The Auswine Forum

I realise the question is a bit of a contradiction of terms, however given the festive season is almost upon us, which champagnes do you consider to be the best value?

Right now I would lean toward Pol Roger NV, but its nice to have other options.

2006 Piper Heidsieck Brut was the best value champagne IMHO at the recent Dan Murphy's champagne showcase. Drinking well now and more of an early drinking style. Can be found at around $65 per bottle. The best Australian sparkling white by far was 2007 Arras Grand Vintage for around the same price.

Otherwise if you want something more interesting than the big house releases stick to small grower stuff like Marc Herbrart, Paul Dethune, Pierre Gimonnet, Paul Bara, Frank Bonville, Margaine - both NV and vintage releases are pretty good quality for the price.

I've enjoyed Roederer NV for the price. Gosset has a good reputation here as well and I was impressed by a half recently opened. However if the brains of the operation had her way we would drink it once a year but it would be Krug. Damn her fine taste!

One that used to come in for fearsome abuse was Lanson Black Label (aka battery acid), but a good number of people swear by picking it up when reduced and cellaring it for 5+ years, with the fearsome acidity keeping it fresh as it matures.

I went searching a year or so back for a good quality grower available for a decent price locally. After extensive tasting, I settled on Serge Mathieu as my preferred "low cost" champagne. Available for sub-$50, I just never seem to see anything else that comes close.

Have you tried the Arras that Andrew references above?

I'm not a champagne man by and large, but blind Freddy can taste the quality in that wine. Be interested to hear what you make of it.

I too like the Arras GV 2007 more than most Oz fizz, but admit that I usually go for champagne over local bubbles at that $50+ price point. Usually Pol NV or Laurent-Perrier NV which I think just offer a touch more complexity and line. Beyond $100 I prefer Pol vintage, Agrapart, Cedric Bouchard then up to the obvious yum of Krug and Comtes. Back to earth I think Chandon are doing pretty well at the moment in the sub $30 area, and even some of the budget Champagnes offer easy drinking, albeit with usually higher dosage and a slightly mono-dimensional character. Some nice Cremants around from Loire and Jura, and of course, it's a Pet Nat hipster frenzy out there at the moment!! They are selling like hot cakes.

I'm keen to try a few of the names popping up here though, finding quality bubbles under $50 is a bit of a holy grail. Will check out the Piper H 2006 too, thanks Andrew. I thought Moet 2008 was OK, but expected a bit more, would rather have Mumm or Lanson and save $30. Pierre Peters and Frank Bonville are pretty good too (from the few I've had).

Summer starts tomorrow!!!

"Pet Nat hipster frenzy"

There's a t-shirt idea to keep me busy this weekend!

Drappier is my go to cheap NV

Pol Roger NV and Roederer NV are go-to's for me. But if you want to go cheaper, Piper Heidsieck NV is pretty decent - not as complex or well balanced Pol or Roederer IMO, but certainly good value for money.

Ian S wrote:One that used to come in for fearsome abuse was Lanson Black Label (aka battery acid), but a good number of people swear by picking it up when reduced and cellaring it for 5+ years, with the fearsome acidity keeping it fresh as it matures.

I remember that discussion at TC's place back around (what was it?) 2006. I'm not much of a Lanson Black Label fan, but I bought some off the back of that discussion to experiment. I actually opened a bottle of it about one year ago. Almost 10 years after purchase, it was showing very well - certainly much more complex and integrated than near-disgorgement. I thought the acidity was balanced too, although I caution that I do like plenty of acid.

Piper NV is v good
I love the Arras cheapie sub 30 bucks
As well

Arras BdB for me, but that and the GV are both at a price point where you would probably go champagne

I pick up the Lanson Vintage Gold label when it's on special. Currently drinking 2004 and 2005.
Bollinger is another house favourite.

I also picked up some Cuperley Prestige for sub $50

Ian S wrote:One that used to come in for fearsome abuse was Lanson Black Label (aka battery acid), but a good number of people swear by picking it up when reduced and cellaring it for 5+ years, with the fearsome acidity keeping it fresh as it matures.

Many years ago, in Tom Stevenson's Millennium Champagne & Sparkling Wine Guide (1998), he said this about the Lanson NV Black Label Brut: "I would not bother to taste Lanson Black Label until it had undergone at least two years in my cellar, preferably five, after which I would serve it blind to Masters of Wine, asking them to name the house and vintage."

I had never put this to the test but this year came across three versions of the Lanson Black Label, each with a different livery. The oldest bottles with the oldest labels had no disgorgement date; only some of the second version had a disgorgement date, while the current version were disgorged in 2015. I tasted both of the older versions and got a sense of what Tom Stevenson meant. This is a Champagne to put away for five or more years.

Of course finding them on sale only helps.

Cheers ................ Mahmoud.

Laherte Freres ultradition stood out in a recent tasting. $60 or thereabouts.

Mahmoud Ali wrote:

Ian S wrote:One that used to come in for fearsome abuse was Lanson Black Label (aka battery acid), but a good number of people swear by picking it up when reduced and cellaring it for 5+ years, with the fearsome acidity keeping it fresh as it matures.

Many years ago, in Tom Stevenson's Millennium Champagne & Sparkling Wine Guide (1998), he said this about the Lanson NV Black Label Brut: "I would not bother to taste Lanson Black Label until it had undergone at least two years in my cellar, preferably five, after which I would serve it blind to Masters of Wine, asking them to name the house and vintage."

I had never put this to the test but this year came across three versions of the Lanson Black Label, each with a different livery. The oldest bottles with the oldest labels had no disgorgement date; only some of the second version had a disgorgement date, while the current version were disgorged in 2015. I tasted both of the older versions and got a sense of what Tom Stevenson meant. This is a Champagne to put away for five or more years.

Of course finding them on sale only helps.

Cheers ................ Mahmoud.

No malo in the Lanson makes that acid ping. These days of global warming means a lot more are following suit

rossmckay wrote:

Mahmoud Ali wrote:

Ian S wrote:One that used to come in for fearsome abuse was Lanson Black Label (aka battery acid), but a good number of people swear by picking it up when reduced and cellaring it for 5+ years, with the fearsome acidity keeping it fresh as it matures.

Many years ago, in Tom Stevenson's Millennium Champagne & Sparkling Wine Guide (1998), he said this about the Lanson NV Black Label Brut: "I would not bother to taste Lanson Black Label until it had undergone at least two years in my cellar, preferably five, after which I would serve it blind to Masters of Wine, asking them to name the house and vintage."

I had never put this to the test but this year came across three versions of the Lanson Black Label, each with a different livery. The oldest bottles with the oldest labels had no disgorgement date; only some of the second version had a disgorgement date, while the current version were disgorged in 2015. I tasted both of the older versions and got a sense of what Tom Stevenson meant. This is a Champagne to put away for five or more years.

Of course finding them on sale only helps.

Cheers ................ Mahmoud.

No malo in the Lanson makes that acid ping. These days of global warming means a lot more are following suit

When I was in Champagene a few months ago, many of the makers shared the same view Ross

As per many above I favour Pol or Louis Roederer. Recently also been enjoying Charles Heidsick. Generally all 3 can be had in the $60-$70 range and I think represent good drinking at that price.

Now that it's warming up again time to revive the thread.

A number of the big houses are now releasing their 2008s which by all accounts is a good vintage. Any favourites? I have loaded up on the Pol Roger. I see Mumm just released their vintage wine.

conformistpete wrote:Now that it's warming up again time to revive the thread.

A number of the big houses are now releasing their 2008s which by all accounts is a good vintage. Any favourites? I have loaded up on the Pol Roger. I see Mumm just released their vintage wine.

When it was available in Oz, the 2008 Frank Bonville was excellent value (sub 60 from memory).. cheaper than in the UK and US. Grand Cru grapes too. While Pol is excellent (both brut and bdb), at $120 it's not exactly cheap - I bought both. I'm interested to see what price the 08 Bara is in Oz. Hopefully sub$80.

At the other end of the spectrum, the tete du cuvees from 2008 should start to hit the market next year (Chetillons, Couer de Cuvée and Goisses came and went very quickly). Sadly, there won't be any bargains there. I'm being told to expect a substantial price hike.

Not answering the OP question but thought I'd post it anyway, we buy the Seppelt Fleur de Lys NV (can be around or below ~$10 on special) by the case as a quaffing sparkling - IMHO a great sparkling at the price.

I can't help out re the more expensive strata except to say we used to go for a Perrier Jouet NV when we did seek to splurge... now I try to save my money for the red stuff.

Just brought some NV Pommery, went to a tasting last week and really enjoyed it...sub $50, not too bad.
Cheers Craig

For me, most of the big market bubbles (e.g. Moet, Veuve, Roederer, Pol Roger etc) are about the same in quality...so price then becomes the main determinant...as such, Piper Heidsieck wins out easily at $33-34. Put it in the cellar for 2 years and it drinks well above its price point.

At $60-80, for my palate the smaller growers such as Pierre Peters, Andre Clouet, etc usually destroy the big market Champagne at the same price range.

bdellabosca wrote:Not answering the OP question but thought I'd post it anyway, we buy the Seppelt Fleur de Lys NV (can be around or below ~$10 on special) by the case as a quaffing sparkling - IMHO a great sparkling at the price.

Isn't there a vintage Fleur de Lys as well?

There is for about 50% more (i.e. ~$15 pb). I've never tried it! Ha ha...

tarija wrote:
At $60-80, for my palate the smaller growers such as Pierre Peters, Andre Clouet, etc usually destroy the big market Champagne at the same price range.

I love both but are getting harder to find in that price range. I also stocked up on the Bonville but I think I'm down to my last bottle.

Mahmoud Ali wrote:

bdellabosca wrote:Not answering the OP question but thought I'd post it anyway, we buy the Seppelt Fleur de Lys NV (can be around or below ~$10 on special) by the case as a quaffing sparkling - IMHO a great sparkling at the price.

Isn't there a vintage Fleur de Lys as well?

On the Australian theme and with you Mahmoud, Seppelts is hard to beat, both in white and red.
Salinger vintage pound for pound is the best VFM in Oz, the 2012 at $20 a bargain...they also make an NV at $17...but why bother.
Sparkling Shiraz of course , particularly the show reserve releases are sublime.

I see that (unfortunately) there is a range that they have put out at GW, 3 or so new wines including a fizz...at $12 and spotted them the other day at $6!!...again why bother. However the Great Western Riesling has been revived, and if its half as good as the Drumborg it should be a belter.

Fleur de Lys struggles in my opinion, not much better than the old Seaview at $5 a pop (no pun intended). I have never actually seen a vintage release.

Cheers
Craig

rossmckay wrote: No malo in the Lanson makes that acid ping.

Actually Lanson USED TO BE strictly no malo, they have gone against that and in some instances they will let their wines go through some malo....

I find their recently disgorged black label's not as sharp as previous years, but agree with others, I like them far better with at least 5 years on them... picked these up for about $28 pb so have dozens stashed...

If i want to spend a little bit more than above, then I'd get Taittinger NV, then a little bit more I'd go Bollinger NV (again better with 5+ years).

Charles Heidseick is my go to sub $100 NV, this is probably closest to Krug for the price, their 08 based NV is superb!

VFM vintage, I'd agree with Mike Hawkins and go Franck Bonville BdB

Pol 08 could be had for around $70 recently (last week) not sure if still can at that price, but I prefer their BdB vintage to their standard vintage...

For vintage Champers $100+ I'd have to go Pierre Peters Chetillons.

Have a few, and I'd buy more Krug, both vintage and MV if could afford it.

phillisc wrote:

Mahmoud Ali wrote:

bdellabosca wrote:Not answering the OP question but thought I'd post it anyway, we buy the Seppelt Fleur de Lys NV (can be around or below ~$10 on special) by the case as a quaffing sparkling - IMHO a great sparkling at the price.

Isn't there a vintage Fleur de Lys as well?

On the Australian theme and with you Mahmoud, Seppelts is hard to beat, both in white and red.
Salinger vintage pound for pound is the best VFM in Oz, the 2012 at $20 a bargain...they also make an NV at $17...but why bother.
Sparkling Shiraz of course , particularly the show reserve releases are sublime.

I see that (unfortunately) there is a range that they have put out at GW, 3 or so new wines including a fizz...at $12 and spotted them the other day at $6!!...again why bother. However the Great Western Riesling has been revived, and if its half as good as the Drumborg it should be a belter.

Fleur de Lys struggles in my opinion, not much better than the old Seaview at $5 a pop (no pun intended). I have never actually seen a vintage release.

I should be in Sydney for the festive season so your advice will be most useful when it comes to good value sparkling for family gatherings.

Thanks .................. Mahmoud.

Lanson Gold Label for me. Can usually be had for around $50 on sale. Needs a few years in the cellar of course.

The 2002 was a real disappointment, but the 1996 is still drinking a treat.

deejay81 wrote:
Charles Heidseick is my go to sub $100 NV, this is probably closest to Krug for the price, their 08 based NV is superb.

it.

How do I tell which NV bottling is primarily 08?