Buy new release or auction?

[donX]

Hi all,

I'm new to wines and have been educating myself mostly from online sources like this forum. Gavin was very kind to let me sign up a while ago so here comes my first post.

Having read some posts about buying from auction provides better value than new release in some cases, I'm just wondering what would you experienced wine drinkers do - one way or the other, or both?

Cheers,
Don

[Craig(NZ)]

Man its been yeeears since I went to a wine auction!! More than a dozen years! I should go sometime just for a look!

[TiggerK]

Hi Don, and welcome to the forum!

I think both is the way to go. Auctions do give you a chance to pick up older and/or hard to get wines, but there is always a risk associated with that, i.e no refunds if it's bad. Older wine can be an acquired taste in some instances, so trying as many different styles and age points as you can is always a good way to learn.

Cheers
TiggerK

[phillisc]

Speaking of which, who actually does a live auction these days??

Apart from the odd charity function where its more about my knob is bigger than yours, funny how black tie events bring out the best in them...or events like last weeks Barossa Vintage festival, where its largely trophy hunters, (although an imperial of 99 Basket Press for 2g's was quite a good buy, particularly next to current overblown Grange prices), there does not seem to be any live auctions any more.

I know it's purely economics, long auctions, 000s of lots, additional wages to pay etc etc...and all much easier doing it on the net...but used to love going to regular auctions in Adelaide.

Strange as it seems, very little was passed in...it was transparent and you could see who was bidding and I got dozens of fabulous buys over the years...pity

Cheers
Craig.

[donX]

Actually I've only just looked the online auctions, don't know about the physical ones at all. If anyone knows any physical auctions in Perth, I'd love to go have a look.

Yes I'm a bit worried about the risk of wines being bad from auctions, so far I've bought a few back vintages and they are pretty good. So keeping my finger crossed...

Cheers,
Don

[Moneyback]

Hi don,

I'm new to this site as well. My perspective is I don't have a lot of space for wine storage so I find that the suction sites allow me to get older wines without the inconvenience of storing them for years. Yes I'd love a massive cellar but its just not a reality at the moment in melbourne. One day. But for the moment I like using auction sites for older wines. Some great experiences and some so so.

Ps enjoying reading the forum.

[MarKofQuality]

I regularly do both store (wine merchant - both cellared and current release) and auctions (exclusively online).
AS WELL AS cellar door (some of them have back releases as well) and vineyard wine club purchases (both current release, back vintages and "specials").

My experience has been the odd bottle being corked or off from the auctions. Statistically however this is pretty rare, but you would be peeved if it was a prize Grange ...

Best value - probably some of the vineyard wine club purchases - my most frequented and favourites are Kilikanoon and Langmeil ...

[donX]

My preference is to buy new releases at between 15-40 while I'm learning more about wine, and my auction purchases are very much wines at the same price range. Yes I'm just not confident enough to buy anything over $100 at auction yet.

[Mike Hawkins]

Moneyback, I had the same issue and decided to use professional storage. While it dan be exxy, its worth it in the long run.

[Duncan Disorderly]

Hi DonX

I have been seriously collecting wine since 2008 but I only joined Langton's recently. I have bought a mix of wines at auction but mostly they fit into two categories.

Firstly I am buying wines with age, like the 1991 Tahbilk Cabernet Sauvignon that I bought today. I have a reasonable collection (about 350 bottles) but the oldest wines of the bulk of my collection are still relatively young (2005/06). So I am buying wines at auction that will allow me to indulge my desire for old wine and will also provide pointers for my own collection as it ages. In this case it is difficult to know whether I'm paying more or less than 'retail', although with most older wines first having to be purchased in the secondary market (auction) before being sold at a store, I am probably doing okay.

Secondly I am buying wines that I will continue to cellar. Some are additions to wines I already own and others are ones that just look like a good deal. In saying that I reckon in some cases, mostly wines in which trade is thin, I'd be paying less than retail (even taking into account the buyers premium and cost of freight), however in the case of better known wines I'm paying a premium. Basic economics really...

Most auction sites provide price records, so there aren't too many secrets.

Hope this helps

[Waiters Friend]

The answer to this conundrum is in two parts (i.e. there is room for both options), but depends on your reason for buying. And this forms the basis for deciding to maintain a cellar (or not).

If you're a modestly inexperienced wine afficionado, then both methods will start to give you insight into what you like. Buy far and wide, young and old. Be adventurous and experimental. Whether is it a new realease or an auction buy is merely the source of your experimentation. I went through a flirtation with Cellarmasters in the early 1990s, which provided some variety on a subject I knew relatively little about at the time, so selected mixed dozens from other sources is a third alternative for the novice.

As you become more experienced, especially with the contrast between young and older versions of the same wine, you will decide what you prefer to drink. Let's take riesling as an example. I know people who love young riesling, but a hint of kero, toast or honey is off-putting for them I also have friends for whom an aged riesling is a thing of beauty, however, I know no-one (apart from myself, 200 rieslings in the cellar back to 2001) who cellars the stuff.

This leads to my next point - the cellar. It's actually whites like riesling and Hunter semillon that got me into buying a six pack or dozen of the same wine each year, and watching their development. I still buy a dozen of 3-4 whites each year, drink a few early, and watch them develop by drinking a bottle each year. This holds even more for reds, however I tend to buy 3-6 now of a wine unless I know it well. Repeat buys are regular, however, and there are some $50+ wines that I will buy 3 or more of each year on the basis of my knowledge and experience with them.

For auctions (and especially in Perth, where this enquiry originated) I tend to scan the local site for wines that fill gaps or provide older examples of wines I regularly buy. Sometimes, buying an older example of a wine that I might generally buy young gives me insight into development and cellarability. Conversely, I also use it as an opportunity to try some wines I may have read about, or had recommended by word of mouth, and generally at way below RRP. There is also an opportunity to try some imported wines that I've never heard of, but I do some research first before bidding. I've had a mixed bag on the last front - some of the best wines I've ever had, and some shockers (especially in the bubbles and fortified wines).

Just to confuse things further, I am on a number of winery mailing lists. Frequently, I get calls for new releases, at allegedly discount 'once only' prices. Sometimes this is the case, and sometimes you can hold off for a while. Only experience and familiarity with the particular producer will guide you which way to go.

Possibly a complex reply to a straightforward question?

Cheers

Allan

[Chuck]

I buy a lot from auction (as a matter of fact I buy a lot of wine) as it gives me the opportunity to get older bottles of current vintage wines that you have just discoverd. On the whole my experience has been excellent. Very few duds and no more than usual from non-auction. The auction house I use also provides a provenance code for those bottles from known quality cellars. Here in Adelaide we are blessed with many older homes with underground cellars so whilst not perfect environments are certainly better than the standard closet. So there are many well cellared wines around that regularly turn up at auction.

I recall when we bought our house in 1990 my wife asked the dumbest question - "What are we going to put down there?"

Carl

[TravisW]

What's the go with shipping if you win a bid at Langtons? How much per bottle/case?

Cheers, Travis.