these over the last 6 months or so, my fave chard at that price point at $22 odd. nice oak, not overdone, and very refreshing on a hot summer afternoon. hit the spot with beer battered flathead tonight.

mamre brook cab sauv 2004
bit dissapointed, simpler less structured wine that i had remembered.

leconfield cab sauv 2005
picked up on way into byo the other night, usual coonawarra goodness, beautiful depth of fruit and mocha, approachable without decanting or extended breathing. Have a few 2004s under the house, will have to add some 2005.

[wolf]

2003 Henshcke Mt Edelstone: Deep ruby colour. Slightly peppery nose. Dark fruits, smokey oak. Very nice long finish, firm tannins. Will try another one in 4-5 yrs.

[n4sir]

Evening all... long time lurker, first time poster. Please be gentle

I've been getting into a bit of fizz this week.

D'Arenberg Peppermint Paddock.

This has been on my to try list for a couple of years so I took the plunge and bought a bottle the other day. The colour was quite something... a deep, striking violet that stained the glass. It was well balanced and had pure fruit flavour. Probably the best example of a Chambourcin I have tasted to date.

Welcome to the forum steady - thanks for your impressions, they're much appreciated!

I've only had the one bottle of Peppermint Paddock years ago - thought it was pretty good too. Have you tried their new 2005 VP? - it's now all Chambourcin too (I guess the Shiraz that used to go into the VP would always have made a better profit in Dead Arm, so it had to happen one day)

Cheers,
Ian

[Adair]

Had an excellent vinous Saturday. Caught up with bacchaebabe Kris and Attila to show off some of the facets of Australian Riesling to Bytown Rick and his wife Mary that are not so easily found in Canada, particularly non Clare or Eden examples, as well as some aged examples:

2008 Seppelt Drumborg Riesling - Screwcap - Bath salts, minerals and tart green apples. Lean and focused. Very fine, talc-like and very powerful acidity running through the wine. Built to age. Some will say it lacks charm. I love the power and the sculpted acid on the back. 94/100. Drink in 10+ years for most.

2008 Clonakilla Riesling - Screwcap - Minerals, white flowers, lime and even the slightest hint of mango. Middle palate shows some generosity but is tightly controlled by powerful, fine, slightly chalky, bright, very minerally acidity that strongly shows its presence on the back palate. I had tasted both this and the above Drumborg previously but not together. I thought the Drumborg would be the slightly better wine when tasted together but this was not the case. 95/100. Best 2008 Riesling so far for me.

2008 Whitehaven Riesling - Screwcap - A NZ Marlborough ring-in that satisfied Attila's wish for some residual sweetness in a Riesling. Rich middle palate but lacking on the back, especially in this company. 90/100. I blended some of this with the Clonakilla... and it was excellent.

1996 Taylor's St. Andrew's Riesling - Cork - Honey, lime, toast with nuances of apple and butter... wonderful aged Australian Riesling starting to gain some serious richness on the middle palate but still light on its feet with a wonderful, spritzy, mineral acid backbone giving freshness, life and length. Still a year from reaching its peak. 95/100. Superb and thank you Kris.

1994 Richmond Grove Watervale Rhine Riesling - Cork - Low fill. Lime, honey, fig, cream, butter, toast and honey. Deep and hedonistic but still with a loose but expansively structured back palate. Glorious although probably a year past its peak. 93/100, showing that points can lie as this was probably the most enjoyable of the Australian four.

That evening I dined with Rick & Mary and Kris & Lisa to start my 2009 wine dinner tally exceptionally well. Vibes written 48 hours after:

1988 Seppelt Dorrien Cabernet Sauvignon - Cork - Rich and deep. Loose but well structured. 91/100.

1997 Mount Mary Quintet Cabernets - Cork - Medium body or slightly less. Intense blackcurrant base that I did not expect. Weeding Franc complexities. Cigar. Quite complex. Very easy to enjoy. Acid that integrated quickly but showed that this was going to live for a long while. Loosely tannic. 92/100.

2001 Clonakilla Shiraz / Viognier - Cork - Cork looked perfect but I suspected there was something wrong with this wine upon opening but I waited 24 hours to conclude this fact. I initially hoped that the slight cardboard nuances on the nose and palate would blow off, but they never did, and that the dark cherry silkiness and lusciousness that the previous 12+ bottles of this wine provided would reveal itself, but it never did. However, the pepper, cooking spices and smoked meat complexities were still there, so was the long backbone of fine tannin although they seemed quite bony in this wine, so I hope that Rick experienced something about the greatness of Clonakilla reds. Interestingly, the apricot Viognier was more obvious than previous bottles. I took the remaining half bottle of this wine to a “wine guzzler” friend’s place on Sunday and even he was not interested in finishing the bottle! Not rated.

1998 Torbreck RunRig Shiraz / Viognier - Cork - Long, fine, expansive, ripe tannins carry still quite primary, extremely complex, concentrated but not overripe dark berry based flavours with tar, marshmallow and ink and some leather and coffee nuances to a controlled and long finish. A complete wine. My only issue is the obvious presence of shaving cream oak but my memory says this wine is 100% French and not American oak although my nose says otherwise. It requires another 10 years to reach its peak. No apricot at all. Quite superb. 96/100.

NV Morris Grand Muscat - Cork - Seriously deep and creamy, of at least Grand level. Massive sweetness. Exceptional example of the super sumptuous style. 92/100.

Great day. A particular thank you to Kris for sharing a number of her cellar delights.

Kind regards,
Adair

[Attila]

1994 Richmond Grove Watervale Rhine Riesling - Cork - Low fill. Lime, honey, fig, cream, butter, toast and honey. Deep and hedonistic but still with a loose but expansively structured back palate. Glorious although probably a year past its peak. 93/100, showing that points can lie as this was probably the most enjoyable of the Australian four.


Kind regards,
Adair

It was indeed a lovely and proper riesling, enjoyed this a lot. Pity they don't make them like this anymore.
Cheers,
Attila

[bacchaebabe]

So it must be my turn to chip in on this tasting day.

Firstly, always a delight to meet other forumites. This was strangely my first encounter with Adair and Attila and obviously the first time meeting Rick and his wife Mary. I thoroughly enjoyed both the afternnon and the evening despite presenting with a hangover. Adding more alcohol works wonders though. So to the wines.

08 Seppelt Drumborg Riesling Pale yellow colour. Struck by the acidity of this wine particularly on the back palate. Slightly floral and very dry. For my palate, this needs a lot of time.

08 Clonakilla Riesling Slightly floral nose but more lemon on the nose. Smelt fuller and rounder than the Drumborg. On the palate a flinty, dry, stoney flavour profile. No residual sugar here with a bone dry finish. Atilla was not fond of either of these wines and I could see his point as they are a bit hard going, particularly without food. However with some good seafood on a sunny day these would both be very plesant indeed.

08 Whitehaven Marlborough Riesling To prove his point, Attila presented this wine. Pale yellow with a honey and melon nose. On tasting, a much sweeter floral palate. Honey notes with a lovely middle palate but a surprisingly dry finish. I found this a little thin in the body though. An interesting exercise to compare the two styles and I must say I have a preference for the later picked styles with some residual sugar which typify the NZ and European examples. By this stage my hangover was improving.

96 Taylor's St Andrew Riesling Deep clear yellow hue. Lovely complex nose. There's a trace of kero but in a deep and satisfying way not the usual brash way. Also quite buttery and toasty. Fat and round with a nice acid finish. Nice balance on this one and just entering its drinking window. A good example of aged riesling done well.

94 Richmond Grove Watervale Rhine Riesling Note the labelling of this one! Terribly mouldy cork on top and a low fill level so I was a little concerned about this as it was one of my few auction buys. Absolutely fine though. Deeper yellow colour again but perfectly clear and bright. Wafting kero. More elegant and balanced than the Taylors right through the palate. Very linear with a very clean lime flavour dominating melding with honey and toast. Very enjoyable indeed.

So we stumbled home through the crowds gathering in the city to meet once again for dinner in Newtown at one of our favorite locals, Linda's on King. This time we lost Attila but picked up my partner, Lisa. I didn't take notes on these but certain elements stood out.

88 Seppelt Dorrien Cabernet Savignon In my mind, this was simply glorious. A perfectly mature, perfectly cellared wine drinking exceptionally well. I was genuinely surprised as I thoguht this would be on the slippery slope down. Absolutely gorgeous mouth filling plum aromas and flavours.

97 Mount Mary Quintet Cabernets This was a little closed on pouring but opened in the glass with a few minutes and continued to gain complexity over the night. A very elegant and balanced wine with a deep blackcurrent core. Clearly plenty of time ahead of this but still a very fine wine right now.

98 Torbreck Runrig Shiraz Viognier This had that really beautiful intense and complex nose that good examples of this blend display. Almost a honey, meady, brown malt (and even apricot) type of depth to the nose. Palate of black blue fruits with a fine tannin backbone. Still a long life ahead of this one.

01 Clonakilla Shiraz Viognier I think Adair is being somewhat harsh on this wine - probably as it was his own. I certainly did not get an overt corked characters. The wine was somewhat muted so theremay have been a very low level TCA taint but it was not evident other than that. Lisa is particularly sensitive to cork taint and believe me she would have said something had she picked it up. I personally think we probably should have decanted this one too. For me, the nose was hinting at apricots and that lucious character I described earlier but was just a little closed down.

NV Morris Grand Muscat One of my favourite muscats and, along with the Morris Old Premium, one of the best value wines in Australia. $30 at the cellar door (although it may have gone up recently). Deep and creamy describes it well. Add in the usual raisin, malty, toffee complexities and you're in heaven. YUM!

Thanks to all - I realy enjoyed myself at this dinner and it was a fantastic line up. And, when I woke up, I actually didn't have another hangover. I think the berocca before bed helped though.

[Mark Jappe]

2000 Clos Clare Riesling

Stelvin closure had kept this wine surprisingly fresh. No hint of reduction despite what a certain American critic might suggest. If memory serves Grosset made this wine under contract, but I may have my years wrong on that score. Still plenty of lemon and lime on the palate, less developed colour than one might expect a wine of its age. Subtle nose with a hint of honey. An unexpected (to a degree) treat on the whole.

[Gavin Trott]

leconfield cab sauv 2005
picked up on way into byo the other night, usual coonawarra goodness, beautiful depth of fruit and mocha, approachable without decanting or extended breathing. Have a few 2004s under the house, will have to add some 2005.

For my two cents worth

Jump into the 2006 Leconfield. My favourite Coonawarra Cabernet from 2006 (not counting the big guns!) and imo a step up from 2005.

[Adair]

01 Clonakilla Shiraz Viognier I think Adair is being somewhat harsh on this wine - probably as it was his own. I certainly did not get an overt corked characters. The wine was somewhat muted so theremay have been a very low level TCA taint but it was not evident other than that. Lisa is particularly sensitive to cork taint and believe me she would have said something had she picked it up. I personally think we probably should have decanted this one too. For me, the nose was hinting at apricots and that lucious character I described earlier but was just a little closed down.

FWIW. As you know, I suspected cork taint/scalping on the night, but I and in fact no one was sure. When the sweet cherry fruit typical of this wine had not opened by the next day and the tannins became more prominent and moved from bony to a bit more sandpaperish, I was more confident. When my "wine guzzling" friend would not drink it and said he could smell the cardboard, I had no more doubt.
Adair

[orpheus]

Just back from a trip to NZ, where I was particularly interested to taste some NZ shiraz, as it appears to have such great potential there. As there were many wines, and I did not take any notes at the time, there will be limited tasting notes.

Craggy Range "Le Sol" syrah 2006.

My favourite wine of the trip. My memory is of very intense, ripe (but not jammy) fruit, and beautiful, very fine tannins, with excellent length. Great colour.

Awaroa wines syrah 2005

This was a wine from a small Waiheke vineyard. Quite coarse but not unpleasant tannins running through it, darkish plum palate, good mouth-feel. A winery to watch.

Vidal Soler Syrah 2002 (I think, I could be wrong about the vintage)

I really enjoyed this wine. There was pronounced tamirillo (tree tomato) on the palate, which I have never tasted in a wine before, and found attractive (though someone told me when I mentioned it that it is seen as an indicator of under-ripe fruit; it didn't seem that way to me). Full-bodied and generous, and good length.

Shaw and Smith shiraz 2006

At a restaurant, which had very good food, and a preposterously over-priced wine-list, this seemed relatively good value, so I chose it over any NZ wine. Was amply rewarded. I thogught this was an excellent Australian shiraz, powerful, restrained, well-balanced, and beautifully structured wine.

Grosset Gaia 2002

A bargain; $35 NZ, I had to buy it. Another beautiful wine with a long future, and an even longer finish, sensationally long.

I also tasted some aged Te Mata Coleraine, which is good, but a little restrained, and I wouldn't rate it quite as highly as some seem to (which is very highly).

Right now, I am tucking into a bottle of 1993 Dalwhinnie Moonambel Cabernet, as my family have fled to my parents-in-law while very minor building work is going on (we have 15 month old twins, who are not helpful to builders).

I was worried, because the cork was very wet, and there were signs of seepage through the top of the cork, however the wine is drinking well, though nearing the end of its life. The nose is of molasses. The wine has lost most of its primary fruit and is a little hot, but has lovely, fine-grained, grippy tannins, contributing to a tight finish, and tastes of liquorice and bitter chocolate.

[Adair]

I also tasted some aged Te Mata Coleraine, which is good, but a little restrained, and I wouldn't rate it quite as highly as some seem to (which is very highly).

Can you provide any vintages so that Craig and I can tear you apart?

Adair

[griff]

1996 Petaluma Coonawarra Cabernet Merlot
Federation brick red. Redcurrants, capsicum and honey on the nose. Moderate-lean palate with tannin perceptible but in balance now. A cooler Coonawarra red but not the worse for it. Not a show-stopper and Excellent drinking from now onwards for when you are in a quiet and contemplative mood.

cheers

Carl

[Daryl Douglas]

01 Clonakilla Shiraz Viognier I think Adair is being somewhat harsh on this wine - probably as it was his own. I certainly did not get an overt corked characters. The wine was somewhat muted so theremay have been a very low level TCA taint but it was not evident other than that. Lisa is particularly sensitive to cork taint and believe me she would have said something had she picked it up. I personally think we probably should have decanted this one too. For me, the nose was hinting at apricots and that lucious character I described earlier but was just a little closed down.

FWIW. As you know, I suspected cork taint/scalping on the night, but I and in fact no one was sure. When the sweet cherry fruit typical of this wine had not opened by the next day and the tannins became more prominent and moved from bony to a bit more sandpaperish, I was more confident. When my "wine guzzling" friend would not drink it and said he could smell the cardboard, I had no more doubt.
Adair

Low levels of TCA/cork taint are not always immediately obvious. Cork taint doesn't necessarily mean TCA either, as I'm sure all here know. To me it's a woodiness that goes beyond the winemakers' use of oak but hasn't the typical wet dog/cardboard etc tca characters.

daz

[Davo]

2000 Clos Clare Riesling

Stelvin closure had kept this wine surprisingly fresh. No hint of reduction despite what a certain American critic might suggest. If memory serves Grosset made this wine under contract, but I may have my years wrong on that score. Still plenty of lemon and lime on the palate, less developed colour than one might expect a wine of its age. Subtle nose with a hint of honey. An unexpected (to a degree) treat on the whole.

I thought they were made by Kevin Mitchell at Killikanoon, but you could well be right.

A couple of the Barry boys now own the place apparently.

[Bick]

A few wines tasted over the past couple of weeks, including tastings at Kumeu and Coopers Creek:

Moet & Chandon NV Nice but not so special.

Rockford BP 02 Very enjoyable with roast duck. Porty and rich, super smooth.

Te Mata Cape Crest 07 Fruity, rich and yet refreshing. Will leave remaining bottle to see how it develops.

Church Road Reserve Syrah 06 Super wine, very enjoyable, with lots of fruit, structure and pepper.

Church Road Reserve Chardonnay 06 Good, mealy, vannila oak, persistent finish.

Carrick Pinot Noir 05 Best pinot I've had recently.

Crab Farm Merlot Cabernet Malbec 04 Gifted bottle. Not bad, but a bit on the rough side - interesting raisiny characters though.

Johner Riesling 08 Second bottle I've had of this - nice clean wine of delicate citrous with apple and pear. Slightly off-dry. Strong acidity should allow it to age ok.

Pegasus Bay Riesling 03 Very good. Little less sweet than some PB riesling, but in perfect condition.

Kumeu River Estate Chardonnay 07 Fruity, prominent oak, honeysuckle, rich and quite open. Better to cellar for a while though.

Kumeu River Coddington Chardonnay 07 Fresh and peachy, good acidity, aromatic and approachable. Driinking well already.

Kumeu River Hunting Hill Chardonnay 07 Closed and tight, strong acid backbone, but with good fruit lurking. Needs time.

Kumeu River Mate's Vineyard Chardonnay 07 In character quite like the Estate, but more so. Oak a bit heavy at the moment.

Kumeu River Coddington Chardonnay 06 Lovely aroma of tropical fruit, banana and citrous. Palate fresh and approachable, with peach and ripe citrous flavours. Clean and complex; very good day 2 also.

Coopers Creek Malbec 'The Clays' 06 Smooth, quite tannic, ripe dark fruit and chocolate. Nice (esp with cheese plate). Grown in Kumeu.

Coopers Creek Chardonnay Viognier 07 Ok, but viognier component not readily apparent to me. Nothing special.

Coopers Creek Gisborne Reserve Chardonnay 07 Quite creamy (unusually went through mlf), rich and varietal (and well reviewed) but put into the shade by the recently tasted Kumeu's. Lacks their subtlety.

Coopers Creek Select Vineyard Arneis 'Little Rascal' 08 Lovely floral, spice aroma, with hints of licorice over the fruit. Aroma and palate remiscent of better pinot gris, but spicier and sharper. Good mouthfeel (14.5% alc - but not hot), with grapefruit and bready (almost champagne-like) flavour spectrum. Interesting and moreish wine. Recommended.

Trinity Hill 'The Gimblett' 05 Dark plum red, lovely pencil box character from french oak over blackberry and savoury notes. Palate super smooth and silky - classy stuff. Highly recommended. Diam.

Sacred Hill Gimblett Gravels Syrah 07 I enjoyed this a lot. Generally considered only a so-so example of Hawkes Bay syrah, from what I've seen of reviews, but this may be a reflection of the quality now out there (or alternatively, I'm right and the two reviews I read are wrong ). Its juicy, mouthfilling and peppery: good varietal characters; and an excellent quaffer of its type - and perhaps better than that.


I would recommend a stop at Coopers Creek in Kumeu for a cheese plate, by the way - very nice and the seats down by the ponds in the gardens is a delightful spot for a bit of R+R. The cheese / malbec combo I enjoyed did the trick for me on a lazy summer's day.

[orpheus]

I also tasted some aged Te Mata Coleraine, which is good, but a little restrained, and I wouldn't rate it quite as highly as some seem to (which is very highly).

Can you provide any vintages so that Craig and I can tear you apart?

Adair[quote]

Doesn't sound a very tempting offer!

I'll have to check.