Cellaring wine - 21+ years

[davowade]

Hi all,

Looking for a recommendation for a wine type/style that will cellar for 21 or more years, the purpose of which will be to celebrate the year my son was born. When I was young, my parents bought me a magnum of (rather cheap, but meaningful) sparkling wine for my 21st birthday. The idea was great, but Bernadino Spumante (a cheap NZ sparkling) was not. With the birth of my son this year I would like to recreate the same idea, but step up the quality somewhat.

Ideally I will be looking to get a 2013 vintage (depending on how it turns out, time will tell) or if that fails, just a really good wine that will stand the test of time. My options are really twofold:

1: A wine for his 21st birthday, perhaps a vintage champagne.
2: A wine for his 30th. Here I am thinking a big, Henschke hill of grace style wine. Something for a (hopefully) more refined taste.

I realise this all goes out the window if he decides to spend his life drinking alcopops and corona (not bloody likely), but i'd rather put the effort in now to organise it.

Would love to hear your thoughts, thanks in advance!

Dave.

[rens]

Ok. I'll have a crack:
1: One of the guys who's into Champers is better at answering this than me so will not comment.
2a: Grange, but expect to pay 1K (with the way the prices are going) come the 2013.
b: Hill of Grace is a great option. It will be less expensive than Grange but only by a few $100s.
c: A Bordeaux of some description. Others are again better placed to advise on the French stuff.
d: Wynns John Riddoch may go to 30 years. I know a lot of the 1980's stuff is still drinking well.
e: Vintage port. The good stuff will last for over 100 years so you could buy some for his/her 30th or even 50th, 60th etc.

[Scotty vino]

My father has put down 3 long range bottles for all the grand kids. 21st's - 18th bdays. etc etc

Grange
HOG
Wendouree shiraz.

[Mivvy]

Early days for 2013 in Europe but it has been very wet to date and is not looking promising.

[simon1980]

Oh, I'm going through this at the moment. It obviously depends on how the vintage turns out, but here is what I am doing (for the very tricky 2011 australian vintage):

Hunter Sem...screwcapped should age perfectly. Pepper Tree Alluvius.
Clare Riesling. Grosset Polish Hill.
Hunter Shiraz. Thomas Kiss
Fletcher Nebbiolo.
Some WA Cab. Prob Cullen DM.
Some other Shiraz...maybe collector reserve.

However, the absolute best bet for future big birthdays is Vintage Port. I was lucky that it was a declared vintage in Porto, and I got stuck into Fonseca, Graham's and Taylor's (in double magnums no less). For an Aussie equivalent, I will also get some Stanton and Killeen vintage fortified (if you give them a bell, pop your name down for a magnum when released in a few years...they bottle about 100 a year).

Vintage Champagne will not be out for 8-10 years...if it is declared.

Good luck...half the fun is searching. But please, please ensure you store it correctly...

Simon1980

[Mike Hawkins]

As Simon indicated, even if there is a 2013 vintage in Champagne, the cellar-worthy ones wont be released until 2020 - 2025. I'd choose one with a reasonable whack of chardonnay - most BdNs wont last....

I'm not convinced HoG is at its peak at 30 years - my experience is that they start their slide at 25 (and earlier in weaker years)...... No doubt 2013 will be a vintage of the century in Bordeaux , so perhaps a 2nd growth (if the vintage is good of course)

[AndrewCowley]

As much as everyone mocked the recent price rises, may I suggest a 2010 Bin 389. Cheaper than a few other options being given and it should go the distance.

[phillisc]

Good point Andrew, I am seeing 2010 389 cheaper now than 4 months ago.

The price mocking comes in because the wineries that I like to support can have their annual wine increases in line with the CPI...there in lies the problem for those that think 8-10 the CPI is fair...aka ripoff.

Cheers Craig.

[tarija]

2013 is supposed to be good for most of Australia. Avoid the trendy wines, stick with the ones that have the track record and heritage to develop over 20 years:
- Wendouree Shiraz
- Wynns John Riddoch
- Moss Wood Cabernet
- Wolf Blass Black Label (have had good experience with a few bottles from the 80s recently)

Grange if you want to spend up (at least you'll have 5 years to save for it). Unsure about Hill of Grace, I've not yet had a HoG or Mt Edelstone at 20+ years that has been convincing - others may have better experiences.

Foreign (check weather in respective regions, a lot of flooding has happened in Europe in 2013):
Red:
- Barolo (budget around $100-$200/bottle)
- Left bank Bordeaux (Pontet Canet, Leoville Barton, Montrose)

Disregard Burgundy as it has been flooded recently.

White and fortified (superb value here)
- German riesling: Auslese level, or Gold Capsule Auslese, or Long Gold Capsule Auslese (if going all out) from JJ Prum. Great value here.
- Chenin blanc: Domaine Huet. Moelleux Le Mont, Moelleux Le Haut Lieu, Clos de Bourg - many incredible examples from the 40s and 60s still going strong.
- Hungarian Tokaji: enormous longevity. Get some tokaji that is 5 or 6 Puttonyos (Szepsy, Royal Tokaji Company, Oremus, Disnoko). Pure Essencia lasts for centuries but given their rarity it's too heartbreaking to open them.
- Sauternes: if the vintage is good. Yquem is almost guaranteed to last, Rieussec, Suiduiraut great too.
- Portuguese Port - whether vintage is declared or single quinta releases, this is a very safe bet to last the distance (Taylor, Fonseca, Niepoort, Cockburn, Quinta do Noval, Warre, Croft). Your son may giggle at Cockburn though.

In summary:
- For 21 years, you could go red, white or fortified.
- For 30 years, I think it's safer to go for something in the white and fortified list above.

[davowade]

Wow, this is more than I expected. Thanks everybody. I had not considered a port or fortified, but as soon as I mentioned it to the wife she was convinced. Wendouree Shiraz seems to be a good option, not one that I had considered. And a riesling is a great idea, if he doesn't like it then i'll have the lot myself. Keep the ideas coming guys, you're arming us with some great options!

Thanks again.

[kaos]

Seppelt Drumborg. save yourself $1000.......

[sparky]

Hopefully you got your timing right so you can hedge your bets and go with 2012 as well as the year of conception - after all, that's when the hard work was done! (Just don't tell your wife that...)

I'd buy what appeals to you as a self congratulatory toast for getting the offspring to their milestone years as it will be wasted on their tender palates unless you start training in the next few years.

Don't forget to buy along the years during bumper vintages and find an appropriate milestone to pin it to - soccer trophies, first girlfriend etc etc. That way you can't possibly be disappointed or under-prepared!

[damonpeyo]

Last weekend a friend opened 1988 Culenl DM, at 25 years it was brillant drop. Gave me a good insight how they are like over 20 years of age if kept right. It was very smooth, light, fruit notes will there, colour was almost brown. This was corked wine, with Screwcapped Cullen DM these days, it would even go further.

[damonpeyo]

Correction: I just re-looked at the photo of the Cullen wine, it's not Cullen DM just "Cullen Cab Sav/Merlot 1988" see photo in tasting thread.

[Mike Hawkins]

Tarija - I've had the 82 (x 2) and 86 (x 15) Mt Edelstone in recent years, and they are superb. I'm in no rush to drink either. I still think they often age better than HoG (but I'm probably in the minority there).

Mike

[odyssey]

Tarija - I've had the 82 (x 2) and 86 (x 15) Mt Edelstone in recent years, and they are superb. I'm in no rush to drink either. I still think they often age better than HoG (but I'm probably in the minority there).

Mike

The 94 is also entering a beautiful drinking window and is sitting at 19 years. Mt Ed is a good bet in a good year.

[simon1980]

Wendouree is indeed a good idea. Don't discount the blends, either...I'm sure some of the Cab dominant wines will go forever! There is the obvious issue of "needing to be on the list" to get Wendouree at about $50/bt. However, if you give them a bell, I am sure they will be happy to help...2years until the '13's will be out, though.

simon1980

[Hacker]

Wendouree is indeed a good idea. Don't discount the blends, either...I'm sure some of the Cab dominant wines will go forever! There is the obvious issue of "needing to be on the list" to get Wendouree at about $50/bt. However, if you give them a bell, I am sure they will be happy to help...2years until the '13's will be out, though.

simon1980

At the recent Wendouree offline the 1990 Cab malbec was a fair degree ahead of any of the shiraz's presented on the night, to my thoughts anyway. You really can't go wrong with the cab malbec, but in preference to the straight cab sav. Should last 30+ years, as will the shiraz.

[simon1980]

Indeed...I read the reports after commenting here. Seems to be a cracking choice for long term...especially given the price compared to Grange/HOG etc...

simon1980

[Sharkey]

For extra longevity and also a sense of occassion when you open the wine I would suggest buying some Magnums. I have had some fantastic magnums that were'nt too expensive for my kids 18th and 21st birthdays.

[phillisc]

For extra longevity and also a sense of occassion when you open the wine I would suggest buying some Magnums. I have had some fantastic magnums that weren't too expensive for my kids 18th and 21st birthdays.

Agreed and have done the same, wynns black labels, riddoch and michael, peter lehmann stonewell, Rockford BP and St Hallett OB, YY underhill, MM quintet, St henri, Tim adams aberfeldy, E&E BP, and a few others, can't wait always better drinking with a friend.

cheers craig.

[daz]

Correction: I just re-looked at the photo of the Cullen wine, it's not Cullen DM just "Cullen Cab Sav/Merlot 1988" see photo in tasting thread.

Yep, the cab/merl was named in honour of Vanya's mother Diana from the 2001 vintage.

[paulf]

I'm a bit late to the party on this, but as 2013 looks like a solid Vintage in Australia there should be a few wines around that will go that sort of distance.
A couple of people have mentioned Stanton and Killeen Vintage fortified, and this is what I'd buy. I cracked a 1992 S&K last week and it was seriously good. You've got another 5 or so years to wait before they are available though.
If it turns out to be a good year in Portugal, then vintage ports would be an extremely good option. Even if it isn't a generally declared year, unless the vintage is really poor, there will still be single quinta ports. In some ways this may be better for what you are looking for as the best of them should be right in their peak drinking window at 20 -30 years. The other option, which you could source just before 21 or 30 years would be finding a Colheita (single vintage Tawny). You'd probably have to source it from Portugal or maybe the Uk, but producers like Kopke have most years available.
If someone reminds me, I'll be able to give a pretty good idea of how the vintage was in the Douro at about mid October. I'll be spending some time in Porto and touring some wineries for a couple of weeks in late Sept and early Oct which will be right in the middle of harvest so I'll be hearing it from the horses mouth.