Wendouree questions

Alan Rath · Post by **Alan Rath** » Thu Dec 18, 2003 2:39 pm

From reading here, I know that Wendouree wines are highly prized, and tough to find. I've never seen them up here in the States, but there are now a few residing in a local shop. Wonder if anyone can give me a brief tutorial on the style, ageability, opinions on vintage? I see vintages ranging from 96-2001, and 5 different wines: Cabernet, Cabernet/Malbec, Shiraz, Shiraz/Malbec, Shiraz/Mataro. Prices are not cheap (US$60 for most, with the Shiraz at $80).

If I were to take a flier with one of these, any opinions on which to go after first? Thanks much,

Alan

Justin B. · Post by **Justin B.** » Thu Dec 18, 2003 5:37 pm

Amazing how these wines end up in a USA shop. All vintages of these wines are worth hunting, though 96 & 98 are the obvious standouts. These wine are only available from mailing list, so your wines have been bought from someone on the mailing list. The wines are all very very good and very rare. They need many years of good cellaring and will easily live for 20 years. Mailing list prices are approx. US$25, but are undoubtable sold at below their real value. Secondary values (if you can find the wines) are instantly double the mailing list prices, ie. US$40-50. Given the wines available to you have bene cellared and shipped, then the prices are not to bad. These are very good wines if you like a very big style. If you open at less than 10 years of age, then give them at least 24 hours of breathing.

Other members will know which varieties are preferred, though the 96 shiraz mataro I tried this year was exceptional after a lot of breathing. The shiraz and cabernet are the most popular.

Go for it.

Gerard Connors · Post by **Gerard Connors** » Thu Dec 18, 2003 8:51 pm

Dear Alan,

I am a huge fan of Wendouree wines and they are indeed extremely rare and sought after. The style is quite unique - incredible fruit concentration from 100+ yr old vines, formidable tannin structure, higher acid than most RP style wines and modest (13.5-14%) alcohol and modest oak. They are very big wines but not in the same sense as Noon, Greenock Creek (which I also love) etc - ie they are NOT immediately accessible. Nevertheless, I'd imagine the 96 would be your best bet for now - generally the varietal Shiraz is considered their best wine (one of only 7 wines in the Langtons top classification along with Grange, HOG, Mt Mary, 707, Moss Wood and LEAS Chardonnay - if that gives you an idea of the esteem with which it is held). The cabernet malbec is my personal favourite. The two shiraz blends are probably more accessible at this stage. Finally, a word of caution - the Clare Valley and Wendouree in particularly can feature a lot of "mint"/"eucalypt" flavours - this is part of the terroir and I love it but some people don't.

If they look like the provenance is OK, I'd definitely go for a bottle!

Cheers

Ged

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Fri Dec 19, 2003 1:36 am

Hi Alan

I have found the cabernet malbec comes together after a few years and is the most "approachable" Wendouree in youth.

By a bottle of 98 shiraz for the cellar and for a wine experience, a bottle of 96 to try now. Try over a few days and let us all know how it goes.

Adair · Post by **Adair** » Fri Dec 19, 2003 10:00 am

Gerard Connors wrote:The style is quite unique - incredible fruit concentration from 100+ yr old vines, formidable tannin structure, higher acid than most RP style wines and modest (13.5-14%) alcohol and modest oak. They are very big wines but not in the same sense as Noon, Greenock Creek (which I also love) etc - ie they are NOT immediately accessible.

Just wanted to highlight the fact that the term "big" is not used with Wendouree in the same sense as other "big" Australian wines. These wines do not have a smooth, creamy, glycerine texture. They are very dry but "big" in terms of fruit power. Do not hesitate to decant any of the wines you buy for numerous hours before drinking. Some argue that Wendouree wines have the greatest cellaring potential of all Australian wines, including the Grange. I, however, have no idea as I have only had 2001s!

Also, I have obviously never had a 1996 or 1998 Wendouree but in the Clare Valley, 1998 is considered a much, much better year than 1996. Indeed, in 1996, the Clare Valley was probably South Australia's worst performing region for reds.

Adair

Red Bigot · Post by **Red Bigot** » Fri Dec 19, 2003 6:32 pm

Anonymous wrote:I have found the cabernet malbec comes together after a few years and is the most "approachable" Wendouree in youth.

Anon: Are you sure you mean the cab-malbec? This wine usually has the most prominent tannins of all the Wendourees, I start looking at mine around 10 yo. I find the Shiraz blends generally softer and more approachable when younger.

Alan: I mostly buy the Shiraz and cab-malbec, sometimes the cabernet and much less frequently the Shiraz blends. These wines are built for the long haul, 10-20 years or more depending on your tastes. They are not barossa-style blockbusters and can have quite fierce acid and tannins showing when young. All of them and the cabernet in particular can have a pretty high level of mint character when young, they are not green, just very menthol/minty. If you don't like this character be careful and perhaps try the shiraz or shiraz blends, they don't have quite as much. The character always remains, but usually becomes less dominant with age.

Clare and the Wendourees follow pretty well on general vintage conditions for Barossa, so 96 and 98 are very good for all of them, 97 probably the least of the vintages in the range. The 2001 reds are pretty good, esp the shiraz and cab-malbec again.

For an interesting comparison in styles, if you can get hold of any Tim Adams Aberfeldy Shiraz 2001, compare to the Wendouree Shiraz 2001 and note the differences in style from wines made from grapes in neighbouring vineyards. The Aberfeldy richer and more generous with fruit, the Wendouree leaner and relatively closed, but with staying-power clearly evident.

The 90 Cab-Malbec is just entering it's drinking window for my taste, delightful wine. 96 and 98 should be fairly similar.

Alan Rath · Post by **Alan Rath** » Sat Dec 20, 2003 3:16 am

Thanks to all for the very useful feedback. All for naught, unfortunately, since when I went to order the wines it turns out they had sold every bottle already. This is the most elusive Australian wine I've come across!

Brian, thanks for the comments. I do have Aberfeldy going back to 96, but haven't seen the 2001 up here yet. It definitely will be available here, is the 2001 one I should keep a lookout for? I haven't opened any of the other is some time. From your description, am I making a mistake in holding these instead of drinking now?

Cheers,
Alan

Red Bigot · Post by **Red Bigot** » Sat Dec 20, 2003 8:47 am

Alan,

Sorry you missed the Wendourees, they are pretty distinctive and interesting wines.

Don't worry about your older Aberfeldys, they are 10-15 year wines in my book. The 2001 is very good, I was just suggesting you compare to the Wendouree for a contrast in styles as young wines, many people at the tasting group where this happened preferred the richer, more oaky style of the Tim Adams, it is more approachable in it's youth than the Wendouree Shiraz, but it will probably be tiring when the Wendouree is just getting into it's peak drinking window.

Alan Rath · Post by **Alan Rath** » Sat Dec 20, 2003 9:07 am

Brian,

Since you point out that the Aberfeldy is richer, and more oak dominated, would the Wendouree style be more along the lines of, say, the St Henri Shiraz? (at least in terms of tannin and oak)

Alan

Red Bigot · Post by **Red Bigot** » Sat Dec 20, 2003 10:25 am

Alan,

I wouldn't consider the St Henri and Wendourees very similar, although they both are somewhat 'old-fashioned' styles and mature very well. The Wendourees are much more muscular, firm tannins can be a bit daunting to some (not rb's though :-)

) even at 10 yo.

There is a degree of similarity perhaps in that each relies on structure and developing complexity with age rather than overt fruit tarted up with nice oak (nothing wrong with that style if it's in balance). I seldom like St Henri when young, especially if tasted with more overt wines, but I always kick myself for not buying more when friends trot out 15 yo examples in their prime.

I don't know much about the oak treatment for Wendouree, it's certainly not an obvious feature, the Wendourees really are special and unique to many people, but not to everyone's liking I'm sure. Indeed they may not appeal to those who prefer the more approachable, rich, sweet fruit/oak cocktails seemingly beloved of some of the US drinkers of Oz reds.