Peel Estate Latest Offerings, and those screw caps again

[Davo]

Lovely day here in Perth so the boss and I decided a quick drive in the country to pick up fresh farm produce was in order.

Baldivis Estate was closed up tighter than a fish's clacker valve, and looked about as used as a Pom's shower. Why is this so Mr Carapetis?

Peel Estate was the next stop. New on the counter were:-

2003 Premium White (Under Stelvin, more about this later)

A Sem/Sav Blanc blend demonstrating fresh varietal fruit flavours with the sem dominant. A nice refreshing fruit driven wine.

2003 Verdelho

A quite superb wine. Lovely tropical fruit and spice nose with more of the same on the palate, plety of acid in support, and a very pleasant finish. One of the best examples of this varietal I have had in a while.

2002 Chardonnay

Hmmm. Not my scene I am afraid. A too much wine for me. Too much wood and too much malo. But having said that it is certainly not the worst of its type I have tasted.

1999 Chenin Blanc "Wood Matured"

Developing quite nice honey characters but the fruit is quite muted and the oak is in dominance. Perhaps going through a "dumb" phase as I remeber it being a lot better than this.

2002 Premium Red "Pichet" (Also under Stelvin)

Not tasted as I have had it before. Usually represents excellent value as a quaffer.

2000 Cabernet Sauvignon

Great colour and blackcurrant nose with hints of green capsicum. Similar palate with all in balance in a surprisingly light body. Lovely soft tannins and good length but not quite up to the 1999 for mine.

1999 Shiraz

Inky colour. Soft white pepper and blackberry with gobs of sweet chocolate greet the nose. Lovely intense mouth filling fruit flavours with silky soft grippy tannins and subtle spicey French oak with a mid to full body precede a very long finish which is all fruit. Could be the best shiraz out of his stable for a while and wait to see what it will be like in 5 to 6 years with eager anticipation.

1999 Zinfandel

The 1997 was sensational. No 1998 was made due to crop damage.

The 1999 is sensational. A huge wine but so well balanced it is a delight to drink now. Huge brambly berry fruits with soft tannins and a huge finish. Brilliant stuff.

1999 Vintage Port

Made from mostly Touriga (? Nacionale), with the rest made up by Tinta Ciao and Amarela. A delightfully lighter and fruitier style than most Oz VPs yet has the potential to age well. Bloody good stuff.


Now as to Peel Estate and Stelvins.

Peel are delighted with their move to Stelvin, for their rapid turnover quaffing style wines only. Will,as reported by his CD manager, does not think the proof is there when it comes to bottling premium wines expected to sit in the bottle for any length of time. The ageing of wine is an oxidative process which is inhibited by a perfect seal. He would prefer to have bottle variation than no variation and wines that have not aged the way he expects them to.

He is also happy that increased use of Stelvins will reduce the amount of cork required by the wine industry as more and more short shelf life wines are bottled under it and making more better quality cork available for the bottling of premium wines.

And Murray, I did not go out looking for this because prior to today I had no idea Peel Estate were even contemplating ROTE closures.

[TORB]

Davo,

No matter what you position is on this subject, this example shows that even many of the (experienced) winemakers are not 100% convinced. Now these experienced winemakers should be the 'experts' on the subject so what hope do us normal mortals have of understanding the intricacies of how wines age from a scientific perspective if they can not agree.

Cheers
Ric

[Murray]

thanks for the report Davo, and please note, it's not about me, it's about the wine, as it always should be.

[Rob]

Vive la Cork

[GraemeG]

Davo,

Now these experienced winemakers should be the 'experts' on the subject ...

Ric, I'm not so sure about that. Perhaps the odd winemaker is an expert in packaging, but I would imagine that unless the winemaker has long-term experience with the same wines he's going to really be none the wiser. If you as winemaker inherit back stocks of wines in screwcap, how are you going to know what they tasted like at bottling time? Similarly, if you bottled wine in screwcap at your last employer, but have since moved on, how are you going to know about the development of those wines?

People like Middleton, Grosset, Mast, Carrodus - they've had years of experience with the same vines and wines. I'd have some confidence about their ability to talk knowledgably about the difference in their wines after years under different closures. I would hope they're at least doing trials under screwcaps, but sadly, I don't think that is the case (Grosset excepted, obviously). I recall Dr Middleton complaining via newsletter at considerable lengths some years ago about the quality of corks he was receiving, despite paying top dollar. (He found Bordeaux wines suffering the same TCA problems). Why he would simply write-off alternatives without exploring the subject baffles me.

I suspect the reason that a lot of top-priced wineries haven't made the switch (or even investigated alternatives) is a combination of tradition, snobbery & wealth. Tradition because the cork has such a long history. Snobbery because there was always a stigma against wine sealed in other ways - mostly because it was rubbish wine. Wealth because the sort of people buying Chateau Latour (generally) aren't worried by the cost of written off bottles. And the Chateau could always suggest that storage conditions are responsible for wine showing badly. So why would they change? Unless they were simply annoyed themselves by the amount of their own cellared wine they had to dump when doing public verticals. It's about percieved image. If the public can't see it, it won't worry the winery. Moet have no problem sealing Dom Perignon under a crown cap when it's in their underground drives. But they wouldn't dream of selling it like that.
You buy Latour or Dom in a restaurant to impress a partner (business or otherwise) and you want to look good. You sniff the cork. You'd have to be game or knowledgeable (both, really) to send it back if you think it's corked. And somehow, I suspect an awful lot of Latour and Dom is drunk by people who wouldn't know a corked wine if it bit their bum. So, not much incentive for the flag-bearers of the industry to change. It's Rockford, Rousseau, Ridge - the artisans, the craftsmen, who are/should lead the charge against faulty corks...

cheers,
Graeme

[Adam]

Moet have no problem sealing Dom Perignon under a crown cap when it's in their underground drives. But they wouldn't dream of selling it like that.

Just thinking about it....could they sell a sparkling under screwcap? how would the pressure work with removing the seal? would the cap get projected across the room as you removed it?

[Davo]

Graham, uou make some interesting comments.

Perhaps the odd winemaker is an expert in packaging, but I would imagine that unless the winemaker has long-term experience with the same wines he's going to really be none the wiser. If you as winemaker inherit back stocks of wines in screwcap, how are you going to know what they tasted like at bottling time? Similarly, if you bottled wine in screwcap at your last employer, but have since moved on, how are you going to know about the development of those wines?

Will Nairn has been making wines at Peel for 30 years and I suspect he know his wines fairly well. Also I think you will find that most, if not all wine makers have a fairly good idea of other wines around and how they age as everyone I have ever met that is involved in the industry undertakes comparative tastings on a regular basis.

I suspect the reason that a lot of top-priced wineries haven't made the switch (or even investigated alternatives) is a combination of tradition, snobbery & wealth. Tradition because the cork has such a long history. Snobbery because there was always a stigma against wine sealed in other ways - mostly because it was rubbish wine.

If cork was such a huge problem to the wine industry they would swap to an alternative closure in a flash. Buyer resistance would be short lived as the only alternative would be to stop drinking wine.

Moet have no problem sealing Dom Perignon under a crown cap when it's in their underground drives. But they wouldn't dream of selling it like that.

Um, all sparkling wines are kept under crown caps while they age on lees prior to disgorgement, dosage, and sealing under cork and mulletage.













































































































cheers,
Graeme[/quote]

[ChrisH]

Will Nairn is supposed to have said :

"The ageing of wine is an oxidative process which is inhibited by a perfect seal. He would prefer to have bottle variation than no variation and wines that have not aged the way he expects them to. "

What absolute rubbish. We have been through all this before so why does this claptrap keep coming up ?

The ageing process occurs with the air that is in the bottle once sealed. Air should not be passing through the cork, around the cork or past the cork if the seal is doing its job properly.

As for the alleged comments that he would prefer bottle variation that no variation - WHAT ??!!


regards
Chris

[jezza]

Moet have no problem sealing Dom Perignon under a crown cap when it's in their underground drives. But they wouldn't dream of selling it like that.

Um, all sparkling wines are kept under crown caps while they age on lees prior to disgorgement, dosage, and sealing under cork and mulletage. cheers,
Graeme

[/quote]

This does raises an interesting question though, I've had a few Bollinger RD 1988 (which was drinking supberbly until recently) which was apparently disgorged in 1999 (I think), do they seal these under Crown for the duration (10 odd years). Do they have problems with reduction and does it prevent the wine from aging in comparison if it were sealed under cork for that period? Surely these Champange houses have done comparitive tastings over the years.

[Jeremy]

I've been a fan of screwcaps and I still am. Indeed, all the riesling I buy is now under screwcap and if it's not under screwcap, I don't buy it. I'm a screwcap nazi.

But in the past I have said things like "no other industry would accept a 10% failure rate". But here, in public, I'd like to retract that statement. I've recently moved house, to a new area, and the house itself has 10% more faults than I'd realised (or had been promised) on purchase, and more to the point, every single hunk of meat that I've bought from the butchers in this area has been, I believe, faulty. I can't find decent steak, decent lamb, or decent beef anywhere around here, and the fruit shops! Well. Flowery apples. Mangoes that are brown when you cut them open. Bananas that I wouldn't feed to a monkey. It seems to me that foodstuffs, in general, accept a WAY HIGHER rate of failure than 10%, which starts to make cork look bloody good. If you accept that wine is a foodstuff, then in its own class it's starting to look pretty good under cork. It should be noted that I have never considered returning a slab of steak to the butcher on the grounds, alone, that it was bloody tough, and bloody expensive for such tough rubbish, which puts returning corked wine in perspective too (I bought $38 worth of steak for a dinner on St night, and it was all rubbish IMHO).

Which isn't a defence of cork. I am still a stelvin nazi. But it does put things in perspective. And it does suggest to me that once the cork battle is won, we then need to work on butchers/fruit shops etc etc. They're out of control.

Jeremy.

[Davo]

What absolute rubbish. We have been through all this before so why does this claptrap keep coming up ?

The ageing process occurs with the air that is in the bottle once sealed. Air should not be passing through the cork, around the cork or past the cork if the seal is doing its job properly.

Chris, please don' take this personally, but you are sprouting absolute crap. The very best of corks supply an airtight environment in the bottle underneath them. The very worst leak from day one and continue to leak forever. The very best of corks remain intact, the very worst crumble and fall to pieces. Somewhere in the middle across a range are the rest of the corks.

Ask yourself this. Why does ullage occur if the cork is a perfect seal.

The average cork is an average, and not perfect, seal.

As for the alleged comments that he would prefer bottle variation that no variation - WHAT ??!!

If you are going to quote at least quote fully and correctly.

So you would prefer to have no bottle variation and each bottle in your carefully cellared dozen demonstrating perfect and identical reductive faults.

I have been drinking Peel Estate wines for a long time and I can count on 1 hand the number of faulty bottles that I could blame on cork.

When you have been in the industry as long as Will, and are turning out wines as good on on as regular a basis I may value your opinion as well.

[MartinC]

Davo,

Thanks for the notes. IMO the best wine fr their Est. is their Chenin/B., probrably the best in AUS. It's a red wine drinker's white wine(Ric should give it a go... )
Cheap, complexed & alcoholic.

Rgds,

[GraemeG]

But in the past I have said things like "no other industry would accept a 10% failure rate". But here, in public, I'd like to retract that statement. I've recently moved house, to a new area, and the house itself has 10% more faults than I'd realised (or had been promised) on purchase, and more to the point, every single hunk of meat that I've bought from the butchers in this area has been, I believe, faulty. I can't find decent steak, decent lamb, or decent beef anywhere around here, and the fruit shops! Well. Flowery apples. Mangoes that are brown when you cut them open. Bananas that I wouldn't feed to a monkey. It seems to me that foodstuffs, in general, accept a WAY HIGHER rate of failure than 10%, which starts to make cork look bloody good. If you accept that wine is a foodstuff, then in its own class it's starting to look pretty good under cork. It should be noted that I have never considered returning a slab of steak to the butcher on the grounds, alone, that it was bloody tough, and bloody expensive for such tough rubbish, which puts returning corked wine in perspective too (I bought $38 worth of steak for a dinner on St night, and it was all rubbish IMHO).
Jeremy.

I like that passion! But, it has to be said, complex 'packages' like houses and motor cars are not really apt comparisons. In general, one fault with one component does not render the 'whole' useless. (although the increasing dependence of motor cars on electronics is flirting with danger) Moreover, in the case of those items, the fault can usually repaired - it's just shoddy workmanship - no less acceptable I grant you, but of a different magnitude.

As for the food - it's a bit of a mix. Sometimes the price is a giveaway - sometimes you can tell the produce is rubbish just by looking at it. But sometimes, inevitably, you are robbed. The difference is - it's the product, not the packaging. 10% error rate in the packaging that gets to the consumer is pretty much still a record. Particularly if it's a fault that renders the product (the wine) undrinkable. Sure, the milk carton opening technique is dependent on the guy getting the glue settings right on the sealing machine, and it doesn't always work. It's an irritation to the consumer trying to get the thing open. But even if it's a mess in the end, the milk is still drinkable. Would that the same could be said of a corked wine...

cheers,
Graeme

[GraemeG]

I've had a few Bollinger RD 1988 (which was drinking supberbly until recently) which was apparently disgorged in 1999 (I think), do they seal these under Crown for the duration (10 odd years). Do they have problems with reduction and does it prevent the wine from aging in comparison if it were sealed under cork for that period? Surely these Champange houses have done comparitive tastings over the years.

Jezza,
I don't think any champagne houses would do the comparison I think you're suggesting. It's only disgorged once - then topped up and sealed with a cork. At which point they want to sell it as past as possible. My understanding is that very few houses disgorge, cork, and then keep champagne for sale at a later date. In fact the comparison is probably impossible for the fact that the wine is only ever sur lees under crown cap, and disgorged under cork. So an 88 Grand Annee, and an 88 RD ceased to be the same wine at the point when the Grand Annee was disgorged. The RD would have continued on lees for as many years as it took Bollinger to decide to disgorge and release it. Am I making sense? When you read of very old champagnes being released by the houses, they're invariable recently-disgorged. I don't think you will ever take a tour of an Epernay house, and find rows of very old, vintage champagne lying in their drives with corks in the bottles...

Champagne with corks goes in the warehouse ready to be sold...

cheers,
Graeme

[Adam]

The crown cap was invented around 1900, I wonder what the champagne houses used prior??? I wonder if there was a lot of debate before the adoption of crown caps on the unbottled wine?

[ChrisH]

Davo said :

The very best of corks supply an airtight environment in the bottle underneath them. The very worst leak from day one and continue to leak forever. The very best of corks remain intact, the very worst crumble and fall to pieces. Somewhere in the middle across a range are the rest of the corks.

Davo, we are in total agreement....and screwcaps seal just like the very best of corks.


regards
Chris

[Davo]

Ah but, are the very best of corks the very best of corks?

[MatthewW]

Ah but, are the very best of corks the very best of corks?

Rhetorical drivel. I suppose that you go searching for low fill bottles when buying wine!!!!

Matthew

[Davo]

Call it rhetorical drivel all you like.

The facts are:-

1. There is huge variation as to the sealing capabilities of corks, even within the same batch of supposed same quality corks.

2. There is still dissent within the wine industry as to whether the aging process is mainly oxidative or mainly reductive. (High school chemistry will tell you neither occur in the absence of the other.)

3. There is absolute knowledge that excess sulfur in wine stored in a mainly reductive environment leads to the formation of reductive compounds which are an irreversible and permanent fault. These reductive faults occur less commonly under cork than under ROTE with the same headspace and the same sulfur in solution. Why?

4. Many winemakers have concerns about the aging profile of red wine under ROTE, and this includes some of our leading makers of red wine.

Enough rhetoric for you?

[MatthewW]

Call it rhetorical drivel all you like.

The facts are:-

1. There is huge variation as to the sealing capabilities of corks, even within the same batch of supposed same quality corks.

2. There is still dissent within the wine industry as to whether the aging process is mainly oxidative or mainly reductive. (High school chemistry will tell you neither occur in the absence of the other.)

3. There is absolute knowledge that excess sulfur in wine stored in a mainly reductive environment leads to the formation of reductive compounds which are an irreversible and permanent fault. These reductive faults occur less commonly under cork than under ROTE with the same headspace and the same sulfur in solution. Why?

4. Many winemakers have concerns about the aging profile of red wine under ROTE, and this includes some of our leading makers of red wine.

Enough rhetoric for you?

1. Which is why tree bark is wholly unsuitable as a closure.
2. So? Whichever is the case, it can be adequatekly addressed by controlled measures using reliable closures. See 1 as to why tree bark does not satisfy this essential criterion.
3. As discussed at length on this forum, this winemaking fault can be avoided by appropriate winemaking practices (as with many other winemaking faults). One major path to removing faults is removing unreliable/variable contibutors - such as tree bark.
4. Many consumers have major concerns about the prospect of opening long cellared and highly valued wines to find them ruined by the variable flaws introduced by tree bark closures (as referred to in your first point). If more corked and randomly oxidised bottles were returned there would be less of the "Dunno mate. Know how the stuff ages under cork but don't know 'bout this newfangled stuff". This is the sort of conservatism (when practiced in old world countries) which allowed Australia to steal a march on them.

Not enough rhetoris for me, rather far too much.

Matthew

[Davo]

Mat, More rhetoric

I quote JohnP who quotes the AWRI in an earlier thread as you obviously don't believe me.

It is interesting to note that Godden, et. al. (and his various publications on the AWRI trials) always makes the same statement in his conclusions, and I quote:

"No one closure tested in this study could be considered entirely suitable by all the criteria assessed, for the long term storage of wine, although many of them could be considered suitable for shorter-term storage."
Note: The trial tested 9 synthetic corks, 2 technical corks, 2 natural corks and 1 screw cap to seal a 1999 Semillon.


Yep lets immediately swap all wines over to ROTE based on this evidence. You are yet another that advocates throwing out the baby with the bathwater.

I work in a field where being conservative ensures you get things right. Any move to change is only after considerable research and large scale randomly allocated double blind trials.

Now, trials in this area have been proceding with some producers since the 70s and there is still area for dispute as to the aging of red wine under ROTE as compared to the known problems with cork.

A bit more reading and research on your part rather than uninformed opinion would not go astray.

[Anthony]

I'd hate to jump in late but Davo it seems that you prefer cork to stelvin. I'm sure you brought 2002 Rieslings and in quantity (thats if you like Riesling). Hence the question, did it bother you when you were buying these if they were not sealed under stelvin? Please don't take this as a smartarse comment, I am generously curious.

It is amazing how quickly our acceptance of stelvin has changed. Almost to the point where we a blindy wanting everything in stelvin. Is this correct? Only time will tell. However what I do know is that I prefer to have all my wine bottled under screwcap. Everyone is different. Apparently Croser is still anti-stelvin and is not 100 per cent sold on them even for whites.

Whilst, I can see why they have become popular for sealing aromatic whites (ie Riesling, Sauv/Blanc, etc) and don't see how the arguments change for red wines. The failure rate of cork would not be acceptable in a lot of industries. While it might seem a bit early to endorse stelvin (screwcaps) without trials etc, I think the industry has to take a stance and say 'we are not going to accept this failure rate any longer.' If the cork suppliers could get the rate of spoilage to an acceptable level then I would gladly switch back to cork. Will this happen? I doubt it.

Cheers
anthony

[Davo]

I'd hate to jump in late but Davo it seems that you prefer cork to stelvin.

You presume incorrectly. If you had read all my postings in this and other threads you would realise I have no axe to grind in regard to either closure. I do however have an axe to grind with unsubstantiated opinion being presented as fact.

I do own wines bottled under ROTE and have drunk wines bottled under ROTE since they were available in the late 70s.

I'm sure you brought 2002 Rieslings and in quantity (thats if you like Riesling). Hence the question, did it bother you when you were buying these if they were not sealed under stelvin? Please don't take this as a smartarse comment, I am generously curious.

I have some reisling under both closures.

Everyone is different. Apparently Croser is still anti-stelvin and is not 100 per cent sold on them even for whites.

Exactly my point. If experienced and respected winemakers of the ilk of Henschke and Croser have a problem with this closure why is it that so many opinionated amateurs think they know better.

The failure rate of cork would not be acceptable in a lot of industries.

Most industries, especially food related industries have a failure/spoilage rate that is at least as high, if not higher than that for TCA in wine. However these industries are able to identify spoiled product usually before it gets to the customer. Unfortunately this is not possible with TCA and that is where the problem lies.

While it might seem a bit early to endorse stelvin (screwcaps) without trials etc, I think the industry has to take a stance and say 'we are not going to accept this failure rate any longer.'.

It is not a bit early at all. Members of the industry carried out trials on ROTE closures commencing in the 70s and even then, while embracing them for white wines, were not convinced of their use in reds. Nothing much has changed 30 years later.

If the cork suppliers could get the rate of spoilage to an acceptable level then I would gladly switch back to cork. Will this happen? I doubt it..

Why? If you are so pro ROTE, why change back?

[Anthony]

First of all, sorry to assume that you were pro-cork. Didn't have time to read all the threads and just read the Peel Estate one.

I have some reisling under both closures.

What do you prefer Davo? If you could go out and have a choice between both closures which one would you pick?

Exactly my point. If experienced and respected winemakers of the ilk of Henschke and Croser have a problem with this closure why is it that so many opinionated amateurs think they know better.

This is why it is so debated. Sure great winemakers like Croser do not like ROTE (stelvin or whatever you want to call them) but you also have exactly the same calibre of winemakers like Grosset and Felton Road swearing by them for red and white.

However these industries are able to identify spoiled product usually before it gets to the customer. Unfortunately this is not possible with TCA and that is where the problem lies.

Thats fine. But as you said other industries can identify the spoilage before it hits the market. Wine producers cannot. Which means we have to look at ways of overcoming cork taint and find better closures.

Nothing much has changed 30 years later.

While the testing and trials still stand from 30 years ago, what has changed is the public acceptance of ROTE. 30 years ago we were dead against anything other than cork. Today this is not the case. I think, if cork suppliers could get it right (will they ever? do they have the technology to reduce taint to acceptable levels> Who knows.

cheers
anthony

[Rob]

why don't we seal wine in glass bottle with no opening? Remember the old medicine used for injection? it was sealed in a bottle and you get a glass cutter to scratch the surface and snap the top open.

Why donb't we do that? each wine comes with a opener and no more argument of which closure is better. I am sure this one is the best.

If it worked for the great medicine then it must be working for the humble wines

[JohnP]

I don't want to get embroiled in the cork v stelvin thing too much, but this belief that the trials and testing carried out 30 years ago (and here I assume the Yalumba exercise and even those at Roseworthy) were actually well controlled, experimentally designed studies is more than a little incorrect. They didn't prove that much at all, the technology used is effectively irrelevant for today and the fact that someone has tasted bottles that were drinking well 10-15-20-30 years later ignores the fact that such tasting was random and uncontrolled and not able to be compared with an accepted statistically relevant population of bottles of the same age.

I find it somewhat bemusing that given there is no scientifically generally accepted position on what cork contributes (+ or -) to the long term maturation of wine, that we can now happily bottle everything in stelvin. Yes, stelvin will rid us of the dreaded TCA (as will almost any non-cork closure) - but that is 5-7% of wine, what about the other 90% of wine that is ok can we say categorically that it will be better. The simple answer is NO, and that is simply because no-one has done the longitudinal studies to prove it. Penfolds have a study that has now been going for around 8 years - they have published nothing. The only australian study of note (AWRI) noted reductive characters (rubber-like aroma) in the ROTE closure - not a good sign for the closure given the probabilities involved. But if you look at that study in detail, cork actually fared quite well - yes there was TCA, but almost everywhere else cork did well. Even with oxidised aroma natural cork was grouped with the ROTE closure at 24 months of storage.

NO I am not arguing for cork, far from it, I will happily accept stelvin as a closure. My rather simple point is lets prove it first, rather than simply accepting heresay and untested personal opinion. I for one want to see the Penfold study results, because that study is across a broad range of wines - including Grange; and will hopefully be defining moment in wine history when eventually published. In the meantime (which could be quite some years) we will all be able to express our personal belief by either making, selling or buying wines with our preferred closure. I'll probably continue to buy multiple because the wines I like tend to use cork, technical cork and ROTE. Hopefully, 4-5 years from now we will all be a lot wiser and hopefully none of us with wines in our cellars that will on too many occassions be disappointing.

John

[GraemeG]

why don't we seal wine in glass bottle with no opening?

Rob, in the Mosel last April we were talking to the winemaker Reinhart Lowenstein and he was talking about someone on the river doing just that. I didn't take too much notice 'cause there were other things to discuss (like the €230 375ml TBA we were tasting) but I thought it an interesting approach to finding an answer to the oxidative/reductive question, if nothing else!

cheers,
Graeme

[GraemeG]

Exactly my point. If experienced and respected winemakers of the ilk of Henschke and Croser have a problem with this closure why is it that so many opinionated amateurs think they know better.

Well, I gather from Tyson's book that Henschke, at least, has no problem with screwcaps. Croser is actually a director of Amorim, so it's just possible that his impartiality is compromised ever so slightly....

But in general, it's fair to say that there are a number of views in the industry. Wonder what Freycinet think?

cheerse,
Graeme

[Murray]

. Croser is actually a director of Amorim,
cheerse,
Graeme

Graeme,

The latest I heard is he's no longer actively engaged in the cork industry, but he was when Petaluma started putting their riesling in screwcap.

[michel]

why don't we seal wine in glass bottle with no opening?

If technically possible this sounds and awesome idea and I have heard JohnP mention the same concept.

regards
michel