The Auswine Forum

Daryl Groom, ex-Penfold's Senior winemaker, will be leaving Geyser Peak and other activities in the USA to focus more attention on his own label.

Groom Wines site is here. The site notes that “His love was producing Penfolds famed red wine, Grange, which he oversaw from 1984 until his move to the USA in 1990.” But those wines are credited to Don Ditter and John Duval as they were Chief Winemaker at the time. The Wine* site notes “Daryl Groom began his winemaking career working with Saltram, Krondorf and Peter Lehmann, wineries all situated in the Barossa. He joined Kaiser Stuhl in 1980 as white winemaker. With the takeover of Kaiser Stuhl by Penfolds in 1982, he continued as the new company's white winemaker. 1985 he was promoted to red winemaker, becoming senior red winemaker in 1988, responsible for all Penfold's, Kaiser Stuhl and Tollana red wines. This included the making of Grange.”

Its always confusing to figure out who actually makes Grange because Penfold's has wine makers responsible for red and white wines. Currently its Steve Lienert, as red Winemaker and Oliver Crawford, as the white Winemaker. But they report to Chief Winemaker Peter Gago. Who really is responsible for getting Grange into the bottle? Does the Penfold's web site give due credit?

Mike

Come on Mike, you've seen Penfolds at Nuriootpa - about a dozen winemakers and fifty cellarhands!

A fair bit different to one/two person wineries that make most of the wine I now buy.

My understanding of corporate winemaking, including Grange, is that it's made by "committee" and no one person actually does all the work and makes all the decisions.

Grange is not a small production either, something in excess of 500 barriques someone once told me so Peter Gago would be busy wouldn't he?

It really is amazing how many ex Penfolds winemakers have "made Grange" on their resume, in fact nearly all of them do and it's probably correct that they were part of the committee.

Exactly Steve, but if you were looking at the Penfold's web site Tasting Notes you would think that just 4 people have been involved in making Grange over the years Schubert, Ditter, Duval and Gago.

Mike

They like to give the impression that it's a very exclusive thing, the baton lovingly handed on, and rarely handed on at that! Ah, the history and mystery of it all.

In reality, it all finished when Max Schubert hung up his tasting glass and production started to climb as demand picked up.

What part does the corporate accountant and board play in the winemaking process?

How many barrels can one person really look after at a time? Don't forget that there are two vintages in barrel at any one time as well so maybe a thousand plus barrels of Grange to be tended.

Even quite moderately sized wineries have two winemakers, one is known as THE winemaker but there's another one having a stack of input as well. Makes a nonsense of it all doesn't it?

707 wrote:Grange is not a small production either, something in excess of 500 barriques someone once told me so Peter Gago would be busy wouldn't he?

I don't know about that Steve - we were showed the barrels of the 2001 Grange in the cellar prior to bottling at Magill Estate a few years ago, and I reckon there was only about 30 barrels in total, maybe 50 tops. That wasn't exactly a tiny vintage either, but maybe what was showed to us was what was selected to be seen as a PR exercise too.

I'll try and ask tonight what the total production of the 2002 is, as I suspect it's probably one of the biggest they've had and it will be interesting if I can get a straight answer from whoever's presenting it (my guess it will be Oliver Crawford seeing as he's been presenting the Grange dinners all last week).

Cheers,
Ian

n4sir wrote: I don't know about that Steve - we were showed the barrels of the 2001 Grange in the cellar prior to bottling at Magill Estate a few years ago, and I reckon there was only about 30 barrels in total, maybe 50 tops. That wasn't exactly a tiny vintage either, but maybe what was showed to us was what was selected to be seen as a PR exercise too.

If there were 40 barrels x 225 litres = 9000 litres = 1000 cases

I think showing you "the" barrels was a PR exercise because there's a whole lot more than 1000 cases of 2001 Grange!

Penfolds want Joe Public to think Grange is a small exclusive production but it's not. Even in the early ninties retailers were getting a pallet or more of Grange and you can guarantee they're not making any less now.

If you ask about production they'll either give you a bullshit figure or say they don't know.

It's oft been cited that Penfolds year-in year-out makes 8-10,000 cases of Grange (still way below the 1st growths who make up to 30,000 cases). I remember in late 80s when I worked ITB the 5 pallets of 83 Grange sitting in the warehouse = 3600 bottles!). So 400 barrels sounds about right.

The Grange stored in barrel at Magill is only part of the make. The explanation I've had is that they split the make into three lots, which are stored separately in case of fire, earthquake, deranged Southcorp shareholders, etc.

I'm not sure it's meant to be in the tour, but I managed to get my hand into a barrel of the 2006 Grange last year. Finger-licking good indeed.

It is not well known, but whisperings from the very heart of Penfolds have made it clear that 2-3 vintages of Grange since 1951 were in fact made by aliens from outer space. A recently unclassified Adelaide police report states and I quote:

"...Eye witness accounts of strange lights at night over the [Penfolds]winemaking complex were dismissed by authorities as imagination, but several credible accounts have surfaced in recent years which adds huge weight to this theory. Stories even go as far as to say that one of the little green men got stuck in a pump"

This could in part be the expanation for excessive sediment in some vintages?

pstarr wrote:The Grange stored in barrel at Magill is only part of the make. The explanation I've had is that they split the make into three lots, which are stored separately in case of fire, earthquake, deranged Southcorp shareholders, etc.

I just got back from the Penfolds Icon tasting, and I can confirm the above - I was told what I saw was one third of the barrels, and the remaining two thirds would have been at Nuriootpa - the total would have been about 100 barrels for 2001, so my estimate of about 30 at Magill was pretty close.

The total production for the 2002 vintage is about 7000 cases (for 12 bottle cases that's about 84,000 bottles, around 280 barrels going by Steve's calculations - a big increase on 2001).

FWIW I was actually relatively unimpressed with the 2002 Grange - it was completely blown away by the 2004 Bin 707, which after a quick hand count I reckon would have been WOTN for about 90% of the people there, I kid you not. I'll post some notes tomorrow after a good sleep - I went straight after work so I'm pretty tired, and I can still feel the tannin on the back of my teeth!

Cheers,
Ian