Hacker wrote:What annoys me is when you walk in to a cellar door and the attendant starts saying 'this wine won a gold medal blah blah and got 95 points blah blah and has nearly sold out blah blah exclusive blah trophy blah" and the wine is very ordinary. Happens quite a bit in the Hunter.
Ha! Couldn't agree more and trust me it is common in WA too. I call this the Cellar Door Litmus Test. If the cellar door attendant mentions any 'awards' within the first 2 mins I will immediately turn off.
Whats wrong with an enthusiastic cellar staff member trying to talk up and sell their employers wines? Correct me if I am wrong,after all it's their job. It's a proven fact - show medals sell wines.
Hacker wrote:What annoys me is when you walk in to a cellar door and the attendant starts saying 'this wine won a gold medal blah blah and got 95 points blah blah and has nearly sold out blah blah exclusive blah trophy blah" and the wine is very ordinary. Happens quite a bit in the Hunter.
Ha! Couldn't agree more and trust me it is common in WA too. I call this the Cellar Door Litmus Test. If the cellar door attendant mentions any 'awards' within the first 2 mins I will immediately turn off.
Whats wrong with an enthusiastic cellar staff member trying to talk up and sell their employers wines? Correct me if I am wrong,after all it's their job. It's a proven fact - show medals sell wines.
If your job is to just repeat the same thing over and over and tell people what the wine tastes like, smells, what it scored, what medals it won, just get a recording or better yet, write it on something where people can read that stuff if they want. You can then fill your spiel with stuff that actually means something and may give people a slight education or information on the wine or winery or the vineyard itself.... Facts are always interesting...fluff tends to not be...
Hacker wrote:What annoys me is when you walk in to a cellar door and the attendant starts saying 'this wine won a gold medal blah blah and got 95 points blah blah and has nearly sold out blah blah exclusive blah trophy blah" and the wine is very ordinary. Happens quite a bit in the Hunter.
Ha! Couldn't agree more and trust me it is common in WA too. I call this the Cellar Door Litmus Test. If the cellar door attendant mentions any 'awards' within the first 2 mins I will immediately turn off.
Whats wrong with an enthusiastic cellar staff member trying to talk up and sell their employers wines? Correct me if I am wrong,after all it's their job. It's a proven fact - show medals sell wines.
There are certain ways of delivering a message. If you are bombarded with a rote sales pitch and don't immediately react by buying the wine then you are obviously not a person that understands our wine. An enthusiastic cellar staff member that is trying to talk up their employers wines is a different story. That is mostly an enjoyable experience.
For sales pitches, I reckon the guy at Coldstream Hills CD is the worse. All he talks about is 'the deals' as he flicks from page to page in his tasting book thing. If I go there and see him at the counter on approach I just turn around and go somewhere else.
Like people say way too many great wineries around to put up with any nonsense. For every winery I shop at there are 5 others I'm wanting to try.
Polymer wrote:So do most of you consider a poor experience:
Not getting to taste all of the wines Not having the wines you want to try available Not being able to try the wines you want for free
Premium wines not available for tasting is a huge negative for me.
These wines don't cost that much to make, and to expect consumers to take a "gamble" on these premium wines at such high price is a bit much. If the wineries are truly confident that their premium wines deliver quality on par with the price they are trying to charge, they should be up for the challenge and have these wines available for tasting (a fee if they must).
Fortunately there are many wineries both in Australia and internationally, so most wineries that gets complacent/arrogant can easily be replaced in consumer's purchasing lists.
As we're onto what's good or annoying about a cellar door visit:
Good - Understanding the different types of customers, from curious novice to gnarled enthusiast. They often need a different approach and they should never favour one over the other. - Having the wines showing their best, at the right temperature, checked for TCA and oxidation and in appropriate and clean glasses - Speaking with people involved in the process, but that doesn't necessarily need to be the winemaker. Even someone involved in marketing or logistics can give an interesting insight. - If an appointment is made, both parties should be punctual (one winery in Barolo has on both occasions forgotten we'd made an appointment, on the 1st occasion we rearranged for later in the week, on the other a family member stepped in to run the tasting) - A small charge for a high-priced wine, or for the tasting is perfectly reasonable. In Italy there is often bottled water, salami, bread & grissini freshly laid out. Typically this is done with no thought to charging for it, nor any willingness to accept any payment for it. In such situations, and even if the wines are a bit average, I'd always buy a bottle of something, even if it's destined for a lunch or picnic during the holiday. - Having museum stock / back inventory available in addition to the current releases. This isn't a must, but is very much appreciated. One instance springs to mind, at Chateau Fuisse. We'd got in to a discussion about vintage weather and the person leading the tasting was bemoaning that their 2003 didn't sell though due to a general perception of that vintage, but he felt it was a very good wine. I said I'd be happy to buy a bottle if they had any based on his recommendation, so he rummaged a bottle out (I think he might have even put the label on there and then). The wine was good and the flexibility (on both sides) was worthwhile. - Something for spouses or even children to occupy themselves with if they're not into wine / are getting a bit bored. I know one or two places that have a nespresso coffee machine - not the best coffee at all, but sit a bored spouse down with a coffee and they'll be much more tolerant of their partner taking time to taste (and buy).
Bad - Marketing spiel reeled off without thinking about it is incredibly annoying. As is bullshit. Wine enthusiasts are often too clued up for badly trained staff. Likewise attempted pressure selling, only experienced once at a well-known producer of Vino Nobile di Montepulciano - I was shocked by the intensity. - Keep the ego in check. Occasionally a winemaker or family member will get a bit ahead of themselves. They're on their own patch and so feel relaxed. Sometimes this brings out excessive egos or prejudices - even to the point of sexism/racism in the most extreme cases. - High charges for a tasting, with few or modest wines available. As mentioned above, I'm happy with a modest charge and would even encourage that. I don't appreciate €20 a head for a modest Valpolicella producer, or €10 a head for a tasting of pretty poor and ill-kept wines at a famous old Barolo producer resting on laurels last earned 40 years ago. - Tiny pours, but also over-generous pours. The former being barely a tasting sip, the latter causing me regret that I throw the majority of the pour into a spittoon once I've tasted it in 3-4 sips. It just feels disrespectful to the person pouring, who may well have made the wine, but I've no desire to get drunk at a winery/ cellar door.
Ian S wrote:As we're onto what's good or annoying about a cellar door visit:
- Keep the ego in check. Occasionally a winemaker or family member will get a bit ahead of themselves. They're on their own patch and so feel relaxed. Sometimes this brings out excessive egos or prejudices - even to the point of sexism/racism in the most extreme cases.
regards Ian
Don't quite understand this Ian, Are you suggesting there are winemakers out there with excessive egos? well I never....
One thing, if a winery only produces a barrel or two of an Icon level wine, maybe they dont think the best way to use the wine is have it on tasting for the hens party every Saturday.
Rocky wrote: Ha! Couldn't agree more and trust me it is common in WA too. I call this the Cellar Door Litmus Test. If the cellar door attendant mentions any 'awards' within the first 2 mins I will immediately turn off.
Whats wrong with an enthusiastic cellar staff member trying to talk up and sell their employers wines? Correct me if I am wrong,after all it's their job. It's a proven fact - show medals sell wines.
There are certain ways of delivering a message. If you are bombarded with a rote sales pitch and don't immediately react by buying the wine then you are obviously not a person that understands our wine. An enthusiastic cellar staff member that is trying to talk up their employers wines is a different story. That is mostly an enjoyable experience.
Maybe so, but what people don't seem to realise is that the average cellar door person is not an experienced wine buyer (obviously not, it's almost always the most expensive way to buy wine in Australia). So talking up the wines, what they taste like or what they have won, is generally the best way to make a sale. If people don't like it, then they have the option not to go back to that cellar. Similarly the pour, or the availability of the premium range of wines. I have never had anything less or more in my glass than I have asked for, at least not after the first pour (as it gets thrown out - I walk out). They are there to serve you a taste of their product and if they won't, your wallet has the option of not buying their product. It's as simple as that. Often my tastings have been done in wine shops, bottle shops, or occasionally those big GF&W shows - as well as CDs. But I reckon the best way to get good service at the CD is not to treat the person behind the 'bar' as a servant - something the average punter has a lot of trouble with...
Jonathan
"It is impossible to build a fool proof system; because fools are so ingenious."
did three days in the coonawarra and every single cellar door attendant was fantastic. Some great conversations across the board and not all about wine. For the most part my buddy and i were the only ones in the cellar door when tasting so that makes it a bit easier. What I liked about the Coonawarra was that every winery had good things to say about their competitors and it wasn't forced. Seemed quite tight knit as opposed to other regions I've visited. I tasted at Parker estate very late in the day. Right on their closing time and the staff member there was really welcoming and had us set up and tasting in no time. You sometimes get the 'oh come on we're about to close' grunt but this was the total opposite. We stayed and chatted for ages. We mentioned that we had tasted at Wynns the day before and missed out tasting the 09 JR. As it happened the lady serving us also worked at Wynns. Needless to say we were back Wynns the following day and we were taken care of.
Overall a feather in the cap for the Coonawarra region.
There's a fine line between fishing and just standing on the shore like an idiot.
Scotty vino wrote:did three days in the coonawarra and every single cellar door attendant was fantastic. Some great conversations across the board and not all about wine. For the most part my buddy and i were the only ones in the cellar door when tasting so that makes it a bit easier. What I liked about the Coonawarra was that every winery had good things to say about their competitors and it wasn't forced. Seemed quite tight knit as opposed to other regions I've visited. I tasted at Parker estate very late in the day. Right on their closing time and the staff member there was really welcoming and had us set up and tasting in no time. You sometimes get the 'oh come on we're about to close' grunt but this was the total opposite. We stayed and chatted for ages. We mentioned that we had tasted at Wynns the day before and missed out tasting the 09 JR. As it happened the lady serving us also worked at Wynns. Needless to say we were back Wynns the following day and we were taken care of.
Overall a feather in the cap for the Coonawarra region.
We had the same experience a couple of years back.
Jonathan
"It is impossible to build a fool proof system; because fools are so ingenious."
phillisc wrote:Yes Kirsty and Erica are fantastic, think Kirsty works at Wynns.
Cheers Craig
I couldn't tell you their names but really nice people. My mate and I got into a long chat at redmans about screwcap V cork which was interesting. At Patrick we had a really good chat about french/american oak treatment and it was really eye opening. With my primitive/primary palate it was good to further my understanding. We discussed the dreaded 2011 vintage at quite a few wineries and it was good to get a grasp on some of the difficult aspects of wine making. I also did quite a few re tastings and it wasn't an issue in any of the CDs. Good glassware and decent pourings also added to the experience. From memory the only paid tasting was $5 to sample the 'chook shed' Port at Patrick of Coonawarra. Koonara was a great place to finish day 2 as it was 10 steps from where i was staying at the pub and the car was parked for the day..
There's a fine line between fishing and just standing on the shore like an idiot.
Ian S wrote:As we're onto what's good or annoying about a cellar door visit:
- Keep the ego in check. Occasionally a winemaker or family member will get a bit ahead of themselves. They're on their own patch and so feel relaxed. Sometimes this brings out excessive egos or prejudices - even to the point of sexism/racism in the most extreme cases.
regards Ian
Don't quite understand this Ian, Are you suggesting there are winemakers out there with excessive egos? well I never....
Hi Sean It's worth qualifying my statement. Having an opinion is no problem whatsoever - indeed we'd be a little disappointed if no opinion was offered, and being forthright is perfectly ok. It's just those occasions where that bubbles over into bigotry or bullshit. It's pretty rare but I wish it were rarer. One instance of a South African winemaker making a very unfunny joke about Nelson Mandela 'holidaying' on Robben Island was perhaps the most shocking. Maybe he though our mostly white faces would have similar attitudes to his own social scene.
dave vino wrote:For sales pitches, I reckon the guy at Coldstream Hills CD is the worse. All he talks about is 'the deals' as he flicks from page to page in his tasting book thing. If I go there and see him at the counter on approach I just turn around and go somewhere else.
Like people say way too many great wineries around to put up with any nonsense. For every winery I shop at there are 5 others I'm wanting to try.
Really? I've only done like two cellar door visits and Thia was one...assuming you mean the old boy at cold stream hills? He was quite charming to my Wife and I and even managed to teach me all about importation laws in Singapore on wine (they ship a lot to Hong Kong and Singapore). Pretty great Chardonnay to boot.
