OK - my 2006 resolution is to become less ignorant of the wines of the US of A. As I am TOTALLY ignorant currently, any advance on that is a step forward.
My entire US wine experience consists of one bottle of Berenger Clear Lakes Zinfandel 1999, which didn't impress me much, although it improved after I recorked it and tried it again the next night. I am a huge fan of fat SA reds and NZ pinots.
Any advice on what to drink and where to find it welcome - I suspect I may not be the only person who stands to benefit.
Drinking American for beginners
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Von Ridler
- Posts: 57
- Joined: Wed Aug 20, 2003 8:11 am
- Location: Sydney
Suggestions
Try Ridge for a good intro
Santa Cruz
Montebello
Geyserville
solid wines, easy to find.
Santa Cruz
Montebello
Geyserville
solid wines, easy to find.
Ridge is good...Geyserville and Lytton Springs are certainly great intros.
I've had some Syrah recently that were interesting Carlisle and Cayuse.
Also some Turley Haynes vineyard which was awesome....and a Syrah from the Turley winemaker...someone Jordon....I think the wine was called 'Faialla'??....anyways it was very good...could have sworn there was some Zin in it though.
Have a look at this site for a run down of the American AVA's (the equivalent of a G.I.) and a list of wineries
http://www.appellationamerica.com/
Dave
I've had some Syrah recently that were interesting Carlisle and Cayuse.
Also some Turley Haynes vineyard which was awesome....and a Syrah from the Turley winemaker...someone Jordon....I think the wine was called 'Faialla'??....anyways it was very good...could have sworn there was some Zin in it though.
Have a look at this site for a run down of the American AVA's (the equivalent of a G.I.) and a list of wineries
http://www.appellationamerica.com/
Dave
Zin? One of the best value Zins I have found in the US is Ravenswood Vintner's Blend. When on special, this can be had for circa USD10 per bottle. I have enjoyed several vintages of this drop. Other fullish-bodied, spicy and not-too-expensive (as in under USD 20) Zinfandels which come to mind as very nice are Peachy Canyon and Eberle.
Let the kids out!
From what I can tell, you have almost no hope of becoming more experienced with California wines if you have to rely on the local retail shops. Just a quick check on Wine Searcher shows almost no decent wines from even the major brands (Mondavi, Beringer, etc.) with the exception of a few of their low-end plonk mass market wines. You will have to either find a shop that specializes in bringing in better wines from California, or find a local or ex-pat who brings them back and is willing to share. We have the luxury up here that we get a fairly large selection of Australian wines, mostly at not unreasonable prices. Whenever I travel to Europe or Australia (although that hasn't been recent) I'm always shocked at the incredibly restricted selection of US wines, and what's available isn't usually representative at all of our "good stuff." Even your host of this site, Gavin, doesn't seem to have any U.S. wines listed. Maybe a group of you could convince him to do a little importing?
Your best bet is to plan a vacation up here, and tour the wine regions!
Cheers,
Alan
Your best bet is to plan a vacation up here, and tour the wine regions!
Cheers,
Alan
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KMP
- Posts: 1246
- Joined: Sat Apr 17, 2004 4:02 am
- Location: Expat, now in San Diego, California
- Contact:
DaveB wrote:Ridge is good...Geyserville and Lytton Springs are certainly great intros.
I've had some Syrah recently that were interesting Carlisle and Cayuse.
Also some Turley Haynes vineyard which was awesome....and a Syrah from the Turley winemaker...someone Jordon....I think the wine was called 'Faialla'??....anyways it was very good...could have sworn there was some Zin in it though.
Have a look at this site for a run down of the American AVA's (the equivalent of a G.I.) and a list of wineries
http://www.appellationamerica.com/
Dave
Dave
Its Ehren Jordan and he has Failla Wines. I've seen them but never tried any.
Mike
Ahh, so this must be why I'm now getting the Failla mailings. I guess I put my name down after this thread.
Mike
Last edited by KMP on Thu Sep 14, 2006 2:49 am, edited 1 time in total.
We had a good Meritage by St Supery a while back. Meritage was (as I understand it) California's attempt to develop a bordeaux challenging wine style from similar grapes. There's a few around still and the bottle we had invited further investigation. Style wise it was more in keeping with Margaret River than any other Oz region I could think of to compare it with. Nicely structured and without going daft on the alcohol.
Whether any examples would be available there, I don't know. If not, go for Ridge.
Whether any examples would be available there, I don't know. If not, go for Ridge.
Alan Rath wrote:
Your best bet is to plan a vacation up here, and tour the wine regions!
Plans are already in the making - currently aiming for the end of the northern summer, and am planning to hit amazon for a decent guidebook.
Thanks very much for the insight regarding local retailers, even if the news is bad, as it at least stops me making an ill-founded judgement.
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bacchaebabe
- Posts: 1222
- Joined: Fri Aug 15, 2003 5:04 pm
- Location: Sydney
Actually, Alan and Manning, Ultimo Cellars has a range of US wines. Not huge but certianly better than most places. They have a 20% off sale on now. They tend to deal with more imports than most places so it's probably the best place in Sydney to peruse. They are also probably the best for French and Italian too. I've definitely bought Ridge Lytton Springs from them and I know they have Mondavi and I've also seen Ravenswood and Turley. None of them are cheap of course!
Cheers,
Kris
There's a fine wine between pleasure and pain
(Stolen from the graffiti in the ladies loos at Pegasus Bay winery)
Kris
There's a fine wine between pleasure and pain
(Stolen from the graffiti in the ladies loos at Pegasus Bay winery)
KMP wrote:DaveB wrote:Ridge is good...Geyserville and Lytton Springs are certainly great intros.
I've had some Syrah recently that were interesting Carlisle and Cayuse.
Also some Turley Haynes vineyard which was awesome....and a Syrah from the Turley winemaker...someone Jordon....I think the wine was called 'Faialla'??....anyways it was very good...could have sworn there was some Zin in it though.
Have a look at this site for a run down of the American AVA's (the equivalent of a G.I.) and a list of wineries
http://www.appellationamerica.com/
Dave
Dave
Its Ehren Jordan and he has Failla Wines. I've seen them but never tried any.
Mike
Thats the one Mike.....I think we talked about it briefly at dinner. I've got a mate who's done a few vintages at Turley and he dragged a bottle back home after the last one...it was good...big wine....not as big as that Carlisle you dragged along to dinner.....and the yanks reckon we make fruit bombs
Cheers
Dave
I lucked upon some very cheap bottles of Clos Du Val Merlot and Pinot Noir with 15years bottle age at the local liquor store, that he had picked up from a clearance sale when when of his kind had sold out.
I got them for $6 a bottle each, promptly drank em all and then went looking for more, found them via the importer in SA but shocked by the price have not bought any more, ie over $60 a bottle and this was 8 years ago.
Have also tasted some Oregon PNs which were so forgetable that I have.
I got them for $6 a bottle each, promptly drank em all and then went looking for more, found them via the importer in SA but shocked by the price have not bought any more, ie over $60 a bottle and this was 8 years ago.
Have also tasted some Oregon PNs which were so forgetable that I have.
bacchaebabe wrote:Actually, Alan and Manning, Ultimo Cellars has a range of US wines. Not huge but certianly better than most places. They have a 20% off sale on now. They tend to deal with more imports than most places so it's probably the best place in Sydney to peruse. They are also probably the best for French and Italian too. I've definitely bought Ridge Lytton Springs from them and I know they have Mondavi and I've also seen Ravenswood and Turley. None of them are cheap of course!
Thor Iverson said after a visit last March that their US selection was very good, although hardly representative. There were some rather obscure makers whose bottles he was quite surprised to find; they're not even that easy to get in the US. Rather like finding Wantirna Estate wines in Detroit, or something!
Actually, if I recall, he described UWC as 'an evil shop' - it provided quite some amusement (and $risk) in the quest for a bottle or two for their Tetsuya's dinner!
cheers,
Graeme
In the late 1990's I used to buy some Bonny Doon wines - most often the " Clos de Gilroy " which I recall had a amusing looking chap on the label. It was a lovely drinkable Grenache based wine I think. Was about $20 Aus then. Also recall a " Cigare Volante " by Bonny Doon ( I think that's French for UFO ) which was a great wine. Certainly have not seen these in shops anywhere for years.
Although I do recall some Clos de Gilroy just a few years ago which was 3 or 4 years old and with a plastic cork and it was gone ...the first time I realised the bad side of those plastic corks.
Back on 9/10/99 I went to a Zinfandel tasting in Adelaide - I still have the notes given out and back then the US Zins were brought in by West Coast Wine Cellars who I think were based in Western Australia. Even back then there was not much change out of $60 Aus for these Zins.
Although I do recall some Clos de Gilroy just a few years ago which was 3 or 4 years old and with a plastic cork and it was gone ...the first time I realised the bad side of those plastic corks.
Back on 9/10/99 I went to a Zinfandel tasting in Adelaide - I still have the notes given out and back then the US Zins were brought in by West Coast Wine Cellars who I think were based in Western Australia. Even back then there was not much change out of $60 Aus for these Zins.
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Gianna
- Posts: 149
- Joined: Tue Jan 18, 2005 8:22 pm
- Location: The world's most liveable city - Melbourne
Have also tasted some Oregon PNs which were so forgetable that I have.
Can't agree with you there Davo. I've had some excellent pinots from Oregon. Domaine Serene, Ponzi, Evasham Wood Cuvee J, Rex Hill all make some first rate PN. But it's all personal taste.
At every turn, it pays to challenge orthodox ways of thinking
Found Ultimo's web site, but they don't list prices so I can't give any advice there (and probably why they don't appear on Wine Searcher). There are indeed some fine wines listed, particularly Ridge Monte Bello (their "Santa Cruz" Cab is very decent as well), Montelena (particularly the "Estate" Cabernet). Those two are most certainly in the top 10 of all California Cabernet wines IMO, at least in the more "traditional" style.
Ravenswood makes some very good and representative Zinfandels (although having been sold to a larger conglomerate several years ago there are some questions about how the quality and styles will proceed from here). The single vineyard Zins are notably better (e.g., Monte Rosso, Dickerson, Big River, etc.), but if all you can get is one of the blend wines they're worth trying if not too expensive (I wouldn't drop down lower than the Sonoma or Napa blends, stay away from the Lodi wine, it's too ripe, and the California or Vintners blends are not as good). Ridge Geyserville and Lytton Springs are both generally excellent wines, priced around US$ 25-30 up here.
Seavey Cabernet is also excellent, worthy of age. Stay away from Silver Oak, it is a "restaurant list" wine, marketed to appeal to big spenders, overoaked, and production has increased considerably over the years. Sobon makes a nice, though riper style Zin (from the central valley, where it's quite a bit warmer). Spottswoode, Staglin, and Stag's Leap make very good Cabs, though fairly expensive up here (must be very expensive down there, along with Monte Bello and Montelena).
Domaine Droughin is an outstanding Pinot producer in Oregon (established by the Burgundy Droughin), the Laurene bottling is as good a Pinot as you'll find from the U.S. (Any vintage but 2003, which was very hot and ultra-ripe in Oregon). I've heard good things about Togni, though never tried one. Kenwood and Kendall Jackson are big conglomerate wineries, though their high-end stuff is decent.
Regards,
Alan
Ravenswood makes some very good and representative Zinfandels (although having been sold to a larger conglomerate several years ago there are some questions about how the quality and styles will proceed from here). The single vineyard Zins are notably better (e.g., Monte Rosso, Dickerson, Big River, etc.), but if all you can get is one of the blend wines they're worth trying if not too expensive (I wouldn't drop down lower than the Sonoma or Napa blends, stay away from the Lodi wine, it's too ripe, and the California or Vintners blends are not as good). Ridge Geyserville and Lytton Springs are both generally excellent wines, priced around US$ 25-30 up here.
Seavey Cabernet is also excellent, worthy of age. Stay away from Silver Oak, it is a "restaurant list" wine, marketed to appeal to big spenders, overoaked, and production has increased considerably over the years. Sobon makes a nice, though riper style Zin (from the central valley, where it's quite a bit warmer). Spottswoode, Staglin, and Stag's Leap make very good Cabs, though fairly expensive up here (must be very expensive down there, along with Monte Bello and Montelena).
Domaine Droughin is an outstanding Pinot producer in Oregon (established by the Burgundy Droughin), the Laurene bottling is as good a Pinot as you'll find from the U.S. (Any vintage but 2003, which was very hot and ultra-ripe in Oregon). I've heard good things about Togni, though never tried one. Kenwood and Kendall Jackson are big conglomerate wineries, though their high-end stuff is decent.
Regards,
Alan
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Mike Hawkins
- Posts: 2747
- Joined: Fri Aug 29, 2003 9:39 am
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Andrew Jordan
- Posts: 775
- Joined: Wed May 05, 2004 11:53 am
- Location: Sydney
Manning,
Langtons has a few US bottles available on their latest Sydney auction, among them a couple of 6 packs of the 1997 Beringer Reserve Cabernet, which is from a good vintage and got some good reviews from memory. Also 2 bottles of 1994 Ridge Monte Bello Cabernet (also a good vintage), and also a 2002 Turley Zin if you want to try another one of those!
Langtons has a few US bottles available on their latest Sydney auction, among them a couple of 6 packs of the 1997 Beringer Reserve Cabernet, which is from a good vintage and got some good reviews from memory. Also 2 bottles of 1994 Ridge Monte Bello Cabernet (also a good vintage), and also a 2002 Turley Zin if you want to try another one of those!
Cheers
AJ
Cabernet is ... and will always be ... KING!
AJ
Cabernet is ... and will always be ... KING!
I had a Turley Dry Creek Valley Grist Vineyard Zinfandel 2002 last night...with the lads from Torbreck and new winemaker..well he's been there for a while...Craig.
Super stuff.....about a third of the wine comes from vines planted in 1870(apparently the second oldest in California) and the balance from those planted in the 1960's...rocky soils high in iron......the wine has very bloody good
Super stuff.....about a third of the wine comes from vines planted in 1870(apparently the second oldest in California) and the balance from those planted in the 1960's...rocky soils high in iron......the wine has very bloody good
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Mahmoud Ali
- Posts: 2954
- Joined: Fri Aug 25, 2006 9:00 pm
- Location: Edmonton, Canada
To Pelican,
Randy Grahm of Bonny Doon is an idiosyncratic philosopher-winemaker who likes to make Rhone-style wines. His newsletters are long, humorous, verbose, and full of references to philosophers and philosophy. Like Charles Melton in the Barossa who make Nine Popes (a play on words of Chateauneuf du Pape), Randy Grahm makes a wine called Old Telegraph (Domaine Vieulle Telegraph in Chateauneuf du Pape). His Clos du Gilroy is a grenach wine, very unusual in California, and a bottle I had a few years ago was labeled 'American Grenache", ie from multi-regional sources (California and Washington?). The name of the wine has an interesting story. Gilroy is an important garlic growing centre in California and some of the vineyards are near the place. If I remember correctly, the fellow on the label is a French philosopher, and whose name escapes me.
I have found that imported wines in Australia are very expensive. They are at least 50-100 per cent higher than what I would have to pay in Canada. There are a few exceptions where the prices are on par with what I would be paying in Canada but these are wines that have been bulk or direct imports. They are mainly the less expensive bigger bottlings. As a result, American wines, priced as they are in US dollars are not going to be cheap. It is the biggest reason why Australians don't get a chance to taste foreign wines.
Randy Grahm of Bonny Doon is an idiosyncratic philosopher-winemaker who likes to make Rhone-style wines. His newsletters are long, humorous, verbose, and full of references to philosophers and philosophy. Like Charles Melton in the Barossa who make Nine Popes (a play on words of Chateauneuf du Pape), Randy Grahm makes a wine called Old Telegraph (Domaine Vieulle Telegraph in Chateauneuf du Pape). His Clos du Gilroy is a grenach wine, very unusual in California, and a bottle I had a few years ago was labeled 'American Grenache", ie from multi-regional sources (California and Washington?). The name of the wine has an interesting story. Gilroy is an important garlic growing centre in California and some of the vineyards are near the place. If I remember correctly, the fellow on the label is a French philosopher, and whose name escapes me.
I have found that imported wines in Australia are very expensive. They are at least 50-100 per cent higher than what I would have to pay in Canada. There are a few exceptions where the prices are on par with what I would be paying in Canada but these are wines that have been bulk or direct imports. They are mainly the less expensive bigger bottlings. As a result, American wines, priced as they are in US dollars are not going to be cheap. It is the biggest reason why Australians don't get a chance to taste foreign wines.