The Auswine Forum

My godson was born in 2002 and I would like to buy some 2002 vintage wines to cellar until he is 21.

Unfortunately I have absolutely no idea which wines will last that long and I am hoping that some kind souls will be able to suggest some nice wines (preferably Australian) that will last for > 20 years.

My personal favorite wine is Penfolds Bin 389 and I understand the 2002 vintage was a great one. Will it last > 20 years though? Do Australian wines often last this long, or will I need to look at some imported wines?

I also assume that a red wine will last longer than a white, is this true?

Thank you in advance....

Charles

personally id forget the 389. depends how much u wanna spend but maybe something like an 02 Penfolds 707, Wynns John Riddoch, Penfolds St Henri, Amargh?

Something with a good ripe fine structure, good concentration and piles of fruit weight.

based on the comments below I doubt the 389 '02 will go beyond your godson when he reached kindergarden.

here are some suggestions;
Hunter's Shiraz - Brokenwood Graveyard
Hunter Semillion - Tyrells
Rutherglen stickies - Chambers
Clare Riesling - Mesh, Grosset Polish Hill/ Watervale.

Avoid fruit bombs from Barossa & McLaren.

You can't go too wrong with a Grange lasting the distance but it won't be released for a while and will be quite expensive when it is.

Re your comments about reds aging versus whites, some of the most amazing aged wines I have had were whites. Only semillons and rieslings though. I'd be inclined to look at the Leonay or good clare rieslings (already released though) as mentioned above and the McWilliams Lovedale or Tyrrels Vat 1 as the real stayers. Again won't be released for a while but will be worth the wait.

2002 Mount Mary Quintet will go the distance but be a bit hard to find.

2002 Moss Wood Cab/Sauv should be one to keep an eye out for now Keith Mugford has returned to cultured yeasts.

2002 Grosset Polish hill Riesling is a cracker and tipped to last that long.

Yering Station Reserve Shiraz Viognier 02.

Rutherglen Durif's are long termers.

Petaluma Coonawarra 02 Could be one to watch.

2002 Seppelt St Peters if you can get any will be a 20+ year wine. It nearly always is and this vintage is said to be nothing but superb.

Cullen Cabernet Merlot.

Balnaves The Tally Reserve Cab Sauv

Anonymous wrote:here are some suggestions;
Hunter's Shiraz - Brokenwood Graveyard
Rutherglen stickies - Chambers

Guest,

Have you tried the 02 Graveyard? IMO, I doubt it will be in the prime of its life in 2023. It may still be good in 2015 but from there possibly downhill.

And, stickies are a bad choice. They best drunk when they are fresh, within a few years of bottling. Once in the bottle, unless they are VP, they do not get better. Also most are N/V so not a great idea for a 21st.

Unfortunatly, with the current winemaking techniques, very few Oz wines will be great in 21 years. Grange, Bin 707, Armagh, Tahbilk 1860's Vines; Cullen and Petaluma (in a good year) are possibles. And as Martin says in his post below, 02 was not great in Coonawarra or Margaret River.

2002 is average vintage in Margaret River & Coonawarra. I know generalisation is bad but exceptions are rare and few. I wouldnt wager on those ICONS to go the distance.

O'Leary Reserve Claire 2002 is my pick and I am confident this wine is built to last. Huge structure, enormous fruit weight and exceptionally well balance.

TORB wrote:
Unfortunatly, with the current winemaking techniques, very few Oz wines will be great in 21 years.

Hi Ric,

dont mean to be thick... please elaborate the above statement.

regards

Christo

PS: what about the Kays block 6? Also ive got a magnum of the oscar semmelr 02... what do you think of these two for Guests requirement??

Fr a commercial point of view, most producers cannot affort to make tannic monsters that can only be drunk 10 yrs fr the vintage unless u r Wendouree. Most ppl. do not have the patience and space. They want u to drink-up and start buying their new release.

Some of the techniques which Ric mentioned are;
1) Picked riper
2) Lees stirring
3) Racking or micro-oxynation(more industrial)

This will help to make wines more friendly and acessible upon release.

Torb,

Couldn't agree with you more wholeheartedly. 21 years is a huge age for modern table wine styles.I'd be recommending a old fashioned monstrous Vintage Port with tannin coming out its gazoo!

Cheers

Smithy

TORB wrote:

Anonymous wrote:here are some suggestions;
Hunter's Shiraz - Brokenwood Graveyard
Rutherglen stickies - Chambers

Guest,

Have you tried the 02 Graveyard? IMO, I doubt it will be in the prime of its life in 2023. It may still be good in 2015 but from there possibly downhill.

And, stickies are a bad choice. They best drunk when they are fresh, within a few years of bottling. Once in the bottle, unless they are VP, they do not get better. Also most are N/V so not a great idea for a 21st.

Unfortunatly, with the current winemaking techniques, very few Oz wines will be great in 21 years. Grange, Bin 707, Armagh, Tahbilk 1860's Vines; Cullen and Petaluma (in a good year) are possibles. And as Martin says in his post below, 02 was not great in Coonawarra or Margaret River.

You've pretty well nailed it Ric. Have never tasted a 20+ y.o. of any you've recommended. Closest would be an 1860s 1985 in 1991. What about Tahbilk reserve cab or the 1933 Vines shiraz? Tahbilk usually gives the same longevity rating for those as the 1860s and they're about half the price.

Regards

daz

TORB wrote:

Anonymous wrote:here are some suggestions;
Hunter's Shiraz - Brokenwood Graveyard
Rutherglen stickies - Chambers

Guest,

Have you tried the 02 Graveyard? IMO, I doubt it will be in the prime of its life in 2023. It may still be good in 2015 but from there possibly downhill.

Ric,
Now that is a sweeping statement. Bet you haven't try the Lindy 6600. 22 years "young" and drinking like a "pup". Hunter's Shiraz has clearly demonstrates the ability to produce the longest living reds that last for many decades.

Waratah wrote:Ric,
Now that is a sweeping statement. Bet you haven't try the Lindy 6600. 22 years "young" and drinking like a "pup". Hunter's Shiraz has clearly demonstrates the ability to produce the longest living reds that last for many decades.

Waratah,

There was nothing sweeping about my statement. The discussion is not about what has happened in the past (twenty two years ago) it is about what is happening now.

There were many "great" SA wines that could go the distance in years gone by, but times change - as do winemaking methods- and that applies just as much to the Hunter as to SA.

No doubt that the best Hunter reds from the great years will live 20 years and then some. Problem is, 2002 isn't a great year for Graveyard, so Ric is right. The 2000 graveyard will live 20 years, but that's not much help. 2002: good wine, but not a great one.

2002 was shocking in the yarra for cabernet. way way way too cool. would therefore avoid mount mary 2002 quintet.

hunt down some 2002 stanton and killeen vintage port, it should be a cracker. great year up there, and a seriously ageworthy style.

I reckon smithys 2002 parolas durif might even go that long - even if he's not so sure.

or, taking a big leap, some upper level rousseau burgundy: great year, and these wines have tannin and fruit and longevity coded in them as the default.

No doubt that the best Hunter reds from the great years will live 20 years and then some. Problem is, 2002 isn't a great year for Graveyard, so Ric is right. The 2000 graveyard will live 20 years, but that's not much help. 2002: good wine, but not a great one.

2002 was shocking in the yarra for cabernet. way way way too cool. would therefore avoid mount mary 2002 quintet.

hunt down some 2002 stanton and killeen vintage port, it should be a cracker. great year up there, and a seriously ageworthy style.

I reckon smithys 2002 parolas durif might even go that long - even if he's not so sure.

or, taking a big leap, some upper level rousseau burgundy: great year, and these wines have tannin and fruit and longevity coded in them as the default.

Chow Chow wrote:2002 is average vintage in Margaret River & Coonawarra. I know generalisation is bad but exceptions are rare and few. I wouldnt wager on those ICONS to go the distance.

O'Leary Reserve Claire 2002 is my pick and I am confident this wine is built to last. Huge structure, enormous fruit weight and exceptionally well balance.

James Halliday rates Magaret River 8/10 for reds in 2002 with Swan District 10/10 for reds and Perth Hills 9/10.

He rates Coonawarra reds 9/10 which while not like Barossa pretty damn good.None of the big guns have been realeased yet so i guess time will tell.

ChubBBoy wrote:My godson was born in 2002 and I would like to buy some 2002 vintage wines to cellar until he is 21.

Unfortunately I have absolutely no idea which wines will last that long and I am hoping that some kind souls will be able to suggest some nice wines (preferably Australian) that will last for > 20 years.

My personal favorite wine is Penfolds Bin 389 and I understand the 2002 vintage was a great one. Will it last > 20 years though? Do Australian wines often last this long, or will I need to look at some imported wines?

I also assume that a red wine will last longer than a white, is this true?

Thank you in advance....

Charles

Hi Charles
I did a similar thing for my kids birth years but went with magnums to hopefully ensure they were sound when required. I have a 1990 St Henri for my son and a 92 John Riddoch for my daughter, from memory they were around $70 for the St Henri & $90 for the John Riddoch. Also you should give some thought to how they will be stored, if you spend $600 on a first growth bordeaux or $400 on grange then simmer it gently in the lounge room wine rack for 15 years or so you may be very dissapointed in the end result. Good luck with whatever you choose.
Cheers Andrew

ChubBBoy wrote:My godson was born in 2002 and I would like to buy some 2002 vintage wines to cellar until he is 21.

Unfortunately I have absolutely no idea which wines will last that long and I am hoping that some kind souls will be able to suggest some nice wines (preferably Australian) that will last for > 20 years.

My personal favorite wine is Penfolds Bin 389 and I understand the 2002 vintage was a great one. Will it last > 20 years though? Do Australian wines often last this long, or will I need to look at some imported wines?

I also assume that a red wine will last longer than a white, is this true?

Thank you in advance....

Charles

My son was born 2002 - same question.

I've put away some Giaconda reds (both types) and,
. will certainly get St Henri,
. John Riddoch won't be made again until 2003 which is a shame because they're pretty long lived.
. Haven't seen 02 Petaluma Coonawarra yet even though it's 18 months since the 2001 release
. Grange 2002 will be prohibitively expensive.
. Cullen 2002 is not a "great" Cullen but history suggests that it will at least be pretty good and will almost certainly go the distance.
. Dunno about Moss Wood
. '02 Bin 389 will be OK I guess. It'll make it, just maybe not in prime shape.
. As a rule, will be seeking out some magnums given the slower evolution of wine in large format bottles.

The difference between keeping wine at 13 degrees c and 16+ degrees c will make years of difference if you are looking to age wines

Agree with guest, appropriate storage is paramount!!!

I was married in 2002... very cold day in history.... 1st June , 1st day of winter!!

Ive put aside some of these 2002's:
Kays Block 6
bottles & magnums of Lakes Folly Cab
Noon reserve Cab & reserve shiraz
Kaeselar Bogan
Greenoack Creek, alice, VII acre, apricot
Magnums of Dutscke Oscar & st Jacob
Glaetzer Amon ra
Wild duck creek Duck muck & magnum of springflat, & cab

The aim is to taste along the way & judge how the wine evolves, assesing which wines will hold up, & which i'll be drinking sooner rather than later.

Also waiting for release of:
Mt Langi 10/10 vintage in 2002
St petes
octavius
Glaetzer shiraz

hopes this helps
regards

Christo

PS: now i gotta start planning for vintage 2004 as my little girl was born then (see avatar)
cd

FatBoy wrote:

ChubBBoy wrote:
Charles

My son was born .
. Haven't seen 02 Petaluma Coonawarra yet even though it's 18 months since the 2001 release

Have been waiting on this one. Maybe we are not going to see it for 02?

Hi

I am in the same situation and would like to check if the Grant Burge Filsell Shiraz 2002 or the Penfold Bins 389 will last for 18 to 21 years ?

Any other white and red recommendation is also appreciated.

Thank you

ChubBBoy wrote:My godson was born in 2002 and I would like to buy some 2002 vintage wines to cellar until he is 21.

Unfortunately I have absolutely no idea which wines will last that long and I am hoping that some kind souls will be able to suggest some nice wines (preferably Australian) that will last for > 20 years.

My personal favorite wine is Penfolds Bin 389 and I understand the 2002 vintage was a great one. Will it last > 20 years though? Do Australian wines often last this long, or will I need to look at some imported wines?

I also assume that a red wine will last longer than a white, is this true?

Thank you in advance....

Charles

hysterical1144 wrote:Hi

I am in the same situation and would like to check if the Grant Burge Filsell Shiraz 2002 or the Penfold Bins 389 will last for 18 to 21 years ?


Charles

[/quote]

Nope, unless "sterile" wine is your cup of tea

Anonymous wrote:Rutherglen stickies - Chambers

These are designed to be consumed within a short period of time after release and just go south after that point. They do not improve with age in the bottle.

As to recommendations, due to changes in viticulture and winemaking techniques over the last decade, there are not all that many Oz reds that will go 20 years. To make matters more difficult, Coonawarra and Margaret River which would normally produce some Cabernets that would go that long both had a difficult vintage. Grange, 707, Wendouree, Run Rig and The Yarra Yarra may be contenders. You will need to choose very carefully; also some of the top shelf wines will not be released for some time.

TORB wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Rutherglen stickies - Chambers

These are designed to be consumed within a short period of time after release and just go south after that point. They do not improve with age in the bottle.

I am looking at Bullers Musuem Calliope Tokay or Seppelt Rare DP59 to put away for my birthday late this year. Do you think they will both last ok and which do you think should be better?

Claud

Claud,

A few weeks ago I had a Bullers Museum Muscat that I had bought during Plonk Oz in 2002; it was fine and drinking very nicely, but not as fresh as previous bottles.

My preference would be the Buller over the DP 59 but both are lovely wines.

Charles,

First of all, well done on planning ahead and having a child in a good year. I would go for a proven long termer and buy magnums if possible. Given some of the suggestions above I think it important to remember that "big" wines are not guaranteed to age well long term because of their immense structure, more often than not the opposite is true. One of the safer bets would have to be the Tahbilk "1860" Vines Shiraz, a proportion of which is always released in magnums.

But if you want a sure thing...

Go for the Vintage Port. The very best VP's going around are still ridiculously good value, so you could mix up a dozen or so (Stanton & Killeen, Morris, Buller, Warrabilla and Pfeiffer) for interests sake. A fully mature VP is one of lifes true delights, just as one of lifes great disappointments is realizing that this carefully cellared ambrosia has just been necked by your son and his pissy mates at his 21st, in between bourbon and cokes.

Cheers,

LL

Penfolds Great GrandFather?

What about some Seppelt Show Sparkling Shiraz 2002.

I'm not sure when this will be released as its usually 10 years after the vintage, and I know that they missed a few years. Anyway, this should stand up to 20 years. I had a 1996 the other night, and although its losing its fizz, its still a great wine.

Cheers
David

not australian but why not look to bdx for what they do better - age worthy reds

02 Cos Estournel perhaps??