The Auswine Forum

That is just this little black duck's opinion. I will allow one type only, and that is the original filling of the bottles, for I really have not tried recently filled bottles.
When we decant wine and use things like breathe easy gadgets or swirl our glass to let air in are we not causing the same effect as "bottle shock"
I remember a story, was it Ric who told it, about a winemaker that opened a bottle emptied a little, shook the living daylights out of the bottle and proceeded to pour and enjoy it. Would that not shock the bottle?
I, and one fellow plonk drinker, feel that some bad bottles of wine are passed off as "bottle shock".
OK, over to you lot. Shoot me down in flames.
MM.

A few years ago my wife and I took a bottle of Oz shiraz (something called the Larrikin) up to Napa. It spent an hour or so on the plane then at least 10 hours bouncing around in the trunk of the car as we toured through a bunch of wineries. We met up with a winemaker friend and his wife for dinner. He brought his Syrah and we opened both wines. The Larrikin lived up to its name and stared out hot and bothered, so we drank the Syrah. Then we turned to the Larrikin, and everyone had bottle shock, it had gotten down to something like room temperature and was just great Aussie shiraz - blew the Syrah off the table.

Mike

Bottle shock does exist. It is highly dependent on the wine (factors such as acidity, SO2, CO2 in solution) and the filler used (including corker, ie hand, vacuum. and whether bottles are sparged prefilling).

Bottle shock post filling is completely different to that of aeration of decanting. A wine that goes to bottle goes into shock, it could be due to a number of different features. Personally, given that when wine is bottled, the filling process can be either highly reductive or highly oxidative, along with the vast pressure changes (based again on filler and corker) is bound to reak havoc on the chemical sturcture of numerous sensorily important compounds. Therefore for structure to resume, time is required. Aerating wine for the purpose of consumption is for liberation of aromatics etc... Due to elevated sulphur regimes in many wines, the tightness of acid structure so on and so forth, many wines need some air to liven up. Essentially it could be thought of as a minimal oxidative process, where the purpose could be a binding of free sulphur, which will mask a lot of aromatics and heighten perceived acid. Many may argue that the polymerisation of tannins is also affected by this process, I personally dont subscribe to this opinion. However, the interaction of tannins and acid and other metabolites will change over time, in the glass/decanter.

In regards to wine travelling well, again there is definate answer. Many of the wines that I have seen post travel, including our own wines, as well as various other Australian, New Zealand, American and French wines, is that they will suffer. A disparity of pressure and large diurnal spread will not favour any wine. Some wines bounce back immediately, others if not most, take time. Then of course those that have been poorly shipped will never be the same.

Just 2c

Colin.

Whatever it is that allows a wine to recover from shock, its possible that its not access to oxygen, as this study would suggest. Other factors may be in play.

Mike

Mike
Bottle shock used to refer to the percieved reduction in quality due to the filtering, sulphuring, and actual bottling. In these days of vacuum bottling iits way less of an issue, but still many winemakers sit on wines after bottling without releasing them.

The way it is talked about now is like shipping shock. I have heard that wines need some time to settle down after going to the other side of the globe. A sort of vinous jetlag!

We bottled the 04 Parola's over the last few days, and have sold heaps already. Will they settle down over the next fortnight- 3 weeks?
I honestly don't know, but I would expect so a bit.
It does take some time for the colour to equilibrate itself with the added SO2 to protect it at bottling.
They taste pretty amazing now though.

Durif 17.5% alc
Shiraz 16.%
Cabernet 16.1%

Cheers
Smithy

smithy wrote:8)
Mike
Bottle shock used to refer to the percieved reduction in quality due to the filtering, sulphuring, and actual bottling. In these days of vacuum bottling iits way less of an issue, but still many winemakers sit on wines after bottling without releasing them.

The way it is talked about now is like shipping shock. I have heard that wines need some time to settle down after going to the other side of the globe. A sort of vinous jetlag!

We bottled the 04 Parola's over the last few days, and have sold heaps already. Will they settle down over the next fortnight- 3 weeks?
I honestly don't know, but I would expect so a bit.
It does take some time for the colour to equilibrate itself with the added SO2 to protect it at bottling.
They taste pretty amazing now though.

Durif 17.5% alc
Shiraz 16.%
Cabernet 16.1%

Cheers
Smithy

Smithy:

I've never actually tested whether it really is necessary, but I always put any wines I get shipped to me into the cellar for at least a few weeks for that exact reason. I was pretty amazed by that bottle of Larrikin because it came out of the trunk of the car hotter that I would have wanted to serve up any wine but we didn't have an alternative. I was more than a little surprised by how it changed once it had cooled. I think it points more to the importance of the temperature of the wine than to how it has been treated (within limits) before serving. I still rate it as my best example of bottle shock!

Mike

Sorry, just saw a typo in my above post, I believe there is NO definitive answer in regards to the bottles travelling...

Anonymous wrote:Sorry, just saw a typo in my above post, I believe there is NO definitive answer in regards to the bottles travelling...

I knew what you meant, and you corrected your spelling. Well done Colin.
MM.

KMP wrote:

smithy wrote:8)

I've never actually tested whether it really is necessary, but I always put any wines I get shipped to me into the cellar for at least a few weeks for that exact reason. I was pretty amazed by that bottle of Larrikin because it came out of the trunk of the car hotter that I would have wanted to serve up any wine but we didn't have an alternative. I was more than a little surprised by how it changed once it had cooled. I think it points more to the importance of the temperature of the wine than to how it has been treated (within limits) before serving. I still rate it as my best example of bottle shock!

Mike

Hey Mike

Gavin here.

Sounds more like 'trunk shock' than travel shock.

Heat/serving temperature does have a strong effect, hot wines seem to emphasise the alcohol over the fruit, and subtleties are lost.

To the debate, I'm not an expert, but feel that, extending bouncing around and travelling must have some effect on the elements/compounds within a wine, and that a little time would help?

Just an observation, no science behind it at all!

I'm only experienced in bigger reds and the science is beyond me but I do know that wines allowed time to settle after bottling definitely look better than ones you open just days off the bottling line.

As for timeframes, I'm not sure but certainly a coupla months in the cool and quiet can do alot for a wine.

True bottle shock is no myth....

Coming home to my wife finishing a bottle of 2000 Latour with my mother in law does the job nicely....

JM

in the name of hypothesis. bottle shock, only applied to aged wine where sediments need to be settled. for young wine wtf... loads of craps!!!

Anonymous wrote:in the name of hypothesis. bottle shock, only applied to aged wine where sediments need to be settled. for young wine wtf... loads of craps!!!

does this apply to post bottling -bottle shock. If so, I would more than interested in hearing the scientific background behind the statement.

Mike, thanks for the props on the spelling, I do my best, I will register a user name and make an effort to post more incoherent drivel, generally of a scientific nature.

Cheers
Colin.

Two different arguments here - post-bottling shock and travel shock.

What I class as bottle shock is really immediate post-bottling changes that Colin has already covered. It is not crap, although different circumstances can provide different impacts, and some not at all.

The first sem sav (screwcap) under our label looked daisy-fresh the first 24 hours off the line and then underwent 3 weeks of difficulty with it's new surrounds. We expected it would, and for this reason we held it back from release until we were satisfied that the wine was ready and 'restructured'.

Examples I saw during the time varied from dullness of nose and palate to complete flavour scalping - like drinking water virtually (no wise-guys please!), or probably better described as drinking wine while holding your nose.

Geez Mike, A rant about bottle shock.

What next, leaky corks and deep ullage does not mean the wine is off?

Nah, everybody knows that one is true