Right, what are we/you drinking now .. tonight

[Mahmoud Ali]

2013 Seppelts Salinger, I said it before and I'll say it again, pound for pound the best sparkler in Australia. Think I paid $20 for it.
Spends several years on lees, made in the old fashioned way. Biscuits, yeast the finest but most persistent bead, most tasters thought it was French. Just lovely!

Kudos to the Salinger. In my circle, where we always taste blind, the first guess is whether it is Champagne or not. Full marks to a non-Champagne that gets it "right". The other kudos goes to a non-vintage sparkler thought to be a vintage. Unfortunately we don't see the Salinger here in Canada.

[Sean]

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[Scotty vino]

Dinner with some mates at a friends place. Kicked off with some Birra Ichnusa!
Petrus bottle was there for giggle factor but everything else was consumed on the night.
My first crack at chateau d'yquem (86 and 09) and chateau Cheval Blanc (1990).
mind blown. I don't know what else to say.
Ok so im gonna name drop the CCB supplied by Mr Joe Grilli. Cheers Joe!
awesome night. chargrilled Wagyu etc etc supplied by host was nailed to perfection.
oh and took the zalto Uni's for this one.

[Matt@5453]

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Mr Mick Riesling 21 - A second label from Tim Adams, with its own winery based out of the old Stanley Wines building in the Clare township. Bright and clear in the glass. Free run juice, so it has loads of pristine, juicy Clare Valley fruit character. Limes, lemon, kaffir leaves and some fruit sweetness rather than simply dry, really the fruit and acidity are perfectly woven into each other.

Most of the wines I have tried in the Mr Mick range represent good value and good drinking.
The 2016 Shiraz was a cracker when it was out.

[Sean]

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[Sean]

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[Sean]

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[mychurch]

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Almost brought this to last Weekends Melbourne offline. It’s great. So different from the run of the mill Chardonnays, with a taste profile that’s more akin to a Funky Jura white. There is honey, ripe stone fruit, quince and a thick texture that is kept fresh by just enough acidity. The real plus, unlike last weekends Leeuwin, is the personality. It has bags of it. You may not like it, but you can’t ignore it.

[Sean]

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[phillisc]

Well good to see a spec (but pretty safe bet) buy has turned up trump's. $13 a bottle!!
2021 Leo Buring Clare Riesling
Opens with a very delicate but slightly floral nose, almost austere. But the palate is where it shines, citrus, laser like but restrained acid. Beautiful finish, clean and pure.

Can see why this cleaned up at both RAS and Clare show... technically perfect, to the point of perhaps??? being an early drinker but will put a sixer aside.
Matt if this is a barometer for the vintage, then there will be a shed load of amazing wines. Reminded of a 2012 Merle on release.
Happy days and ridiculous value
Cheers Craig

Wait to you try the 21 Merle.

Had a glass of 2021 Reilly's Watervale Riesling at the pub the last weekend with my snitty, impressed also. Followed up and purchased a bottle this week, re-confirmed my initial impression - another very good example of 21 Riesling, generous fruit with lovely balanced acidity.

2021 Pikes Merle, agree this is a nice wine good palate length lovely fruit and acid balance, just lacks the zingy acidity and laser like mouth feel of the 2012
2011 Leonay, golden yellow still very fresh, no kero, in a great spot.
Cheers Craig

[Hacker]

2018 JM Fourrier Bourgogne. At $100 it is double the price I paid for the glorious 2010 Gevrey VV back in the day, and it's not even in the same universe. I'm not sure this is meant to be cellared, but I wouldn't bother. It is an acid bath, reminescent of many of the 2008's. Sorry, big pass.

[WineRick]

Well good to see a spec (but pretty safe bet) buy has turned up trump's. $13 a bottle!!
2021 Leo Buring Clare Riesling
Opens with a very delicate but slightly floral nose, almost austere. But the palate is where it shines, citrus, laser like but restrained acid. Beautiful finish, clean and pure.

Can see why this cleaned up at both RAS and Clare show... technically perfect, to the point of perhaps??? being an early drinker but will put a sixer aside.
Matt if this is a barometer for the vintage, then there will be a shed load of amazing wines. Reminded of a 2012 Merle on release.
Happy days and ridiculous value
Cheers Craig

Wait to you try the 21 Merle.

Had a glass of 2021 Reilly's Watervale Riesling at the pub the last weekend with my snitty, impressed also. Followed up and purchased a bottle this week, re-confirmed my initial impression - another very good example of 21 Riesling, generous fruit with lovely balanced acidity.

2021 Pikes Merle, agree this is a nice wine good palate length lovely fruit and acid balance, just lacks the zingy acidity and laser like mouth feel of the 2012
2011 Leonay, golden yellow still very fresh, no kero, in a great spot.
Cheers Craig

Interesting you mention 'kero', long thought to be a varietal character of aged Rieslings.
Then it was thought to develop as a result juice oxidation.
The latest on 'kero' is that it's believed to develop as a result of overly sun-exposed / sunburnt fruit, with makes a lot of sense when Riesling is grown in the wrong spot.

[Mahmoud Ali]

Interesting you mention 'kero', long thought to be a varietal character of aged Rieslings.
Then it was thought to develop as a result juice oxidation.
The latest on 'kero' is that it's believed to develop as a result of overly sun-exposed / sunburnt fruit, with makes a lot of sense when Riesling is grown in the wrong spot.

I'm not sure I agree with the overly sun-exposed or sunburnt fruit theory as that wouldn't explain the phenomenon in German Rieslings.

Mahmoud.

[felixp21]

2018 JM Fourrier Bourgogne. At $100 it is double the price I paid for the glorious 2010 Gevrey VV back in the day, and it's not even in the same universe. I'm not sure this is meant to be cellared, but I wouldn't bother. It is an acid bath, reminescent of many of the 2008's. Sorry, big pass.

been thru about 7-8 of these, and my experience is nothing like that. I thought I'd go have a look at cellartracker, and TN's there fall in line with mine. Good wine for it's level, I haven't noticed the acid poking thru. Maybe a flawed bottle??
PS... I purchased these in Australia for $53, that price is insane.

[WineRick]

Interesting you mention 'kero', long thought to be a varietal character of aged Rieslings.
Then it was thought to develop as a result juice oxidation.
The latest on 'kero' is that it's believed to develop as a result of overly sun-exposed / sunburnt fruit, with makes a lot of sense when Riesling is grown in the wrong spot.

I'm not sure I agree with the overly sun-exposed or sunburnt fruit theory as that wouldn't explain the phenomenon in German Rieslings.

Mahmoud.

Can get sunburnt fruit in Germany, especially if significant leaf loss and/or a drought year, or Riesling grown in lesser regions.

[Mahmoud Ali]

Hi WineRick,

Excepting more recent times and climate change, German wine regions struggled to get good vintages. When I started looking at German Rieslings back in the late 80s, I seem to recall only three ripe vintages, the famous 1971, 1976, and 1983, with 1975 as runner up. Germany is not known, at least not till recently, of having hot, drought years.

In Germany the "lesser regions" are cooler and less likely to have grapes ripen properly.

Mahmoud.

[WineRick]

Hi WineRick,

Excepting more recent times and climate change, German wine regions struggled to get good vintages. When I started looking at German Rieslings back in the late 80s, I seem to recall only three ripe vintages, the famous 1971, 1976, and 1983, with 1975 as runner up. Germany is not known, at least not till recently, of having hot, drought years.

In Germany the "lesser regions" are cooler and less likely to have grapes ripen properly.

Mahmoud.

Let's come from another angle. If it's varietal character, why don't we see 'kero' on all aged Rieslings.
The very great Rieslings don't have it - my mind goes back to Buring 1973 DWC 17 as an example.
Also, it is marked down in wine shows, as are/were the Rieslings that used to exhibit those strange 'pineapple' yeast-derived esters.

[Mahmoud Ali]

That`s a fair point WineRick, and not one I can answer. All I can say is that it has been a quite common in many of the older Rieslings I've had, even before I started on Australian Riesling and much of my early reading talked about in favourable terms.

Cheers ...................... Mahmoud.

[Mahmoud Ali]

Thinking further on your point Wine Rick, it certainly does make sense that sunshine and heat might play a role, although the same might be said for its role in ripeness, fruit and alcohol. I took a look at a few old wine books I have on hand and they all refer to a petrol-like character of aged Riesling.

In Hugh Johnson's Modern Encyclopedia of Wine (2nd edition, 1987) he describes Riesling as producing "wine of crisp fruity acidity and transparent clarity of flavour. Even its smell is refreshing. In Germany it ranges from pale green, fragile and sharp on the Mosel to golden, exotically luscious wines, especially in the Rheinpfalz. It is remarkably versatile in warmer climates, perhaps at its most typical in Alsace, becoming more buxom in California and Australia where it ages to its unique mature bouquet of lemons and petrol more rapidly."

In Oz Clarke's New Encyclopedia of Wine (1999) he says "Riesling is a demanding grape. Its wine can be greenly acidic, but with age (and great, classic Riesling must have bottle age) it mellows, the acidity oproviding the backbone for honeyed fruit that often develops a nose and flavour described as 'petrolly', and tasting a million times more delicious than it sounds."

Once again Hugh Johnson, this time in his memoire titled Wine, A Life Uncorked (2006) says "With German Rieslings, whether grown on the slate of the Moselle, the schist of the Rheingau, the sandstone of Nierstein in that small part of the Rheinhessen that fronts the rhine, or the volcanic soil of the Mittelhaardt, there is a comparable evolution. the colour darkens to gold and even orange (at least the sweeter wines), the crushed-grape character of Riesling disappears and scents from the soil emerge, mingled with honey and a unique smell that makes me think of filling-station forecourts. Australians, not beating about the bush, just call it 'petrol'. But Australian Rieslings are almost born with it; it takes over (at least in budget models) from year two or three. In Germany, in fine wines of fine years, a hint of forecourt begins to tease you at ten years or so and should never become full frontal. I imagine the main differences is in summertime temperatures. California's Rieslings (the few that are left): California made good Riesling but couldn't sell it) have a suggestion, or more than that, of gasoline".

With the last quote it might be fair to say that you are quite on the mark when referring to heat and sunshine as having an effect, however it is not a flaw in so far as it exhibits 'petrol' but rather in its domination or exaggeration of it. If wine shows are indeed marking down wines for exhibiting petrol aromas then it must be because they shouldn't be doing so at a young age.

Cheers ........................... Mahmoud.

[WineRick]

Thinking further on your point Wine Rick, it certainly does make sense that sunshine and heat might play a role, although the same might be said for its role in ripeness, fruit and alcohol. I took a look at a few old wine books I have on hand and they all refer to a petrol-like character of aged Riesling.

In Hugh Johnson's Modern Encyclopedia of Wine (2nd edition, 1987) he describes Riesling as producing "wine of crisp fruity acidity and transparent clarity of flavour. Even its smell is refreshing. In Germany it ranges from pale green, fragile and sharp on the Mosel to golden, exotically luscious wines, especially in the Rheinpfalz. It is remarkably versatile in warmer climates, perhaps at its most typical in Alsace, becoming more buxom in California and Australia where it ages to its unique mature bouquet of lemons and petrol more rapidly."

In Oz Clarke's New Encyclopedia of Wine (1999) he says "Riesling is a demanding grape. Its wine can be greenly acidic, but with age (and great, classic Riesling must have bottle age) it mellows, the acidity oproviding the backbone for honeyed fruit that often develops a nose and flavour described as 'petrolly', and tasting a million times more delicious than it sounds."

Once again Hugh Johnson, this time in his memoire titled Wine, A Life Uncorked (2006) says "With German Rieslings, whether grown on the slate of the Moselle, the schist of the Rheingau, the sandstone of Nierstein in that small part of the Rheinhessen that fronts the rhine, or the volcanic soil of the Mittelhaardt, there is a comparable evolution. the colour darkens to gold and even orange (at least the sweeter wines), the crushed-grape character of Riesling disappears and scents from the soil emerge, mingled with honey and a unique smell that makes me think of filling-station forecourts. Australians, not beating about the bush, just call it 'petrol'. But Australian Rieslings are almost born with it; it takes over (at least in budget models) from year two or three. In Germany, in fine wines of fine years, a hint of forecourt begins to tease you at ten years or so and should never become full frontal. I imagine the main differences is in summertime temperatures. California's Rieslings (the few that are left): California made good Riesling but couldn't sell it) have a suggestion, or more than that, of gasoline".

With the last quote it might be fair to say that you are quite on the mark when referring to heat and sunshine as having an effect, however it is not a flaw in so far as it exhibits 'petrol' but rather in its domination or exaggeration of it. If wine shows are indeed marking down wines for exhibiting petrol aromas then it must be because they shouldn't be doing so at a young age.

Cheers ........................... Mahmoud.

Yes, old references.

Two articles worth a read;

AWRI website, and look up 'Aged Riesling and the development of TDN'

and,

Deb Pearce wine blog, "There's Kerosene in my Riesling".

[Sean]

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[Sean]

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[Sean]

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[mychurch]

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Lovely mature wine that took half an hour to open up. Very complex with honey, ginger, stone fruit and minerality. Yum

[JamieBahrain]

One of my fav’ Aussie whites. Secondary market bargain for years. Not so much so now. Just lovely-wish more producers would take note!

[mychurch]

Jamie

I think I paid $65 at an auction a couple of months ago. A bargain - this was the bottle with the lower fill.

Experience has taught me though that people appreciate aged Chardie and Riesling (and maybe even Chenin) before a Bdx Blend. Good for us who have seen the light.

[Sean]

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[mychurch]

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The Burg ref here I think means light bodied, something I don’t associate with Malbec. Needed a decant and some time in the fridge to get to room temp and once it does it’s tremendous. Level was 5cm under cork and although there is forest floor in the nose, it’s alive an kicking. Asian spice, some cranberry, cherry and a long finish. Acidity is there and having had some older burgs, this is a definite ringer. Superb.

[Dragzworthy]

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The Burg ref here I think means light bodied, something I don’t associate with Malbec. Needed a decant and some time in the fridge to get to room temp and once it does it’s tremendous. Level was 5cm under cork and although there is forest floor in the nose, it’s alive an kicking. Asian spice, some cranberry, cherry and a long finish. Acidity is there and having had some older burgs, this is a definite ringer. Superb.

Great tasting note. Thanks for sharing with us. I've never actually heard of this wine though its another example of good age worthy Australian wine from yesteryear.

[Ian S]

Ditto I'd never heard of that Orlando, but just goes to show how many good cellarable wines there were back then. I do think such wines are carried on their acidity.