Is Rockford Basket Press Worth the Fuss?

[Ian S]

So it's competing with a handicap to sit in my wine budget.

You have a wine budget
Do you ever stick to it?

[Polymer]

I don't think that BP is boring and like Mike ( whom I assume cellars the wine professionally ) I often think they are consumed too young. I love them aged, when soft and supple and they speak of a style from the past- the benefits too of perfect cellaring are the fruit is still fresh and youthful primary/secondary nuances mix beautifully with unfaded tertiary notes. I have had a few old BP's from the natural cellars at Rockford and they were boring and porty- tell tale under the bed like storage.

I don't think it is the storage that makes it boring...they're just not that interesting, even with age. This isn't the same thing as say they're not very good wines..they are...Outside of the ripeness (which is less of an issue with age), I can't think of anything wrong with the wine...but the whole experience is entirely forgettable.

Oddly enough, I find the SVS wines a lot more interesting...

[JamieBahrain]

Fair enough. In my experience the passively stored Basket Press was really drab. I recall one of Robert's sons proudly presenting a few nips of some old BP's he was decanting for a family BBQ and they were old and porty. Nothing like my experiences with active cellaring of BP.

I have raided a case of 2001 BP this month. I tried one in Australia and I know its not a popular vintage but at 16 years I can still pick CM's descriptors off Wine Front fresh as a daisy along with some evolution. For my palate, most passively stored Aussie shiraz is pretty boring with bottle age. And I can not fathom how those old BP's at cellar door could be considered mature wines- I see this with my tasting group even with badly stored Bordeaux being viewed as positive evolution.

The SVS wines from early years were amazing. Helbig was mind blowing. The super concentrated blackberry beast too, Hofmann. Flaxman from the Eden Valley was great too but never better than Henschke IMO.

I've been cellaring 96 SVS for my sister in law. What are they worth now anyone? I was thinking of making an offer and doing another BP tasting !

[JamieBahrain]

Last night, on a rooftop in Hong Kong in balmy weather the 2001 Basket Press showed beautifully. Temperature management was well done and the company was the Henschke Mt Edelstone 1990, Domaine A 2004 Cabernet blend, Mt Mary Quintet 1997 and a D'arenberg Dead Arm 2006. Basket Press did very well, was most people's WOTN with its advantage of professional cellaring.

Mt Ed and Mt Mary were not the best bottles with my experience with both. Domaine A was very good and the Dead Arm under screw-cap a little all over the place and time may heal !

[cuttlefish]

No

[dave vino]

Can we lock this thread already

[Brucer]

I have been buying BP starting with the 80s. I buy it every year, without fail. Its a great wine to show the variations of the vintages, and if its a great year, I buy more then my allocation at retail. Some years are better then others, but its a very good honest Barossa shiraz, which I love to drink.
Its well priced, and a great drink. Its worth the fuss.

[Rossco]

I do have a fondness for BP, however i actually prefer the Rifle Range. I think its a much more interesting wine, with a sense of place, definitive characteristics and....dare i say it, not as popular as BP, which makes it easier to acquire.

[Scotty vino]

I don't see much 'fuss' about it. It's not too expensive and it's pretty easy to get (well in SA anyway).
I do agree that RR is just as good in most cases.

As with Wendouree there's an element of mystique about it which is something the producer
could milk the s#*t out of if they so desired (torbreck anyone ?). Fortunately their aim is true.

[JamieBahrain]

I don't see much 'fuss' about it.

Interesting, the fuss is pressing beyond our shores.

I have just had various wine offers in HKG with Basket Press being offered at $100 a bottle and Thousand Candles at $25 ! Even 1999 Tahbilk 1860 Vines shiraz was $50. They all sold out at those prices BTW.

[Scotty vino]

I don't see much 'fuss' about it.

Interesting, the fuss is pressing beyond our shores.

I have just had various wine offers in HKG with Basket Press being offered at $100 a bottle and Thousand Candles at $25 ! Even 1999 Tahbilk 1860 Vines shiraz was $50. They all sold out at those prices BTW.

I guess it's what we consider comes under the banner of fuss.
To me something like Sine Qua Non is something that is incredibly hyped up. I haven't tried it but
to get on the mailing list let alone sample it seems over the top.

As for Basket press I see it in a couple of local watering holes in the mid to high 80's over the bar.
There's a few restaurants in my area that have it for around 100 on the wine list.

[rooman]

Last night, on a rooftop in Hong Kong in balmy weather the 2001 Basket Press showed beautifully. Temperature management was well done and the company was the Henschke Mt Edelstone 1990, Domaine A 2004 Cabernet blend, Mt Mary Quintet 1997 and a D'arenberg Dead Arm 2006. Basket Press did very well, was most people's WOTN with its advantage of professional cellaring.

Mt Ed and Mt Mary were not the best bottles with my experience with both. Domaine A was very good and the Dead Arm under screw-cap a little all over the place and time may heal !

Jamie

How did the Dead Arm go? I've only got one DA in the cellar - it was a gift years ago and it is a '06. I was wondering whether to hold or should i open it now. I am happy leaving it alone unless its as good as it will get.

As for Basket Press, I am in the same camp at Polymer (which is a worry) but I don't find it particularly interesting. In this case, I have half a dozen of the '04 tucked away and the first bottle I tried last year out of the pack was ok, but nothing to get excited about. I still keep coming back to cool climate shiraz as far more interesting.

Mark

[JamieBahrain]

Hi Mark,

Leave the BP 04 til 2024. Try again and if you don't enjoy them double your money?

The Dead Arm wasn't decanted and I'd suggest it needed an hour. The wine seemed un-integrated and needing more time in cellar. It was certainly drab in comparison to the Basket Press.

[Dragzworthy]

Last night, on a rooftop in Hong Kong in balmy weather the 2001 Basket Press showed beautifully. Temperature management was well done and the company was the Henschke Mt Edelstone 1990, Domaine A 2004 Cabernet blend, Mt Mary Quintet 1997 and a D'arenberg Dead Arm 2006. Basket Press did very well, was most people's WOTN with its advantage of professional cellaring.

Mt Ed and Mt Mary were not the best bottles with my experience with both. Domaine A was very good and the Dead Arm under screw-cap a little all over the place and time may heal !

Jamie

How did the Dead Arm go? I've only got one DA in the cellar - it was a gift years ago and it is a '06. I was wondering whether to hold or should i open it now. I am happy leaving it alone unless its as good as it will get.

As for Basket Press, I am in the same camp at Polymer (which is a worry) but I don't find it particularly interesting. In this case, I have half a dozen of the '04 tucked away and the first bottle I tried last year out of the pack was ok, but nothing to get excited about. I still keep coming back to cool climate shiraz as far more interesting.

Mark

Hi Mark
I had a Dead Arm '06 last night and was drinking extremely well, oozed dark fruits with leather, joyful stuff but will easily hold another 5yrs as well.

[Dragzworthy]

Hi Mark,

Leave the BP 04 til 2024. Try again and if you don't enjoy them double your money?

The Dead Arm wasn't decanted and I'd suggest it needed an hour. The wine seemed un-integrated and needing more time in cellar. It was certainly drab in comparison to the Basket Press.

Just saw after I posted re: Dead Arm.
I decanted for three hours and ''twas great

[rooman]

Hi Mark,

Leave the BP 04 til 2024. Try again and if you don't enjoy them double your money?

The Dead Arm wasn't decanted and I'd suggest it needed an hour. The wine seemed un-integrated and needing more time in cellar. It was certainly drab in comparison to the Basket Press.

Thanks Jamie and Dragz.

It does seems a statement of the obvious but it seems so many of our top shiraz and cab savs need to get out to around the 17-20 year mark to go to the next level. My top Aus wines of the year so far have been a 2000 Mt Langi and a '99 Voyager Cab Sav. I have tried both wines previously and been disappointed and once again I have realised I have wasted bottles by drinking them too early.

I also suspect 2004 was a particularly tannic year as both the BP and a Mt Ed I had last year from that vintage have indicted they still need lots of time.

So back to the back of the cellar for the BP.

Cheers
Mark

[DJ1980]

Interesting topic. I think it used to be worth the fuss. There are so many good wineries/winemakers these days that it can be a little lost lately.

Also, "typical" Barossa Shiraz isn't as popular as it once was. Having said that, it is an iconic, well built wine. I'll continue to purchase a few bottles each year and see how they develop.

[JamieBahrain]

With all due respect, I think Robert should change the pictured message to 15+ years.

But there's no false advertising on this back label. And having revisited the back label message and drinking older actively cellared BP, I have a new energy for the wine. I'll keep buying religiously every year.

[Cactus]

Colleague of wine again dissapointed with his BP over the weekend. 2002 i think. Mentioned it might have suffered from poor corks of the period. He described it as stripped of fruit. Not undrinkable corked. But just stripped of fruit.

[odyssey]

Colleague of wine again dissapointed with his BP over the weekend. 2002 i think. Mentioned it might have suffered from poor corks of the period. He described it as stripped of fruit. Not undrinkable corked. But just stripped of fruit.

Potentially extremely low-level TCA, not detectable as off or tainted but still enough to mute the senses.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3791788/

"Surprisingly, suppression was observed even at extremely low (i.e., attomolar) TCA concentrations"

This is why TCA is such a pain in the arse, you can't always tell that it's there but it makes a wine look (unfairly) bad unless you have a couple more to validate it.

[TiggerK]

Yeah, sounds a lot like low level TCA.

[JakeBarnes]

Colleague of wine again dissapointed with his BP over the weekend. 2002 i think. Mentioned it might have suffered from poor corks of the period. He described it as stripped of fruit. Not undrinkable corked. But just stripped of fruit.

Bring on the Rockford screw caps! I think all the whites are under screw cap now, just need to convince Rocky to offer the reds that way now

[Polymer]

Or change the bottle/corks..

Their odd bottle shape probably influences why they use such short corks..which probably limits the quality level they're getting.....and I don't know how much that makes a difference TCA wise...but it must make a difference in the overall quality...

[phillisc]

Or Jake what Pennies and Petaluma did in years gone by...I have 02 Riesling with both closures and 3 vintages of St Henri with cork and stelvin.

Cheers
Craig

[Polymer]

But isn't that because of the export market that someone would still do both?

Either you think SC is a viable alternative or you don't....If you do but offer both it is because certain markets (US, China) will demand cork....If you do you'd not want to offer cork for any reason other than overwhelming market demand (which isn't the case in AU for cork). If you don't think it is viable you won't offer SC to your customers for any reason...

I'm not saying a choice wouldn't be great...In fact I'd love to be able to buy wines under both simply to do a comparative tasting down the line...But I'm not sure it makes any sense except under certain conditions...

[Michael R]

In fact I'd love to be able to buy wines under both simply to do a comparative tasting down the line......

Lakes Folly Cabs

[JamieBahrain]

Geez I can taste BP under screw cap now....ick.

[JakeBarnes]

Or Jake what Pennies and Petaluma did in years gone by...I have 02 Riesling with both closures and 3 vintages of St Henri with cork and stelvin.

Cheers
Craig

Have you compared them Craig? I think it would be great if they offered both but I guess there would be an added cost that way. Personally Rockford is pretty much the only wine I buy under cork and it irks me to know that in every case I buy one of them is going to turn out to be a dud. $60 odd bucks wasted if that's a BP.

Everything I've read suggests wine ages well under screwcap, possibly even better than cork, though I've never tried two of the same wine with different closures that have been stored together side by side.

[Ian S]

But isn't that because of the export market that someone would still do both?

Either you think SC is a viable alternative or you don't....If you do but offer both it is because certain markets (US, China) will demand cork....If you do you'd not want to offer cork for any reason other than overwhelming market demand (which isn't the case in AU for cork). If you don't think it is viable you won't offer SC to your customers for any reason...

I'm not saying a choice wouldn't be great...In fact I'd love to be able to buy wines under both simply to do a comparative tasting down the line...But I'm not sure it makes any sense except under certain conditions...

A subject that very much interests me and I love hearing of such comparative tastings.

I suppose there might be the odd producer who sees the debate as not finally decided, and bottle under both to hedge their bets and allow further direct comparison. Maybe even one or two who might hand bottle a few bottles under cork to provide that comparison? Presumably there have been more who practice the reverse scenario (including some prestigious names such as Penfolds at their top end) who bottle a small amount under screwcap as part of ongoing comparative trials.

[Mike Hawkins]

The 04 Penfolds Special Bins came under both seals. Not ready to take 2 for the team just yet!