The corked wine thread

[Ozzie W]

Are certain producers more prone to TCA for some reason? I've always wondered about this, but I don't have enough evidence or experience to call it one way or another. So I've started this thread where we can all post about our experiences and specifically about the corked wines we've recently opened.

I'll start off with 2001 Podere Poggio Scalette Il Carbonaione Alta Valle della Greve. I opened one bottle last week and it was corked. I opened another bottle this week and it was also corked.

What corked wine(s) have you opened recently?

[Gavin Trott]

.
Upfront .. I HATE Corked wine! Beyond logic, beyond rationed thinking, it REALLY annoys me!

So just this week

Fattorie Parri Chianti Montespertoli Riserva 2015 .... badly Corked

then a second

Fattorie Parri Chianti Montespertoli Riserva 2015 mildly corked, 'scalped'.

Both down the drain!

.

[conformistpete]

3/3 for the Italians!

[TiggerK]

3/3 for the Italians!

Italy does suffer from an inordinate number of TCA affected bottles IMHO. For me the faults are less common with more modern bottlings, but based on my experiences you have to brace yourself with anything Italian between 1990 and 2003. Mind you aussie TCA rates are also high during that period, lets blame Portugal!

[camw]

Looking at my notes for corked wines and countries with a minimum sample of 75 bottles tasted;

Pre-2000 VIntages

Australia 5.4%
Germany 4.8%
France 3.2%
Italy 2.3%
Spain 1.4% (lowest sample size)

2000 Vintage onward

France 2.7%
Spain 2.4%
Italy 1.6%
USA 1.6%
Germany 1.3%

A few caveats around the 2000 onward data - some bottles would have been screwcap, so % listed are lower than actual (Germany probably benefits most here) and some bottles tasted were at shows, cellar doors etc. so should have been pre-vetted for TCA and again will be lower (Italy probably a bigger benefactor of that).

For individual producers it's a bit more difficult as sample sizes can start to get low but of those where I have tasted more than 15 wines (pre-2000 vintages, 25 producers from Australia and 25 from overseas);

% of Wines Corked by Producer- Pre-2000 Vintages

0% - 32% of Australian Producers, 56% International
1-5% - 12%/4%
5-10% - 28%/28%
10%+ - 28%/12%

So definitely shows variance, it doesn't sit at a constant ~5% for each winery.

[mychurch]

I’m pretty insensitive to cork and friends often have to tell me to stop drinking as it’s corked. Shows now bad the taint was then on 2016 Hochkirch Riesling I had a few weeks ago. Don’t see many Auz rieslings with cork, and this show why. Won’t be trying that house again

[TiggerK]

I’m pretty insensitive to cork and friends often have to tell me to stop drinking as it’s corked. Shows now bad the taint was then on 2016 Hochkirch Riesling I had a few weeks ago. Don’t see many Auz rieslings with cork, and this show why. Won’t be trying that house again

No reason you should stop drinking if you aren't sensitive to the TCA effect. It simply messes with your sense of smell and taste, nothing more. The wine still tastes and smells fine to you, and AFAIK TCA is not harmful to your health in any way, so consider yourself lucky!!

[winetastic]

Great data there Cam.

[JamieBahrain]

I had my first corked wine in 45 bottles ( all European ). A Domaine Jean Grivot Vosne-Romanée Les Suchots 1er Cr 2009. I was at dinner with a group and I said to make sure you send it back for refund. Silence! Again, I said don't let the Burgundians gt away with this, it's why premox has been allowed to persist for so long. No comments. I then said if it was a Penfolds wine, you'd pursue refund? Bemusement. Unbelievable what the old world gets away with.

[crusty2]

one of the better articles I have read on TCA testing
https://www.winesandvines.com/news/article/2 ... ty-Control
several passages to note

Silver Oak has purchased a significant number of individually screened corks for bottling this year, and Schleussner said those corks came from Cork Supply, Amorim, Portocork and Scott Labs. She said the winery already expects few problems because ever since that badly tainted imperial, Silver Oak has reduced its rate of corked bottles to less than 0.5%.
She said she's no longer worried about the "real stinkers," but is still concerned about the corks on the threshold of perception or others contaminated by different compounds that may not register as TCA. A career working with analytical equipment has also taught her that machines can fail to perform as expected.

De Jesus said Amorim's efforts have been rewarded by not one, but two, global insurance companies willing to back the company's guarantee behind every cork certified through the NDtech process

Good news to see only 0.5% are going to be buggered if the machines work correctly

NDtech is "Nil Detect" (I did not see it so it was never there) not "Zero Defect"

[crusty2]

Somebody taking the sellers of ndtech corks to court for TCA failures

https://www.winebusiness.com/news/?go=getArt ... aid=202305

[Waiters Friend]

I was at the Coonawarra Roadshow in Perth yesterday, and myself and an industry professional were surprised to find one producer offering a 20 year old wine from magnum - and it was corked. Certainly in my experience behind the tasting table, you tasted every bottle you uncorked before serving. Perhaps this is something that has been forgotten given the prevalence of screwcaps.

[TiggerK]

Somebody taking the sellers of ndtech corks to court for TCA failures

https://www.winebusiness.com/news/?go=getArt ... aid=202305

Wine critic James Suckling rated the RGP 2015 Pinot Noir a 79 after he sampled a corked bottle, according to the lawsuit. Suckling had rated the 2014 vintage a 92. The subsequent vintage 2016 received a 90-plus rating.

That's stunningly appalling that a critic would rate a wine low because it was corked. Surely you'd just say the wine was corked, and therefore not scored at all until you taste a non-faulty bottle???


(Mind you a part of me says good on him, rate it how you find it, teach em not to risk using corks!)

[Ozzie W]

Will be very interesting to see how this one pans out.

[TiggerK]

I was at the Coonawarra Roadshow in Perth yesterday, and myself and an industry professional were surprised to find one producer offering a 20 year old wine from magnum - and it was corked. Certainly in my experience behind the tasting table, you tasted every bottle you uncorked before serving. Perhaps this is something that has been forgotten given the prevalence of screwcaps.

I'm sure many of us have similar stories of producers pouring corked wines at tastings or cellar doors, I know I do.

One of these three reasons no doubt..

1) Whoever tested the wine is insensitive to TCA.
2) No one tested the wine, pop and start pouring.
3) 'Oh, just pour it anyway, most people won't even notice'.

[phillisc]

I was at the Coonawarra Roadshow in Perth yesterday, and myself and an industry professional were surprised to find one producer offering a 20 year old wine from magnum - and it was corked. Certainly in my experience behind the tasting table, you tasted every bottle you uncorked before serving. Perhaps this is something that has been forgotten given the prevalence of screwcaps.

I'm sure many of us have similar stories of producers pouring corked wines at tastings or cellar doors, I know I do.

One of these three reasons no doubt..

1) Whoever tested the wine is insensitive to TCA.
2) No one tested the wine, pop and start pouring.
3) 'Oh, just pour it anyway, most people won't even notice'.

Allan/Tim, think this may have been the same producer that we had here at Adelaide...there were 2-3 magnums that I thought would show better.
Will report with some notes soon.
Cheers
Craig

[swirler]

I was at the Coonawarra Roadshow in Perth yesterday, and myself and an industry professional were surprised to find one producer offering a 20 year old wine from magnum - and it was corked. Certainly in my experience behind the tasting table, you tasted every bottle you uncorked before serving. Perhaps this is something that has been forgotten given the prevalence of screwcaps.

I'm sure many of us have similar stories of producers pouring corked wines at tastings or cellar doors, I know I do.

One of these three reasons no doubt..

1) Whoever tested the wine is insensitive to TCA.
2) No one tested the wine, pop and start pouring.
3) 'Oh, just pour it anyway, most people won't even notice'.

Spot on!

[swirler]

Somebody taking the sellers of ndtech corks to court for TCA failures

https://www.winebusiness.com/news/?go=getArt ... aid=202305

Wine critic James Suckling rated the RGP 2015 Pinot Noir a 79 after he sampled a corked bottle, according to the lawsuit. Suckling had rated the 2014 vintage a 92. The subsequent vintage 2016 received a 90-plus rating.

That's stunningly appalling that a critic would rate a wine low because it was corked. Surely you'd just say the wine was corked, and therefore not scored at all until you taste a non-faulty bottle???


(Mind you a part of me says good on him, rate it how you find it, teach em not to risk using corks!)

Another unpopular James!

I think the point was that many of the bottles produced were corked. Maybe they opened a few and they were all the same. If you are trying to give an idea to the public what a wine tastes like, then I don't see what's wrong with this (assuming my assumption is correct )

Edit: I missed your last paragraph before I typed the above.

[n4sir]

I was at the Coonawarra Roadshow in Perth yesterday, and myself and an industry professional were surprised to find one producer offering a 20 year old wine from magnum - and it was corked. Certainly in my experience behind the tasting table, you tasted every bottle you uncorked before serving. Perhaps this is something that has been forgotten given the prevalence of screwcaps.

Haha, at the Coonawarra Roadshow last Friday night in Adelaide, Rymill was serving a 2005 Cabernet Sauvignon magnum which was also corked. Coincidence? I guess it's one way of getting rid of unsaleable stock...

To be honest I was a little shocked at some of the blatantly faulty wine that was being poured - Redman had two corked wines (and one full of brett), while Zema Estate and Ladbroke Grove should check/get rid of their older barrels if the brett levels in those wines are anything to go by...

Cheers,
Ian

[George Krashos]

I had a corked 2000 Mt Mary Quintet the other month. Contacted the winery who asked me to send it back for Sam Middleton to have a look at, which I eventually got around to. They sent me a new vintage replacement - all good - but I was wondering whether he actually did check it or whether they just want evidence of a 3/4 drunk return before they provide a replacement ...

-- George Krashos

[Ozzie W]

At our Melbourne offline on Friday -- 1986 Tahbilk Cabernet Sauvignon Bin 73

Such a pity! I was really looking forward to trying an older Tahbilk.

[Mike Hawkins]

A badly corked 1990 Yalumba Oaktavius. Perhaps the most overt TCA I have come across in a few years

[JamieBahrain]

I had a corked 2000 Mt Mary Quintet the other month. Contacted the winery who asked me to send it back for Sam Middleton to have a look at, which I eventually got around to. They sent me a new vintage replacement - all good - but I was wondering whether he actually did check it or whether they just want evidence of a 3/4 drunk return before they provide a replacement ...

-- George Krashos

I’m not sure if the answer George but I like the general policy that seems to be in practice in Australia. Far better than abroad though I do make a big effort to return TCA wine and seek replacement - going as far as carrying it back to the country of origin

[Chuck]

A bit of kudos for those struggling with perception. At a Penfolds Recorking Clinic about 10 years ago a Penfolds 1990 Bin 90A. It stank and everyone in the room could smell it including N4sir. They tried to replace it with a Grange but finally replaced from their stash a few days later. Sparky looked after me. BTW where is she now?

With most wines I drink now under screw cap a corked wine is a rarity. No longer have to rely on the cork gods.

Carl

[Rossco]

.
Upfront .. I HATE Corked wine! Beyond logic, beyond rationed thinking, it REALLY annoys me!

So just this week

Fattorie Parri Chianti Montespertoli Riserva 2015 .... badly Corked

then a second

Fattorie Parri Chianti Montespertoli Riserva 2015 mildly corked, 'scalped'.

Both down the drain!

.

I had one of these last night and if i recall the closure was a diam. However i did wonder at the time if
there was some mild TCA present as the fruit seemed 'stripped' and a little dull. I thought how on earth did
this get 94 points. Good mid-week quaffing, but simple and (upon reflection) a little rustic. Not disappointing
mind you, great with some pasta/pizza/bbq..... but no where near a 94. So judging by your experience above
Gavin, maybe mine was a little faulty as well.

[Gavin Trott]

.
Upfront .. I HATE Corked wine! Beyond logic, beyond rationed thinking, it REALLY annoys me!

So just this week

Fattorie Parri Chianti Montespertoli Riserva 2015 .... badly Corked

then a second

Fattorie Parri Chianti Montespertoli Riserva 2015 mildly corked, 'scalped'.

Both down the drain!

.

Diam, but definitely faulty. The first two I had were both excellent, easily 94 points, great wines.

The next three, all corked, to varying degrees.

Damn tree bark!

.

I had one of these last night and if i recall the closure was a diam. However i did wonder at the time if
there was some mild TCA present as the fruit seemed 'stripped' and a little dull. I thought how on earth did
this get 94 points. Good mid-week quaffing, but simple and (upon reflection) a little rustic. Not disappointing
mind you, great with some pasta/pizza/bbq..... but no where near a 94. So judging by your experience above
Gavin, maybe mine was a little faulty as well.

[Mike Hawkins]

A badly corked 1990 Yalumba Oaktavius. Perhaps the most overt TCA I have come across in a few years

Yalumba kindly replaced it with the current release

[Gary W]

I've had quite a few DIAM closed wines that were stripped/corked. It's not immune...but less odds.
Had a run of corked wines recently. I love it when you have a wine waiter that can't pick cork taint...

[JamieBahrain]

1964 Bartolo Mascarello Barolo corked. Pushing a grand a bottle these days. Maybe I ask MT for a refund. I've seen her cellar. ;-0

[Rossco]

I had one of these last night and if i recall the closure was a diam. However i did wonder at the time if
there was some mild TCA present as the fruit seemed 'stripped' and a little dull. I thought how on earth did
this get 94 points. Good mid-week quaffing, but simple and (upon reflection) a little rustic. Not disappointing
mind you, great with some pasta/pizza/bbq..... but no where near a 94. So judging by your experience above
Gavin, maybe mine was a little faulty as well.

I am 4 of these down of a 6 pack. None have been 100%. Wont be buying from this producer again