The Auswine Forum

Just a quick scenario to ponder!

Someone I know has recently just sold about 8 bottles of Noon Reserve Cab and Shiraz for a return of about $700. With the sole intention of funding new purchases of St Henri and Voyager C/M etc. This person was reluctant to do this as a loyal Noon Mailer but when the mathematics is applied - temptation became too much. $25 purchase for $90 sale.

- He never bought the original Noons' with a view to sell them. In fact enjoys them very much.
- Only sold due to his his current lack of disposable income and desire for some good 04 wines.
- Scenario not likely to be repeated.

Given these facts what are your thoughts about this. Is this considered a 'No no'? Would you bracket this behaviour as despicable and not in the interests of the wine industry, offensive even?


Wiggum

Sorry Wiggum, you are now banned from this forum.
Adair

P.S. This is a joke!

willing seller, willing buyer; no problems in my eyes.

Given the number times these wines (and others like them) appear in the auction lists it seems that there are quite a few people out there who think it perfectly reasonable.

I guess the other side of the coin is that is it equally "despicable and not in the interests of the wine industry" if you buy it at auction.

Or are auctions only meant to be a venue for flogging off crap wines at a loss, or picking up your favourite at a bargain because no-one recognises it?

But in short, I agree with Matt. I mean... really there is no difference between him selling them and him swapping his 8 bottles for several months worth of quaffers (or whatever).

Seriously, I think the important reason is why you buy the wines.

Even though I know that I could buy and sell Rockford Basket Press at a profit, I have not bought it for 2 vintages (yes, believe it or not) because I want to put my dollars elsewhere.

Your motivation is the important thing.

Adair

Adair wrote:Seriously, I think the important reason is why you buy the wines.

Even though I know that I could buy and sell Rockford Basket Press at a profit, I have not bought it for 2 vintages (yes, believe it or not) because I want to put my dollars elsewhere.

Your motivation is the important thing.

Adair

Hear hear.

For instance, sometimes tastes change and then I don't have a problem in selling it (although have yet to go down that path myself) so long as you were planning on drinking it eventually when purchasing.

cheers

Carl

I think Noon's are in the Wine business and set a price they are happy to receive for their product. If they sold it to a person then they have every right to on sell it. If Noon's know about it and don't want to sell it to the same person the next year then that is also their perogative. I think those who feel there is some level of immorality to this are judging harshly.

Deejay wrote:I think Noon's are in the Wine business and set a price they are happy to receive for their product. If they sold it to a person then they have every right to on sell it. If Noon's know about it and don't want to sell it to the same person the next year then that is also their perogative. I think those who feel there is some level of immorality to this are judging harshly.

I don't equate rights with morals. Yes people have a right to sell them on, but I don't think it moral to purchase the wine purely to profit from it. Happens more overseas though i.e. the difference in price between producer and consumer for bordeaux, burgundy or german riesling (esp. tba/eiswein).

cheers

Carl

Griff we will have to differ on that then. I reserve immorality for more serious affairs, but then I also have had sexual relations outside of marriage, worked on the sabbath, eaten pork as well which others find immoral. I guess morality is always personal, and different people will judge differently this situation. Vive le difference!

Deejay wrote:Griff we will have to differ on that then. I reserve immorality for more serious affairs, but then I also have had sexual relations outside of marriage, worked on the sabbath, eaten pork as well which others find immoral. I guess morality is always personal, and different people will judge differently this situation. Vive le difference!

A perfect description of morality in a nutshell there. I'll drink that that

cheers

Carl

Deejay wrote:Griff we will have to differ on that then. I reserve immorality for more serious affairs, but then I also have had sexual relations outside of marriage, worked on the sabbath, eaten pork as well which others find immoral. I guess morality is always personal, and different people will judge differently this situation. Vive le difference!

Nope. Don't agree. When you buy a wine like Noon's (or Wendouree) and when you do so, if you intend to on-sell them at a profit, you are doing exactly the same as meeting Drew Noon (or the Bradys) face to face and saying that you love their wines and will drink them, yet you know you are lying and are going to buy them and sell them at a profit.

Now whether you feel this is wrong or not is up to you... and your ethical, moral, etc. standards. I am not in a position to judge anyone, but that is what you are doing. Right or wrong, it is up to you. Vive le difference!

Adair

Personally I'd feel it was an abuse to get onto mailers with the sole intention of flipping for profit. Nothing stopping anyone doing this and there are some who would say it's a free market, so fair game. For me a free market doesn't change my personal views on treating others fairly. Life really is too short in my mind to pursue money without any thought or concern for others. I'll add that 'The Apprentice' isn't a program I can tolerate!

That's my belief, others are welcome to their's.

This is of course different and I don't think your friend should be overly troubled by this. Seems fair to do this and still feel that they're on the mailing list for the right reasons. If they end up not wanting to drink the wines at all, I'd hope they would cancel their membership rather than milking the relationship. That of course is their decision and I have no right to criticise them if they see it different. Their judgement, their conscience.

regards

Ian

Nope. Don't agree. When you buy a wine like Noon's (or Wendouree) and when you do so, if you intend to on-sell them at a profit, you are doing exactly the same as meeting Drew Noon (or the Bradys) face to face and saying that you love their wines and will drink them, yet you know you are lying and are going to buy them and sell them at a profit.

If you met them face to face and said this or as part of the sign on process it stated that they do not want the wine to be onsold then I would say that you are correct. It is not implicit in the act of buying anyone's wines.
If I were Noon's I would be marketing as they do to loyal buyers and then leaking a few cases themselves onto the auction sites to get the premium themselves. If they do not do this it is because they are happy with the price they are recieving for their product and would be surprised if they cared overly about flippers.