The Auswine Forum

It's still early days, but I reckon that most 2001 Coonawarra Cabernets that I have tasted are faring far better than the 2002's in spite of the 2002 vintage getting a better wrap for reds by some experts (eg Halliday).
I have found the 2002's a little flabbier and riper, than the 2001's which I find a bit tighter with better varietal definition and better balance.
Examples of better 2001 than 2002's that I have tasted include:

Majella
Wynns - Black Label
Zema
Brands
Bowen

Does anyone agree with this? I generally prefer cooler climate styles, perhaps this is reflected here.
Cheers
Stuart.

Hi Stuart, for all the Cabernets you've listed I also preferred the 01's, BUT for different reasons it seems.

2002 was incredibly cool while 2001 was warm, I'm surprised you are finding the 02's flabbier and riper, the ones I managed to try have tended to be green, they must be evolving differently to what I expected. 02 Majella was green pea and asparagus, and the 02 Brands was thin, weedy and just dreadful on release. The only 02's I thought were reasonable were Parker and Leconfield, but still not good enough to buy. To be honest, I'm surprised Halliday rated 02 Coonawarra as high as he did.

Now having said all that, I passed on most 01 Coonawarras as well, they were too ripe for me! Only bought Majella and Parker.

I bought a lot more 00, despite Halidays poor rating of the vintage.

cheers
AB

I agree, 00 and 01 in Coonawarra better than 02 for cabernet. Different story in other regions of South Austrlalia, or Victoria.

02 not a great year for coonawarra cabernet, though there are some exceptions.

Jeff2

Stuart wrote:Examples of better 2001 than 2002's that I have tasted include:

Majella
Wynns - Black Label
Zema
Brands
Bowen

Stuart,

I wasn't aware that the '02 Wynns had been released yet - was this a barrel sample? I'm also surprised at Halliday's vintage ratings for Coonawarra, with 9 for '02, 8 for '01 and 6 for '00. I've found the '01 to be tops, probably followed by the '00 to be honest (although I haven't got around to many of the '02 cabs yet). Yalumba will be releasing the '02 Menzies ahead of the '01, holding back the '01 to further develop and describing the '02 as more approachable.

Cheers,

I agree with Wizz, 2002 in Coonawarra wasn't anywhere near as good as the warmer-climate areas in SA that coped Ok with a cooler year. With some notable exceptions the 02 Coonawarra cabernets I've tasted have had some hard or green characters, underripe or a mix of ripe and unripe flavours, certainly not riper than 2001.

The only 2002 Coonawarra cabernets I've purchased are Reschke Bos and Penley Reserve, although there are others I've tried that were of good quality, including Leconfield ( a good return to form in a tough year, particularly for the southern end of the strip), Punters Corner (get over the first impression and give it a chance), maybe Zema Family Selection.

Having bought a heap of 2002 reds from other areas and having tasted a few 2003 Cabernets from Coonawarra I'm happy to give 2002 a miss and wait for some better wines from 2003.

BTW, from 2001 the Coonawarra cabernets I bought are:
Balnaves (standard and Tally)
Bowen Estate
Katnook Estate
Ladbroke Grove Killians
Lawrence Victor (quit stock at $12)
Majella
Mildara White Label
Petaluma (I've tried the 2002 twice and I'm not convinced enough to buy it, I think it has a hard/green undertone)
Wynns Harold

I agree with most of the above - 2000 and 2001 much better than 2002. I've also found most of the 2002's to be quite green and unripe tasting.

Anyone got any opinions on how 2004 is shaping up so far?


Bill

Bill wrote:Anyone got any opinions on how 2004 is shaping up so far?
Bill

Bill,
Have a look here at Ric's tour diary from May, particularly the Zema section:
http://www.torbwine.com/pf/SA%202005%20 ... er%202.htm

Based on winemaker comments and barrel samples, 2004 Coonawarra should produce some pretty good reds.

[/quote] I'm also surprised at Halliday's vintage ratings for Coonawarra, with 9 for '02, 8 for '01 and 6 for '00. [/quote]

Let's not hold back here, Halliday has got it WRONG. It almost looks like he's just added Coonawarra into a vintage generalisation with the other SA regions.

In Coonawarra I'd suggest reverse those numbers, 2000 is an excellent vintage, 2001 is a strong vintage and 2002 is clearly the lesser of the three although there are some very good wines as always.

It shows you need to keep your wits about you in these matters and trust your own palate more.

Wizz, Steve, Bill et al are right. Coonawarra is a long way from the rest of SA and shouldn't be rated the same.

I passed on most 01's as they were not up to standard of the 98,99,00.
02's came in less impressive than 01's. Passed completely.
03's are looking good so far. Anyone who likes Coonawarra cabernet must buy the Majella.

I have heard rumours 04 was similar to 02. Cannot be substantiated until the wines are out this time next year - the Coonawarra Roadshow doesn't lie, it's too easy to work out the trend there when trying multiple wines from multiple makers from multiple vintages.


cheers
BA

Red Bigot wrote:The only 2002 Coonawarra cabernets I've purchased are Reschke Bos and Penley Reserve, although there are others I've tried that were of good quality, including Leconfield ( a good return to form in a tough year, particularly for the southern end of the strip), Punters Corner (get over the first impression and give it a chance), maybe Zema Family Selection.

Agree re Leconfield and would add Hollick in 2002, very very good Cabernet.

Red Bigot wrote:

Bill wrote:Anyone got any opinions on how 2004 is shaping up so far?
Bill

Bill,
Have a look here at Ric's tour diary from May, particularly the Zema section:
http://www.torbwine.com/pf/SA%202005%20 ... er%202.htm

Based on winemaker comments and barrel samples, 2004 Coonawarra should produce some pretty good reds.

So the general consensus is that 2004 will be better than 00, 01, 02, and 03? A “vintage of the decade” perhaps? If so, I’ll severely restrict my buying of 03’s (I only have Majella so far) and wait until the 04’s are released before buying up big. I was certainly impressed by all the 04’s I tried earlier this year at the Qld Wine Show, although they weren’t finished wines obviously.

So, the question is, should I buy 03 instead of 02, or wait for the 04's?

Bill

Agree with the comments above. 2002 in Coonawarra very average with only a few wines released that are worth buying - although I have bought the 2002 Majella. I also agree with Steve, that Halliday must have been on drugs to rate the 2002 vintage in Coonawarra ahead of both 2000 and 2001. Both of these vintages are definitely a step up on quality than the 2002. From memory, even comparing his scores between 2001 and 2002 on most wineries cabenet releases, 2001 gets the nod by Halliday on an individual comparison basis.

The 2003 vintage so far appears to be much better than 2002, with the Majella release a wonderful example of this. It will be interesting to see how the future releases of Katnook, Balnaves, Petaluma, Wynns and St Hugo stack up against their 2002 counterparts.

AJ

Maximus wrote: I wasn't aware that the '02 Wynns had been released yet - was this a barrel sample?

Many apologies, I must have imagined that I tasted this. I don't keep tasting notes so these things are likely to happen.

Stuart.

Red Bigot wrote:I agree with Wizz, 2002 in Coonawarra wasn't anywhere near as good as the warmer-climate areas in SA that coped Ok with a cooler year. With some notable exceptions the 02 Coonawarra cabernets I've tasted have had some hard or green characters, underripe or a mix of ripe and unripe flavours, certainly not riper than 2001.

The only 2002 Coonawarra cabernets I've purchased are Reschke Bos and Penley Reserve, although there are others I've tried that were of good quality, including Leconfield ( a good return to form in a tough year, particularly for the southern end of the strip), Punters Corner (get over the first impression and give it a chance), maybe Zema Family Selection.

Having bought a heap of 2002 reds from other areas and having tasted a few 2003 Cabernets from Coonawarra I'm happy to give 2002 a miss and wait for some better wines from 2003.

BTW, from 2001 the Coonawarra cabernets I bought are:
Balnaves (standard and Tally)
Bowen Estate
Katnook Estate
Ladbroke Grove Killians
Lawrence Victor (quit stock at $12)
Majella
Mildara White Label
Petaluma (I've tried the 2002 twice and I'm not convinced enough to buy it, I think it has a hard/green undertone)
Wynns Harold

Interesting...I saw this thread and immediately checked my RB Cellar Master to compare my own purchases over the three years and I am clearly in violent agreement with the majority...

2000
Balnaves, Bowen, Brands, Majella, St Hugo, Petaluma, Zema Std and Family.


2001
Balnaves, Bowen, Majella, St Hugo, Petaluma, Wynns, Zema Family.

2002
Majella and considering Zema.

I didn't know the 02 Zema Family was out, RB?

M.

MartinE wrote:I didn't know the 02 Zema Family was out, RB?

M.

Martin, we tasted it at the winery in May, they indicated a July release (2005 assumed ). There is still a fair bit of the 2001 FS Cab around, so maybe delayed.

Red Bigot wrote:

MartinE wrote:I didn't know the 02 Zema Family was out, RB?

M.

Martin, we tasted it at the winery in May, they indicated a July release (2005 assumed ). There is still a fair bit of the 2001 FS Cab around, so maybe delayed.

Fair enough...Tasted the 01 at the Roadshow and thought it was pretty smart in that traditional Zema style...You prefer the 02?

M.

Martin, the Zema FS Cab 02 is a pretty good effort (TORB HR), especially considering the pasting the 2002 Coonwarra vintage has (mostly deservedly) had here, but not quite as good as the 01 IMO.

I didn't buy the 01 (probably already had too many 2001 reds by the time I tasted it at WineOz 2004) and probably won't buy the 02, I spent the little bit extra and bought the Penley Estate Reserve Cabernet 02 instead.

Gavin Trott wrote:

Red Bigot wrote:The only 2002 Coonawarra cabernets I've purchased are Reschke Bos and Penley Reserve, although there are others I've tried that were of good quality, including Leconfield ( a good return to form in a tough year, particularly for the southern end of the strip), Punters Corner (get over the first impression and give it a chance), maybe Zema Family Selection.

Agree re Leconfield and would add Hollick in 2002, very very good Cabernet.

Indeed...the 02 Hollick is good stuff. So is the Parker Terra Rossa (don't know about 02 1st Growth).

Kieran

Sorry to ressurrected this thread again but I finally found the time to compare Halliday's scores from his last 2 Wine Companions in regards to Coonawarra Cabernet's from 2001 and 2002. What I found was:

2001 wines that scored better than their 2002 counterparts:

Majella
Balnaves (normal Cab)
Punters Corners (normal Cab)
Parker 1st Growth

2002 wines that scored better than their 2001 counterparts:

Majella Malleea
Petaluma Coonawarra

Wines where one vintage wasn't reviewed or included in publication:

Penley Reserve Cab (02 reviewed -95 points - and appears to be better than the 01)
Katnook (02 not reviewed)
Orlando St Hugo (02 not reviewed)
Balnaves Tally (02 not reviewed but the 01 received 96 points)
Parker Terra Rossa (02 not reviewed)

Not sure why the 2002 wines in the last group were not included in his latest Wine Companion (were they that bad!), but the above tends to suggest that even Halliday's palate didn't rank the Coonwarra 2002 vintage better than 2001, even though his vintage chart at the beginning of the book ranks the 2002 vintage 1 point higher than 2001.

At the end of the day, there is nothing more reliable than your own palate I suppose!

AJ,

To the best of my knowledge there is was no Penley 2001 Reserve Cab and I pretty sure there is no 02 Tally.