The Auswine Forum

As I was typing, I am enjoying the MB 2002 Cab. Terrific stuff - nose, palate and lenght put many $40 wine to shame.
Only thing is it lacked typicity(tasted like a Cab/Shz Blend), but it doesnt bother me. It gotta be the best under $20 wine I ever had, Bravo to Saltram!!!

Martin, it is such a great wine isn't it? I bought a case of this instead of my more usual 6-pack buy for reds in this price range.

Don't bother with the 2003 vintage of this, it is not even close to the same class and a sizeable proportion of tasters seem to find it downright unpleasant.

Red Bigot wrote:Don't bother with the 2003 vintage of this, it is not even close to the same class and a sizeable proportion of tasters seem to find it downright unpleasant.

I will second this statement Brian. Bought a bottle to try and could not finish. Was very disappointed to say the least. DNPIM.
MM.

I stumbled across some Shiraz '02. It's as good as their Cab?
Someone told me generally the Mamre Brook Shiraz is weaker due to the best parcels that went into the #1.

Earl Grey wrote:I stumbled across some Shiraz '02. It's as good as their Cab?
Someone told me generally the Mamre Brook Shiraz is weaker due to the best parcels that went into the #1.

I haven't tried the Cab, but the Shiraz is completely tops. Rich and fruity, with little in the way of obvious tannin.

Shiraz is great for the money. Cab is extra great for the money.

The 2002 Mamre Cabernet is truly one of, if not the, bargain buy of the year. Top class wine that has been discounted heavily, I've just bought another two cases at $16-50 !

The 2003 is not in the same class.

707 wrote:The 2002 Mamre Cabernet is truly one of, if not the, bargain buy of the year. Top class wine that has been discounted heavily, I've just bought another two cases at $16-50 !

The 2003 is not in the same class.

Sent you a PM Steve, asking where you managed to get that price. I want some. Gimme Gimme Gimme

I finally got round to trying this. The fruit is great but that oak treatment is just disgusting - overt coconutty oak...and it is sweet. Could not finish a glass.

GW

Gary,

We are all entitled to our own opinions and tastes.

GW wrote:I finally got round to trying this. The fruit is great but that oak treatment is just disgusting - overt coconutty oak...and it is sweet. Could not finish a glass.

Yep, they must have waved a new oak stave at it. FWIW here are a few other TN's

Oliver A superb Barossa cabernet of exceptional elegance and longevity. Its aromas of crushed leaves, cassis and violets reveal a dusty perfume of sweet vanilla and cedar/chocolate oak. Tightly defined, smooth and harmonious, it bursts with intense cassis, blackberry and plum flavours, intertwined around a spine of fine, firm tannins. Excellent length and balance. (Barossa Valley, 18.7, drink 2014-2022)

Mattinson This wine is fully ripe yet varietally true, with swatches of chocolate and blackcurrant and the finest smear of herb. ItÂ’s a touch warm but by no means ecessively so, and if the 1996 and the 1998 releases of this wine are anything to go by, it will age very well for a good long time. This is one of the very few wines that IÂ’d recommend that you buy more than a dozen bottles of.

TORB The bouquet was inviting; with lifted dark berry fruit and ripe chocolate. Pure, distinct fruit delivers mulberry/boysenberry spectrum fruit on the uptake, with spice on the mid-palate finishing to persistent chocolate and a touch of herbaceous tomato plant; the flavour is ably supported by long, drying tannins that linger for ages. Ample-weight; the pleasant mouth feel and supple consistency combines with a harmonious complexity; and whilst the wine is not a great "varietal" Cabernet, it is certainly greatly enjoyable. Rated as Highly Recommended with **** for value, it should peak around 2010.


Edit - I just noticed on the other forum you also said "One for the punters and wine shows." ....Looks like there a lot of "punters" out there (and I am proud to be called one of them ) who do not have your level of sophisticated taste.

I bought just a few bottles of the 02 Cab, having tasted it a few times earlier. For $17, or whatever it cost, there's certainly nothing to complain about. But I think it's a fairly simple wine, for all that. TORB quoted Campbell saying "if the 98 is anything to go by"...well, the 98 is drinking very nicely now. But I'm certain the 02 is a lot softer and more syrupy than the 98 was at the same age, and I'd seriously question whether it'll improve in any way over 10 years. I found the 02 practically devoid of tannin - real tannin - whereas my memory of the 98 was of a much more astringent, more-tightly wound wine in it's early days.

I didn't dislike it, don't get me wrong - it's unlikely you'll buy much better for the price, I just didn't think it's as good, objectively, as many writers make out. In the $ context, I have no problem with it...

cheers,
Graeme

Graeme,

I know you have a good palate so don't question your conclusions but there is one major point of difference in what you and I found in the wine.

GG "I found the 02 practically devoid of tannin - real tannin" where as I said "the flavour is ably supported by long, drying tannins that linger for ages."

And there in lies the reasons for the differeing longevity outlooks.

GraemeG wrote: I found the 02 practically devoid of tannin - real tannin...
cheers,
Graeme

Goodness gracious, coming from a person who adored cooler climate reds. This wine has got more dry extract than any Hunter's Shiraz or Yarra's Cab. How do you differenciate between real and fake tannins?

VERY VERY EASY

If I reviewed this wine I would probably score it around 90 points. It is good for what it is, within its style, and esp. at its price point. It is, however, quite sweet and with 15% alcohol and fairly 'showy crowd pleasing' oak and soft tannin. None of the TN's above mention sweetness so whan can only assume that either they expect it within the style or don't notice sweet wines....It is one for the punters. Had a glass over dinner. Many people latched on to the rich sweet fruit and sweet oak in this wine and really liked it. It is not an insult. Everything about this wine is "look at me" - fruit, alcohol, oak etc. Each to their own. It is also a bugger to drink with food. On the same night I was drinking 92 Tahbilk Shiraz and 99 Cave de Tain Hermitage - both non sweet wines...dry infact. Some of the people (not wine 'experts' as such) at dinner hated the Hermitage and loved the Saltram and vice versa. Other wines to follow after were 2000 Coldstream Res Cab, 01 Voyager Cab and then 03 Ata Rangi Pinot...a glass of 03 St Hallet Gamekeepers also like cordial. Puke!
Hope that makes sense.
GW

Hi Gary,

Thanks for putting your origional comment in perspective; its more understandable with the full story.

FWIW, with my own TN I would have thought "ripe" and "mulberry/boysenberry spectrum fruit" would indicate sweetness in an indirect but obvious way.

Gary W. wrote:If I reviewed this wine I would probably score it around 90 points. It is good for what it is, within its style, and esp. at its price point. It is, however, quite sweet and with 15% alcohol and fairly 'showy crowd pleasing' oak and soft tannin. None of the TN's above mention sweetness so whan can only assume that either they expect it within the style or don't notice sweet wines....It is one for the punters. Had a glass over dinner. Many people latched on to the rich sweet fruit and sweet oak in this wine and really liked it. It is not an insult. Everything about this wine is "look at me" - fruit, alcohol, oak etc. Each to their own. It is also a bugger to drink with food. On the same night I was drinking 92 Tahbilk Shiraz and 99 Cave de Tain Hermitage - both non sweet wines...dry infact. Some of the people (not wine 'experts' as such) at dinner hated the Hermitage and loved the Saltram and vice versa. Other wines to follow after were 2000 Coldstream Res Cab, 01 Voyager Cab and then 03 Ata Rangi Pinot...a glass of 03 St Hallet Gamekeepers also like cordial. Puke!
Hope that makes sense.
GW

This story is not surprising - I had two very different impressions of the wine one evening a few months ago, and it's also been quite different in the two Blacktongues blind tastings it's appeared in:

http://forum.auswine.com.au/viewtopic.php?t=3076

http://forum.auswine.com.au/viewtopic.php?t=2794
http://forum.auswine.com.au/viewtopic.php?t=2139

I can see where a bottle can generate its lovers and detractors simply from surrounding food/wines.

Cheers
Ian

How does the Mamre Shiraz '03 fare?

Kurt wrote:How does the Mamre Shiraz '03 fare?

Badly! If you want a full, long detailed explination have a look at this.

http://www.torbwine.com/index.htm?..//dropsndregs4.htm

Start about a third of the way down at the heading "Why Oh Why?" and when finished that bit go back up the page to the bit above it titled "The Mamre Brooke saga continues"

Kurt if you are looking for the next great Cabernet that is way better than its $28 price then grab some Majella 03 Cab. Yes its dearer than Mamre 02 but its bloody good and in a 3-5 years will be a treat.

TORB wrote:

Kurt wrote:How does the Mamre Shiraz '03 fare?

Badly! If you want a full, long detailed explination have a look at this.

http://www.torbwine.com/index.htm?..//dropsndregs4.htm

Start about a third of the way down at the heading "Why Oh Why?" and when finished that bit go back up the page to the bit above it titled "The Mamre Brooke saga continues"

Ric,
I found the '03 Shiraz pretty good but the Cabernet was crap.
MM.