The Auswine Forum

Just came across a web site for a US wine company in LA that advertises the following prices on penfolds wines;

2002 Bin 407 - US $14.95, AU $19.39
2002 Bin 389 - US $17.95, AU $23.28
2002 bin 707 - US $64.95, AU $84.22
2001 St Henri - US $29.95, AU $38.84
2002 Magill - US $36.95, AU $47.91
2002 RWT - US $59.95, AU $77.74

Now maybe I'm ignorant and this happens all the time but how does this make sense??!! I realise why the company suit and ties do this but personally it shits me. Just a shame as I am quite a fan of Penfolds reds but will not be spending any more of my dollars on any of their recent wines, now or into the future. They must think people who have always bought these wines will continue to, regardless of ridiculous price rises. Not impressed.

One thing that will make it cheaper is that there is no WET or GST however one would think the cost of freight would equal out the price. Obviously not though.

I'm not getting your angst. The AUS prices seem roughly equivalent to the USD after the exchange rate. Are you miffed at the AUS prices themselves? If so, check out the BC prices!!

2002 Bin 407 - US $14.95, AU $19.39, BC $34.99
2002 Bin 389 - US $17.95, AU $23.28, BC $36.99
2002 bin 707 - US $64.95, AU $84.22, BC $109.99
2001 St Henri - US $29.95, AU $38.84, BC $49.99
2002 Magill - US $36.95, AU $47.91, BC not listed
2002 RWT - US $59.95, AU $77.74, BC $114.99

BTW, Bins 128 & 28 are also $34.99 here. These prices are for the 2001 vintage, only the 389 2002 is here so far (for this bottle at least, the price stayed at the 2001 price).

The US and Oz prices seem bloody good to me!!

Jester,

Its very simple, Penfolds will charge what ever the market will stand in every market they operate in. Gone are the days where you say, its costs "x" to produce; I will mark it up by "y%" giving a retail price of "z."

These global players don't give a rodents posterior where they sell thier wine and could not care less about customer loyalty. Much of that is to be expected when the whole operation is driven with the next quarters results being the most important driving factor.

And yes, I am a cynic.

JDSJDS wrote:I'm not getting your angst. The AUS prices seem roughly equivalent to the USD after the exchange rate. Are you miffed at the AUS prices themselves? If so, check out the BC prices!!

2002 Bin 407 - US $14.95, AU $19.39, BC $34.99
2002 Bin 389 - US $17.95, AU $23.28, BC $36.99
2002 bin 707 - US $64.95, AU $84.22, BC $109.99
2001 St Henri - US $29.95, AU $38.84, BC $49.99
2002 Magill - US $36.95, AU $47.91, BC not listed
2002 RWT - US $59.95, AU $77.74, BC $114.99

BTW, Bins 128 & 28 are also $34.99 here. These prices are for the 2001 vintage, only the 389 2002 is here so far (for this bottle at least, the price stayed at the 2001 price).

The US and Oz prices seem bloody good to me!!

The Oz prices shown are the $AU equivalent to the USD prices, not the actual Oz prices, which are somewhat more, double or more in the case of 707, RWT and Magill.

Ahhh, OK, thanks for clarifying that.

You mean you're paying more than we are in BC?!?! If so, my condolences!

TORB wrote:Jester,

Its very simple, Penfolds will charge what ever the market will stand in every market they operate in. Gone are the days where you say, its costs "x" to produce; I will mark it up by "y%" giving a retail price of "z."

Agree totally. 389 would be over $50 a bottle if they knew that buyers would stand for it.Thank goodness for competition!!

The reason the price of Grange tripled is an example.

2002 Grange is going to be one dear bugger.

I have been told the prices of the two 2004 Special Bin wines in the UK and NZ (by a Pom and a Kiwi). They would make you cry as well. I could fly over there, buy a few bottles and sell them here and my airfares would be paid.

Adair

So Adair, please share - I have many friends in the UK who will buy wine for me and possibly even not drink it til I can get there to pick it up.

We don't even know what it's going to cost here - although I have a good imagination (and some experience).

Caros was offering EP of the two 04 special bins at NZ $330

I complained paying $150 retail for the 96 Block 42

Just another reason to give the corporates a wide berth. I'm so over Penfolds etc, these are companies who are about profit not making wine.

Get into the small makers, their wine is superior in almost every way, almost all care about their customers and there are personalities behind every bottle which makes the whole consumption experience much betterer IMO !

bacchaebabe wrote:So Adair, please share - I have many friends in the UK who will buy wine for me and possibly even not drink it til I can get there to pick it up.

£121.25 per bottle - IN CASE LOTS ONLY
See: http://www.bbr.com/US/db/product/57600B/Penfolds-Bin-60A-Coonawarra-Cabernet-Kalimna-Shiraz?ID=null

Adair

That appears to be the "in bond" price (the In Bond and Duty paid prices pb are the same, so a bug in the BBR site I think), add £1.26/bottle Duty, then 17.5% VAT = approx. £143.95 = $A339 approx

RB

Anonymous wrote:That appears to be the "in bond" price (the In Bond and Duty paid prices pb are the same, so a bug in the BBR site I think), add £1.26/bottle Duty, then 17.5% VAT = approx. £143.95 = $A339 approx

RB

Thank you for the clarification. Still AT LEAST $100 less than what we are going to be able to get it for... and in much greater quantities.

Thanks,
Adair

$450+ here is alot of bloody $ for 1 bottle of wine that may or may not become excellent.

Anonymous wrote:$450+ here is alot of bloody $ for 1 bottle of wine that may or may not become excellent.

Jancis has given the Cab 19/20 and the other 18/20. Good enough for me.

Adair

Adair wrote:

Anonymous wrote:$450+ here is alot of bloody $ for 1 bottle of wine that may or may not become excellent.

Jancis has given the Cab 19/20 and the other 18/20. Good enough for me.

Adair

Umm... Have they even been bottled yet?

Exactly tasting while still in oak means nothing for this little black duck.

How many Jimmy Watson winners win their trophys like this then turn out to be just an average wine.

I will stick to my special bins from 90 and 96 which at half the price are vintages that in time 2004 could only dream of being.

Adair wrote:

Anonymous wrote:$450+ here is alot of bloody $ for 1 bottle of wine that may or may not become excellent.

Jancis has given the Cab 19/20 and the other 18/20. Good enough for me.

Adair

18 out of 20 is nothing worth putting the glasses on for.

Anonymous wrote:Exactly tasting while still in oak means nothing for this little black duck.

How many Jimmy Watson winners win their trophys like this then turn out to be just an average wine.

I will stick to my special bins from 90 and 96 which at half the price are vintages that in time 2004 could only dream of being.

Yes the wines have been bottled - May 2005.

Adair

Anonymous wrote:

Adair wrote:

Anonymous wrote:$450+ here is alot of bloody $ for 1 bottle of wine that may or may not become excellent.

Jancis has given the Cab 19/20 and the other 18/20. Good enough for me.

Adair

18 out of 20 is nothing worth putting the glasses on for.

Depending on whether you respect the palate of Jancis and whether you know the calibre of other wines that get 18 and 19 out of 20 from Jancis will dictate whether you would "put the glasses on".

The way that I see it, a 19/20 is the level of many a 1st Growth so a couple of hundred does not seem too far fetched.

18/20 is still a most excellent wine, but pushing it above $100 for me.

Adair

I have no doubt they will be nice wines but will they be worth 1 Run Rig, 1 O'Leary Reserve, 1 Johan Georg and 1 02 or 03 St Peters to boot is more my question?

FWIW:



Adair

Anonymous wrote:I have no doubt they will be nice wines but will they be worth 1 Run Rig, 1 O'Leary Reserve, 1 Johan Georg and 1 02 or 03 St Peters to boot is more my question?

Depends what value you place on just that little extra bit of greatness.

The majority of my friends would rather a couple of cases of 2002 Metala White Label than 1 Run Rig, 1 O'Leary Reserve, 1 Johan Georg and 1 02 or 03 St Peters.

I would not mind paying the money for one bottle of the Block 42, probably sharing the costs between a couple of friends.

Adair

Adair wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Exactly tasting while still in oak means nothing for this little black duck.

How many Jimmy Watson winners win their trophys like this then turn out to be just an average wine.

I will stick to my special bins from 90 and 96 which at half the price are vintages that in time 2004 could only dream of being.

Yes the wines have been bottled - May 2005.

Adair

Jancis visited SA in February, so what was tried would have been barrel samples (like most of the writers who have published such glowing remarks). I think Huon Hooke may have tried it just after bottling, but it could easily have been just before too.

It's just bad timing that Jancis visited Kay Bros two days before we lobbed up at the cellar door - 48 hours earlier we could have been treated to a vertical of Block 6!!!

Cheers
Ian

707 wrote:Just another reason to give the corporates a wide berth. I'm so over Penfolds etc, these are companies who are about profit not making wine.

Get into the small makers, their wine is superior in almost every way, almost all care about their customers and there are personalities behind every bottle which makes the whole consumption experience much betterer IMO !

I think a lot or Retailers are at least equally to blame. A local here was expecting to retail at a price of around the same as Grange or a little less (on order to their regulars of course) at around the $350/bottle mark. They were quite shocked at the $400-$600 figures that was being floated around the last month or so on these forums - it's not like they are getting it any cheaper, it's just blatant profiteering by a chunk of the retail sector based on a combination of speculation and reduced local numbers due to hoarding/exporting.

This has been going on in the USA for some time - just look at the ridiculous figures being asked for some small makers wines through some well known importers, and you know the kind of margin they're making. It's been well discussed previously on this forum of how much cut a retailer/flipper will make on a high demand/priced wine compared to the actual maker.

Cheers
Ian

n4sir wrote:

707 wrote:Just another reason to give the corporates a wide berth. I'm so over Penfolds etc, these are companies who are about profit not making wine.

Get into the small makers, their wine is superior in almost every way, almost all care about their customers and there are personalities behind every bottle which makes the whole consumption experience much betterer IMO !

I think a lot or Retailers are at least equally to blame. A local here was expecting to retail at a price of around the same as Grange or a little less (on order to their regulars of course) at around the $350/bottle mark. They were quite shocked at the $400-$600 figures that was being floated around the last month or so on these forums - it's not like they are getting it any cheaper, it's just blatant profiteering by a chunk of the retail sector based on a combination of speculation and reduced local numbers due to hoarding/exporting.

This has been going on in the USA for some time - just look at the ridiculous figures being asked for some small makers wines through some well known importers, and you know the kind of margin they're making. It's been well discussed previously on this forum of how much cut a retailer/flipper will make on a high demand/priced wine compared to the actual maker.

Cheers
Ian

Importers make a killing on some wines. Cecilia Schubert told me that their Goose Yard Block Shiraz, which retails for $55 here, sells for $185/bottle in Japan!

Jancis tasted the finished bottles at the London wine Trade fair as i did. Fabulous wines. Really special and well worth it.
Regardless of the fact taht i am selling these are seriously good!!!
BBR have it but you can buy from me by the bottle or case!!!
www.nywines.co.uk
go to new releases

Noel

Gents

The comparison will be more realistic when the AUD is where it belongs!

Stock bought by foreign retailers when the AUD below 6o cents and unsold until the AUD near 80 cents makes for a startling conversion!

Hey Noel,

I saw it on your site and you seem to have the best price going but then, that's in bond. There is no doubt these wines are fantastic but it's obviously up to the individual if they are willing to pay out that amount. At around $300 it's probably just worth it in the current climate but over $500 then I have to think VERY seriously.

I don't entirely understand the bond situation though. I know it is pre duty (cheap) and pre VAT (not so cheap) but if it is shipped straight back to Australia (1) can you do that? (2) do you have a ball park on shipping (3) I assume you then don't have to pay the VAT (4) Are you then liable for wet and/or GST and/or any other duty?

Or basically, what's it going to cost me per bottle buying it from you and getting it back to my doorstep?

On the other hand, if I got it delivered to a friend's in London and then smuggled it back in bottle by bottle, trip by trip, friend by friend (thus trying to avoid duty and wet and stuff) would this work out cheaper?