"Australia does not make enough great wine" B. Cro

[chartres]

http://www.jancisrobinson.com/jr7078.htm

I thought Australian wine was on top of the ladder... but I start to come across more and more articles like this. Are we overrating local wines?

[MartinC]

Am very surprised to see an important figure in the Ind. making a sweeping statement like this. Generalisation is a poor form of conclusion. Obviously Mr.Croser hasnt tasted enough looking @ his list of favourites. Either he is behind time or his personal preference is leaning towards the stereotype French's style.

[Gary W]

Am very surprised to see an important figure in the Ind. making a sweeping statement like this. Generalisation is a poor form of conclusion. Obviously Mr.Croser hasnt tasted enough looking @ his list of favourites. Either he is behind time or his personal preference is leaning towards the stereotype French's style.

I thought you were the master of sweeping generalisations MC!
That list (by Jancis - not Croser) is spot on for my tastes. I would also add Giaconda Cabernet, Rockford Basket Press + few others.
GW

[Gerard Connors]

Bowen Estate Cab seems a bit out of its league on Jancis' list, especially given recent efforts.

Ged

[corcoran]

This is just a case of an outspoken person commenting as though their views were fact.

I disagree with his views on finesse, terroir and style. I think he wants to produce wines that compete with the French both in quality and STYLE, and that's where I completely disagree. I prefer the fruitier, denser style of many Australian wines, as well as the absence of barnyard and brett in many of the Syrah based wines.

So, Croser can go make his Hermitage or Bordeaux, but please leave my plummy, chocolatey Barossa Shiraz and licorice, blackberry laden McLaren Vale shiraz's alone please.

[Red Bigot]

So, Croser can go make his Hermitage or Bordeaux, but please leave my plummy, chocolatey Barossa Shiraz and licorice, blackberry laden McLaren Vale shiraz's alone please.

Amen to that! (I do like Petaluma Coonawarra in many vintages though...)

[chartres]

This is just a case of an outspoken person commenting as though their views were fact.

I disagree with his views on finesse, terroir and style. I think he wants to produce wines that compete with the French both in quality and STYLE, and that's where I completely disagree. I prefer the fruitier, denser style of many Australian wines, as well as the absence of barnyard and brett in many of the Syrah based wines.

So, Croser can go make his Hermitage or Bordeaux, but please leave my plummy, chocolatey Barossa Shiraz and licorice, blackberry laden McLaren Vale shiraz's alone please.

The point is that "the Australian Red Wine" is not only Barossa/McLaren Shiraz, and even not only Shiraz The rest of the world may think this way and they even may have reasons for that, as wines like Yellow Tail Shiraz are bestsellers in US (and in UK?)! I personally like diversity and I dread the idea of drinking (sorry, "tasting", as Jancis would say ) heavy-weight Barossa Rads every day and night... I value Bass Phillip pinots more than American oak loaded shirazes.. All said is just MHO... I have a European background after all

[George Krashos]

Hey, don't knock Brian Croser, he's just trying to stay in the new inlaws' good books ...

-- George Krashos

[Rob]

I tend to agree with Croser on this. Sure Australian can make top shiraz, Semillon and Cab Sav, but we are very poor in Pinot.

Given the potential in terms of skill, technology, climate...etc Australia has, More top notch wine should be produced at a reasonable price.

Hopefully this will be more evident in the near future

[Michael]

http://www.jancisrobinson.com/jr7078.htm

I thought Australian wine was on top of the ladder... but I start to come across more and more articles like this. Are we overrating local wines?

quite obviously.

[Michael]

Obviously Mr.Croser hasnt tasted enough looking @ his list of favourites.

oh please!!

would someone like to actually debate Crosers point of view?

[Anthony]

Well, I am going to sit on the fence

Most of the really great wines of the world are old world wines. Why? Well in most cases it has a lot to do with complexity. Just tonight we had a bottle of Faiveley 1er Cru Nuits St Georges 1987 (negociant bottling) that was amazing. When we first tried it, it was hard to believe this Pinot Noir was a '87. Also take a look at regions like the Rhone Valley and Bordeaux and the number of world class wines puts Australia to shame.

Which brings up an interesting point. If Australia, had a first growth rating system (for the whole of Aus) what wines would be considered first growths? The first few choices are obvious:
Grange
Hill of Grace

then:
Cullen
Moss Wood
Wendouree
Armagh
Mount Mary

What else?

However, whilst the 'old world' does make some mind-blowing wines it is the case of two extremes. You can rarely buy 'good' to 'very good' wines from France without paying a small fortune. Here in Aus, it is the exact opposite. You cab buy some really good wines from $20 to $50. And this is where 90% of us 'fine wine lovers' buy between. Hence, France might make some of the greatest wines of the world, but for most people they are 'way over the top in price', and this is one of the biggest reasons why Australian wines have made such an impact of the world markets.

cheers
anthony

[JamieBahrain]

Fair go gentleman!

15 years ago the wines on Mrs Robinson's list were barely heard of;most in evolution. Clonakilla a case point. In a relatively short time this wine probably outperforms Cote Rotie in a similar price bracket.

I think we have come a long way in a relative short time.

Croser's statement a pursuit of excellence? Great wines on great tables not produced overnight. The next step in the evolution of our wine industry will, odds on, produce the wines Croser desires. The process will be full of trial and tribulation- consumer phases, Parkerisation, economics etc.

[Guest]

However, whilst the 'old world' does make some mind-blowing wines it is the case of two extremes. You can rarely buy 'good' to 'very good' wines from France without paying a small fortune. Here in Aus, it is the exact opposite. You cab buy some really good wines from $20 to $50....

Well, this isn't quite true. Cellar prices in Europe are typically 50-70% less than Oz prices. Believe it or not, you can get some amazing wines for 20-30 Euros - yes, even from Burgundy!

For example, a typical Chateauneuf-du-papes will cost about 20-25 Euros at the cellar; a premier cru Chassagne Montrechet about 30 Euros; a premier cru chablis about 20 Euros; a village Givry, less than 20 Euros; an auslese reisling from the MSR, less than 20 Euros; a grand cru Alsace wine, also less than 20 Euros; and a gran reserva Rioja, about 20-25 Euros.

Remember, wines you pay $40 for in Oz will often (though not always) cost the equivalent of $70-80 in North America or Europe!

I agree that Old World wines aren't cheap in Oz, but they are reasonable in the Old World!

[GraemeG]

I would be inclined to say "Croser doesn't make enough great wine"...
That 79 Cab-Shiraz was pretty good, but then he spent most of the next 15 years getting it wrong...!

cheers,
Graeme

[JamieBahrain]

Guest

I agree with your reference to the amazingly affordable Grand Cru ( especially Alsace ) in France.

Is it a WET issue?

In Hermitage, amongst many of Frances' high profile shiraz, Jasper Hill Georgia's Paddock is cheaper than it is in Heathcote!