The Auswine Forum

*** This post and the opinion contained herein should not be relied upon as legal advice ***

Hey everyone,

Thought I'd share a recent (and ongoing) experience with a Melbourne wine retailer - partly as a place to vent frustrations, but also as a reference point for anyone else looking for some guidance/moral support on how to chase up a refund for a faulty wine purchase.

I've been purchasing and collecting wines for almost 10 years now and never had a hard time getting a replacement - especially when dealing directly with local producers. I've always found a courteous email or phone call yielded a positive outcome. Not so in this case.

Background

The wine in question was a 2012 Grand Cru burgundy purchased 'new' from retail store and consumed 2 days later at an offline dinner. Unanimous view from the 8 tasters was that the wine was faulty, although the group was split on the cause - half suggested cork issue and the other half thought some sort of wine-making fault. Around half the wine contents were retained with original bottle/cork. For what it's worth, my CellarTracker records suggest I've made at least 8 prior purchases from this retailer.

Action Taken

- In the first instance, I sent a courteous email to the retailer the next morning (14/12) to let them know of the issue - more as a time stamp of when the issue occurred
- Retailer replied two business days later (17/12) to apologise and requested that I return the bottle to them
- I posted the bottle back to them at my expense with tracking (18/12) - confirmed delivered on 20/12
- Follow-up emails sent 23/12 to make sure they received the bottle and then again on 06/01 - I realise this was over the Christmas period, but said retailer was also sending out daily sales emails each day during this period
- Phone calls made on 06/01, 08,01, 09/01, 15/01, 17/01, 20/01 and 22/01 - a combination of answering machine, leaving messages with other staff members. Spoke to the 'Administration Manager' on 15/01 and was promised a phone call the next day.
- Still no return phone call or response from said retailer.
- Raised credit card dispute with my bank (NAB) on 22/01

So now I have to sit out the next 30 days and see where the dispute process goes!

Other Potential Recourse
- Social media posts - not really my cup of tea, but I've seen that this can be quite an effective method to get their attention
- Consumer Affairs Complaint
- Civil Claims List Claim through VCAT

Has anyone else experienced poor customer service like this in the past? Any other tips or recommendations to get things progressed?

You can quote to them the ACL...and raise a case with the ACCC....I'm not sure this will apply but there are some agencies where even a complaint costs these companies money if the agency takes it on, even if they're right.

That said...Being unsure about the problem and the bottle half empty...plus the fact that they may not get anything from the importer and for sure the importer will get nothing from the producer...all of that makes this a real ugly one.

Polymer wrote:You can quote to them the ACL...and raise a case with the ACCC....I'm not sure this will apply but there are some agencies where even a complaint costs these companies money if the agency takes it on, even if they're right.

That said...Being unsure about the problem and the bottle half empty...plus the fact that they may not get anything from the importer and for sure the importer will get nothing from the producer...all of that makes this a real ugly one.

Thanks for the reply Polymer! Will see how the charge-back process goes first - that seems to be the quickest and most non-confrontational way to deal with it for now.

In terms of the missing half-bottle, it was simply because by the time 8 people had a taste, some chucked it into the spittoon straight away and some got spilled trying to decant it from glasses back into the bottle. In any event, from the half that was returned it should have been fairly evident that the wine was faulty.

Seems odd to me that the retailer would reply promptly, apologise, and then ask you to send them the bottle only to ignore you afterwards. Is it a change of heart, staff not being on the same page regarding returns, or simply tardiness on the part of whoever is supposed to assess the bottle and get back to the customer?

I am surprised you can use a charge back process... the argument a corked wine is "not as described" is a bit tenuous I would have thought.
But I definitely think sending back half a bottle is a pretty fair sign the wine was not drinkable even though its not the full bottle.

"Consumers can request a chargeback for a number of reasons, most commonly when:

they pay for products or services with a credit card, or select 'credit' on a debit card, and:
the products or services received are not as described
they do not receive the products or services at all or within the agreed timeframe.
there are duplicate or fraudulent transactions
charges are made without permission
unrecognised transactions appear
the business they purchased products or services from stops operating and they did not get what they paid for."

Diddy,

I just noticed that your location states Melbourne but presume you aren't there otherwise you would have visited the retailer instead of writing, phoning, and mailing.

I'm also inclined to agree with Sam regarding the charge-back.

Cheers ................ Mahmoud.

sjw_11 wrote:I am surprised you can use a charge back process... the argument a corked wine is "not as described" is a bit tenuous I would have thought.
But I definitely think sending back half a bottle is a pretty fair sign the wine was not drinkable even though its not the full bottle.

"Consumers can request a chargeback for a number of reasons, most commonly when:

they pay for products or services with a credit card, or select 'credit' on a debit card, and:
the products or services received are not as described
they do not receive the products or services at all or within the agreed timeframe.
there are duplicate or fraudulent transactions
charges are made without permission
unrecognised transactions appear
the business they purchased products or services from stops operating and they did not get what they paid for."

Interestingly the Visa Scheme Rules seem to recognise faulty goods as a valid chargeback reason - see Condition 13.3 Not as Described or Defective Merchandise/Services.

Happy to give it a try for experimental purposes and report back here.

Also, in terms of the 'not as described' argument, I'd actually asked the vendor to provide a recommendation in an earlier email, which included his tasting note on the wine. Should be interesting to see where how this plays out.

Mahmoud Ali wrote:Diddy,

I just noticed that your location states Melbourne but presume you aren't there otherwise you would have visited the retailer instead of writing, phoning, and mailing.

I'm also inclined to agree with Sam regarding the charge-back.

Cheers ................ Mahmoud.

Yes, I'm in Melbourne as well, but cant get there as it's a biy of a hike and theyre only open during ordinary business hours when I'm also working.

I think the chargeback is a good way of getting the wine retailers attention here as other methods of communication have failed, notwithstanding if it's ultimately accepted or declined.

So! Happy to share that the chargeback process was a success - full refund onto the credit card!

Good for you Diddy.

One question, do you know if it was the credit card company who, on their own, gave you the credit/refund, or was it the retailer who, to be fair, in the first instance apologized and asked you to return the bottle.

Mahmoud.

Mahmoud Ali wrote:Good for you Diddy.

One question, do you know if it was the credit card company who, on their own, gave you the credit/refund, or was it the retailer who, to be fair, in the first instance apologized and asked you to return the bottle.

Mahmoud.

I'm not sure whether the merchant agreed to the chargeback or failed to respond in time.

Either way, still haven't received any direct response to my initial approaches.

Diddy wrote:

Mahmoud Ali wrote:Good for you Diddy.

One question, do you know if it was the credit card company who, on their own, gave you the credit/refund, or was it the retailer who, to be fair, in the first instance apologized and asked you to return the bottle.

Mahmoud.

I'm not sure whether the merchant agreed to the chargeback or failed to respond in time.

Either way, still haven't received any direct response to my initial approaches.

Whichever it was, still a great outcome!

Agreed, good outcome. A pity this was the avenue that was required. It would be interesting to hear if you hear anything further from them.