just recieved my mailer for the 2004 reds and 2005 whites
has anybody seen any reviews as yet. Prices are the same as last year.
Mount Mary Mailer
Mount Mary Mailer
Drink the wine, not the label.
-
bacchaebabe
- Posts: 1222
- Joined: Fri Aug 15, 2003 5:04 pm
- Location: Sydney
It does usually arrive later on in the year. I wonder if its early because of the problems they had last year with shipping the wines which with many customers they couldn't do untill this year do to the unavailability of Couriers around Christmas time.
I already sent my order in for some Triolet, Chard and Quintet. Gave Pinot a miss though as I just splashed out on Bindi's which I feel are better value and I have some of last years in the cellar.
I already sent my order in for some Triolet, Chard and Quintet. Gave Pinot a miss though as I just splashed out on Bindi's which I feel are better value and I have some of last years in the cellar.
Sorry to drag up this post again, but went to a tasting today of Mount Mary 05 whites and 04 reds. I have never tried any MM wines before - bit out of the price range of a student I am afraid!
I appreciate that these wines are made for long-term cellaring, so tasting this early is a bit unfair for them, but there seemed to be little to pin any hope on even. There was nothing in the wines potential to inspire me to part with my (limited) money for the prices being asked.
Triolet was disappointing for the effort taken with barrel fermentation and lees stirring.
Chardonnay oak was elegant, they did well to go with zero MLF, but the acid was pathetic as opposed to the "refreshing" that JO used to describe it. Not sure it has the acid to last the cellaring distance.
Quintet had plenty of plum and cherry aroma, but the palate was dominated by green, sappy characters (from the 16% Cab Franc maybe?). Perhaps those green characters will subside with time.
Pinot Noir was the redeemer that saved the day for me - abundant cherry and strawberry aroma and a palate that I believe will only become more interesting in coming years.
Sorry to sledge, but I was just amazed that after all the hype, I was disappointed. I will save my money for another day...or some more Bindi perhaps.
I appreciate that these wines are made for long-term cellaring, so tasting this early is a bit unfair for them, but there seemed to be little to pin any hope on even. There was nothing in the wines potential to inspire me to part with my (limited) money for the prices being asked.
Triolet was disappointing for the effort taken with barrel fermentation and lees stirring.
Chardonnay oak was elegant, they did well to go with zero MLF, but the acid was pathetic as opposed to the "refreshing" that JO used to describe it. Not sure it has the acid to last the cellaring distance.
Quintet had plenty of plum and cherry aroma, but the palate was dominated by green, sappy characters (from the 16% Cab Franc maybe?). Perhaps those green characters will subside with time.
Pinot Noir was the redeemer that saved the day for me - abundant cherry and strawberry aroma and a palate that I believe will only become more interesting in coming years.
Sorry to sledge, but I was just amazed that after all the hype, I was disappointed. I will save my money for another day...or some more Bindi perhaps.
Wine Girl,
You have misread these wines completely. I've been tasting MM wines at cellar door for about a decade now, and the current releases are as good as any I've tasted. They're always difficult to pick when young, but I'm getting used to watching these wines develop after tasting at cellar door, and am starting to get an idea of what to look for. I'm very surprised by your suggestion the Quintet was green - sure it has some tannic bite being such a young cabernet, but it certainly didn't come across as under ripe. Have you tasted many classed young Bordeaux before?
Out of interest, where did you taste these???
You have misread these wines completely. I've been tasting MM wines at cellar door for about a decade now, and the current releases are as good as any I've tasted. They're always difficult to pick when young, but I'm getting used to watching these wines develop after tasting at cellar door, and am starting to get an idea of what to look for. I'm very surprised by your suggestion the Quintet was green - sure it has some tannic bite being such a young cabernet, but it certainly didn't come across as under ripe. Have you tasted many classed young Bordeaux before?
Out of interest, where did you taste these???
HenryL wrote:Has anyone in Sydney received their wine yet? I noticed my credit card had been debited a few weeks ago but they have not arrived yet.
Cheers
Henry
I am in Melbourne and have not received my wine yet although I have seen on various forums that some have. My card was debited on Oct 20. I rang the week before last just to get an idea of delivery and was told that they send Pert and Adelaide first and that Melbourne was starting last Monday but not sure of Sydney? I will give them about a week then make another call.
Gasman wrote:Wine Girl,
You have misread these wines completely.
Is that a correct assertion, or have you misread Wine Girls opinion for fact?
Gasman wrote:I've been tasting MM wines at cellar door for about a decade now, and the current releases are as good as any I've tasted.
That's great, but that is your opinion and I don't see anybody telling you that you have misread these wines.
So, let's take the personal sledging out of the forum and all enjoy a bit of debate without the harsh critique.
Ciao,
michaelw
You know it makes sense!
michaelw
You know it makes sense!
Gasman,
As michaelw pointed out, my comments are my (educated) opinion and I am not claiming them to be anything more.
The main point I was making was the skewed relationship between price and quality/reputation - for those wines, I was disappointed for the price being asked and was not willing to part with my limited money. I did not claim they were faulty/poorly-made wines.
I tasted the wines at the Prince Wine Store in Sth Melbourne - free tasting last Saturday. I am surprised that being a wine enthusiast living in Melbourne you were unaware of it. You are fortunate to have been given 10 cellar door tastings given that MM do not have a regular cellar door - did you have private tastings?
Wine Girl
As michaelw pointed out, my comments are my (educated) opinion and I am not claiming them to be anything more.
The main point I was making was the skewed relationship between price and quality/reputation - for those wines, I was disappointed for the price being asked and was not willing to part with my limited money. I did not claim they were faulty/poorly-made wines.
I tasted the wines at the Prince Wine Store in Sth Melbourne - free tasting last Saturday. I am surprised that being a wine enthusiast living in Melbourne you were unaware of it. You are fortunate to have been given 10 cellar door tastings given that MM do not have a regular cellar door - did you have private tastings?
Wine Girl
This thread raises an interesting subject, tasting wine for long term drinking compared to current consumption.
There are wines designed to do both in this modern era and I believe it’s easy to get palate confusion. I find it much more difficult to turn my palate toward what the potential of a wine will be at its peak in 5, 10 or 20 years when so much wine produced today is designed for relatively early consumption.
This is the case for Mount Mary; they are simply not designed for immediate, short term drinking. I’ve tried the current release twice now, on Saturday at the Price -stumbled in while looking for a polling station, easily distracted, and at the winery two weeks ago. The only wine that immediately impressed me was the Chardonnay, but I have no doubt the Cab will be excellent in 10-15 years time. I say this with some confidence as I’ve been cellaring these wines for 23 years. Seldom have they stuck me as knockout wines when tasted at release, but with time, they rarely fail to impress.
So I can understand Wine Girls reticence with the wines tasted and at $85/btl, it’s a great leap of faith.
So this is the challenge for us consumers, what will improve with age and what won’t. It’s so much harder to do now due to the large number of wines that are made to be appealing in their youth. Suffice to say, I’m content with the bottles of Mount Mary Quintet and Pinot slowly developing in my cellar.
cheers
Ian
There are wines designed to do both in this modern era and I believe it’s easy to get palate confusion. I find it much more difficult to turn my palate toward what the potential of a wine will be at its peak in 5, 10 or 20 years when so much wine produced today is designed for relatively early consumption.
This is the case for Mount Mary; they are simply not designed for immediate, short term drinking. I’ve tried the current release twice now, on Saturday at the Price -stumbled in while looking for a polling station, easily distracted, and at the winery two weeks ago. The only wine that immediately impressed me was the Chardonnay, but I have no doubt the Cab will be excellent in 10-15 years time. I say this with some confidence as I’ve been cellaring these wines for 23 years. Seldom have they stuck me as knockout wines when tasted at release, but with time, they rarely fail to impress.
So I can understand Wine Girls reticence with the wines tasted and at $85/btl, it’s a great leap of faith.
So this is the challenge for us consumers, what will improve with age and what won’t. It’s so much harder to do now due to the large number of wines that are made to be appealing in their youth. Suffice to say, I’m content with the bottles of Mount Mary Quintet and Pinot slowly developing in my cellar.
cheers
Ian
Michael - I'm not sure why you thought my comments were "sledging" or "harsh". I'm simply offering an opinion backed up by significant experience with these wines (as has another poster, irregular). As Wine Girl stated, this was her first experience tasting MM wines, and they are notoriously difficult to pick when young. I don't think there was anything to "misread" in wine girls opinion - it was fairly straightforward. She thought the wines were overpriced and would not age well. Period. I disagree, and backed that up with my experience in tasting these wines at cellar door compared with tasting aged bottles over time. I'm still not sure what part of that post is "sledging".
Wine girl, I don't discount that you're disappointed with the wines for the price, my problem was you're suggestion that there "seemed little to pin any hope on". Such a judgement requires experience with the wines ability to age, and as 'irregular' mentioned they really do need this time to reach their full potential. By the way, I taste the wines every year at the annual release at cellar door (the only time the cellar door is open to the public, and only for those on the mailing list). Some bad news this year was that the recent frosts wiped out 90% of the 2007 vintage. Might not be a commercial release of any '07 wines subsequently.
Wine girl, I don't discount that you're disappointed with the wines for the price, my problem was you're suggestion that there "seemed little to pin any hope on". Such a judgement requires experience with the wines ability to age, and as 'irregular' mentioned they really do need this time to reach their full potential. By the way, I taste the wines every year at the annual release at cellar door (the only time the cellar door is open to the public, and only for those on the mailing list). Some bad news this year was that the recent frosts wiped out 90% of the 2007 vintage. Might not be a commercial release of any '07 wines subsequently.
Wine Girl wrote:Gasman,
As michaelw pointed out, my comments are my (educated) opinion and I am not claiming them to be anything more.
The main point I was making was the skewed relationship between price and quality/reputation - for those wines, I was disappointed for the price being asked and was not willing to part with my limited money. I did not claim they were faulty/poorly-made wines.
I tasted the wines at the Prince Wine Store in Sth Melbourne - free tasting last Saturday. I am surprised that being a wine enthusiast living in Melbourne you were unaware of it. You are fortunate to have been given 10 cellar door tastings given that MM do not have a regular cellar door - did you have private tastings?
Wine Girl
MM do open the cellar door for a couple of weeks a year for mail list members to taste the wines (never been - it's a hell of a drive from my place). Don't know if the mailing list is open - a phone call would provide an answer.
Your point on the price is fair enough I guess - presumably they would contend that supply/demand says it is not unreasonable, and that certainly the wines are not made to be drunk young, so ought not be expected to show well (irrespective of what Robert Parker says about great wines young!) at this age.
Moreover, unlike some johnny-come-lately with some contracted fruit from a Barossa vineyard and a lot of new oak, MM do have 30-odd years experience with their vineyard and doubtless a back library of wines that demonstrate true 'improvement' with age. IF you think the aged examples are worth the fuss, and you're confident that the estate is improving not declining over the years, then you buy new vintages with some confidence at least.
If you're someone who's not especially interested in cellaring wines for a long time, then best to avoid MM and find something else. Similarly, if even old MM wines do nothing for you, then you'd be silly to buy them young when they're less attractive still. It's not a style that suits everyone, nor would the late Dr John have thought it did, I suspect.
Actually, $85 is not that much really. I'd be more fearful of Run Rig or Astralis or - god help us all, recent Ch Pavie at A$800+ - ever living up to their promises than I would concerning the mostly minor and cultish enthusiasm surrounding Mount Mary.
cheers,
Graeme
Last edited by GraemeG on Wed Nov 29, 2006 1:42 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Gasman wrote:Wine Girl,
You have misread these wines completely. I've been tasting MM wines at cellar door for about a decade now, and the current releases are as good as any I've tasted. They're always difficult to pick when young, but I'm getting used to watching these wines develop after tasting at cellar door, and am starting to get an idea of what to look for. I'm very surprised by your suggestion the Quintet was green - sure it has some tannic bite being such a young cabernet, but it certainly didn't come across as under ripe. Have you tasted many classed young Bordeaux before?
Out of interest, where did you taste these???
Are you suggesting that MM taste like "classed young Bordeux"?
GraemeG wrote:Wine Girl wrote:Gasman,
As michaelw pointed out, my comments are my (educated) opinion and I am not claiming them to be anything more.
The main point I was making was the skewed relationship between price and quality/reputation - for those wines, I was disappointed for the price being asked and was not willing to part with my limited money. I did not claim they were faulty/poorly-made wines.
I tasted the wines at the Prince Wine Store in Sth Melbourne - free tasting last Saturday. I am surprised that being a wine enthusiast living in Melbourne you were unaware of it. You are fortunate to have been given 10 cellar door tastings given that MM do not have a regular cellar door - did you have private tastings?
Wine Girl
MM do open the cellar door for a couple of weeks a year for mail list members to taste the wines (never been - it's a hell of a drive from my place). Don't know if the mailing list is open - a phone call would provide an answer.
Your point on the price is fair enough I guess - presumably they would contend that supply/demand says it is not unreasonable, and that certainly the wines are not made to be drunk young, so ought not be expected to show well (irrespective of what Robert Parker says about great wines young!) at this age.
Moreover, unlike some johnny-come-lately with some contracted fruit from a Barossa vineyard and a lot of new oak, MM do have 30-odd years experience with their vineyard and doubtless a back library of wines that demonstrate true 'improvement' with age. IF you think the aged examples are worth the fuss, and you're confident that the estate is improving not declining over the years, then you buy new vintages with some confidence at least.
If you're someone who's not especially interested in cellaring wines for a long time, then best to avoid MM and find something else. Similarly, if even old MM wines do nothing for you, then you'd be silly to buy them young when they're less attractive still. It's not a style that suits everyone, nor would the late Dr John have thought it did, I suspect.
Actually, $85 is not that much really. I'd be more fearful of Run Rig or Astralis or - god help us all, recent Ch Pavie at A$800+ - ever living up to their promises than I would concerning the mostly minor and cultish enthusiasm surrounding Mount Mary.
cheers,
Graeme
Well said Graeme!
chillwrx wrote:Gasman wrote:Wine Girl,
You have misread these wines completely. I've been tasting MM wines at cellar door for about a decade now, and the current releases are as good as any I've tasted. They're always difficult to pick when young, but I'm getting used to watching these wines develop after tasting at cellar door, and am starting to get an idea of what to look for. I'm very surprised by your suggestion the Quintet was green - sure it has some tannic bite being such a young cabernet, but it certainly didn't come across as under ripe. Have you tasted many classed young Bordeaux before?
Out of interest, where did you taste these???
Are you suggesting that MM taste like "classed young Bordeux"?
There are similarities in structure and flavour profile, and many an experienced taster has mistaken MM quintet for classed Bordeaux, both young and old. My point in asking this question was that both can be tight and tannic in youth - appearing poorly fruited or even "green".
Minotaur wrote:Has anyone in Sydney received their MM order yet?
No, but I see in past years I've rarely received the delivery before December. One came on Nov 23 2001, but others were Dec 11 2003, Dec 14 2005, Dec 18 2000, Dec 18 1998. I missed the odd year due to no money and/or change of address, but it's usually in December some time.
cheers,
Graeme
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Baby Chickpea
- Posts: 582
- Joined: Mon Feb 02, 2004 12:17 pm
GraemeG wrote:
No, but I see in past years I've rarely received the delivery before December. One came on Nov 23 2001, but others were Dec 11 2003, Dec 14 2005, Dec 18 2000, Dec 18 1998. I missed the odd year due to no money and/or change of address, but it's usually in December some time.
cheers,
Graeme
You keep a record of delivery dates?
Danny
The voyage of discovery lies not in finding new landscapes but in having new eyes. We must never be afraid to go too far, for success lies just beyond - Marcel Proust
The voyage of discovery lies not in finding new landscapes but in having new eyes. We must never be afraid to go too far, for success lies just beyond - Marcel Proust
Baby Chickpea wrote:GraemeG wrote:
No, but I see in past years I've rarely received the delivery before December. One came on Nov 23 2001, but others were Dec 11 2003, Dec 14 2005, Dec 18 2000, Dec 18 1998. I missed the odd year due to no money and/or change of address, but it's usually in December some time.
cheers,
Graeme
You keep a record of delivery dates?
I don't use Cellar-tracker, but in my own little cellar spreadsheet I have a column for "purchase date", which tends to mean 'delivery date' for cellar door purchases. So it's easy enough to find...
cheers,
Graeme
Baby Chickpea wrote:GraemeG wrote:
No, but I see in past years I've rarely received the delivery before December. One came on Nov 23 2001, but others were Dec 11 2003, Dec 14 2005, Dec 18 2000, Dec 18 1998. I missed the odd year due to no money and/or change of address, but it's usually in December some time.
cheers,
Graeme
You keep a record of delivery dates?
Danny,
It's the accountant coming out in Graeme!
Ciao,
michaelw
You know it makes sense!
michaelw
You know it makes sense!