The Auswine Forum

Hey all,

Im hoping someone might be able to help me with any information regarding this bottle of Orlando No1 Invalid Port, by G Gramp and Sons, that I recently 'inherited'. There's no date on the bottle, but to my untrained eye, it appears to be rather old....

I haven't been able to find any information regarding it online, so I'm hoping someone here may know something about it.

Thanks in advance,
Bill

I'm guessing here. It looks like mid 70's. The way the capsule is fitted to the bottle looks right for the era and the fact that it is in metric suggests it is after 1974/5 (I believe that is when everything converted over from the fl oz.)

Some of the guys here have wine encyclopaedias going back that far. Perhaps one of them can give you more specific information about the producer.

Ahhh, I wondered if the ml vs oz might be a tell of sorts.

The real question will be whether it's valuable to sell or more valuable to 'enjoy'

My guess would be to drink it. Most Orlando ports I see sell for 20-30 dollars. The vast majority of Aussie ports are worth 2/3 of stuff all-with a few notable exceptions.

I am afraid have a rather sad and depressing story about this wine, No.1 Invalid Port.

In 1981 I was working in far north Queensland (Coen up on Cape York Peninsula). This wine as sold to the local aborigines via the side door of the pub for $1.99 a bottle. It was the cheapest way to get the most alcohol for your money. The pub owner told us that during the big wet in Dec/Jan they would buy to the pallet load to make sure they would not run out. I was there (about 2 weeks). As a Kiwi working in Australia it was a real eye opener and I found it depressing.

Back to the wine, I am guessing it is nothing special and not really worth anything

Brodie

Hahaha I had another bottle of something I thought may be worth a bit, turned out to be a very similar story!

I'm starting to think my late grandfather was either a cheapskate or maybe gullible!

Thanks for the thought folks

Orlando used to make vintage port in the '70s (and maybe earlier) so the fact that this bottle has no vintage suggests that it is probably a ruby port, something that is likely a blend and made for current drinking (I presume there is no description of the style on a back label or Bill would have mentioned it). It also looks like the bottle has a t-stoppered cork. The fact that it was a ruby port might also account for the fact that it was a so inexpensive back in 1981 when Brodie was in Queensland.

As for the age of the bottle this label looks like a very old style and it may even predate the 70s. I am not familiar when Australia officially converted to the metric system but I just checked my bottle of Hardy's Port from 1972 and it is also in a 738ml bottle. In fact an empty bottle of 1967 Stonyfell Vintage Port that is in my trophy collection is also 738ml.

I wonder if there are people in the wine industry who could tell the general age of the bottle and the style of port.

Mahmoud.

Thanks Mahmoud,

Admittedly, I was hoping it was something like this:
http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/1963-ORLANDO ... 1991242628

Though I imagine if it was a vintage port bottle around the same time, it too would have a date label like the linked one.

Let's put it this way, I think I'm going to open it up and see what kind of genie comes out

The Orlando Tawny Port in your link has a label on the back that explains the style of port, one that is aged in barrels for a long time. Because it is a tawny and has a vintage it is what in Portugal they call a Colheita, a tawny port from a single vintage rather than a blend of ports with an age statement, like a 10 or 20 year-old. The labels don't give a bottling date but the back label does says that it is a very old port so the bottling must have taken place many years after the vintage. It is also in a 750 ml bottle which means that it was bottled after they switched from 738 ml to 750 ml and we know that at least up to 1972 they were still using the former measure.

As a person more interested in wine than in profit I certainly think that gaining the experience is the best decision. Do let us know how it goes.

Mahmoud.

brodie wrote:I am afraid have a rather sad and depressing story about this wine, No.1 Invalid Port.

In 1981 I was working in far north Queensland (Coen up on Cape York Peninsula). This wine as sold to the local aborigines via the side door of the pub for $1.99 a bottle. It was the cheapest way to get the most alcohol for your money. The pub owner told us that during the big wet in Dec/Jan they would buy to the pallet load to make sure they would not run out. I was there (about 2 weeks). As a Kiwi working in Australia it was a real eye opener and I found it depressing.

Brodie

Yes, very sad on different levels. I appreciate you sharing the recollection, even if it's a difficult message to hear.

Ian S wrote:

brodie wrote:I am afraid have a rather sad and depressing story about this wine, No.1 Invalid Port.,,

Yes, very sad on different levels. I appreciate you sharing the recollection, even if it's a difficult message to hear.

Agreed. I should have mentioned that in my posts.

Mahmoud.

Can confirm that hopes should not be raised!! Invalid No 1 was one of many labels for the same port Orlando sold - 'Conto' was another, and if you wanted sacramental (communion) wine, it was sold as 'Altar' wine, usually in 20 litre cans. It was super cheap - judging by the stopper cork and foil capsule, I would say late-sixties/early seventies, and if it had a whack of caramel in it as cheap ports did in those days (to make them taste old) it would be quite bitter by now. ( I worked for the big 'O' in the mid-seventies, and can remember opening the first carton of a new red to be put on the shelf, labelled 'Jacob's Creek Claret!)

WineRick wrote:Can confirm that hopes should not be raised!! Invalid No 1 was one of many labels for the same port Orlando sold - 'Conto' was another, and if you wanted sacramental (communion) wine, it was sold as 'Altar' wine, usually in 20 litre cans. It was super cheap - judging by the stopper cork and foil capsule, I would say late-sixties/early seventies, and if it had a whack of caramel in it as cheap ports did in those days (to make them taste old) it would be quite bitter by now. ( I worked for the big 'O' in the mid-seventies, and can remember opening the first carton of a new red to be put on the shelf, labelled 'Jacob's Creek Claret!)

Haha Im loving this to be honest!

I also inherited a bunch of war medals and badges, most of the good ones are fakes/reproductions

So I opened it and had a taste, of course the cork fell apart so there's some filtering happening... But it's, so far after a couple of sips, actually not too bad... I'll have a decent glass later and report back

But WineRick is definitely right about the caramel, it has a caramel aftertaste...

WineRick wrote:Can confirm that hopes should not be raised!! Invalid No 1 was one of many labels for the same port Orlando sold - 'Conto' was another, and if you wanted sacramental (communion) wine, it was sold as 'Altar' wine, usually in 20 litre cans. It was super cheap - judging by the stopper cork and foil capsule, I would say late-sixties/early seventies, and if it had a whack of caramel in it as cheap ports did in those days (to make them taste old) it would be quite bitter by now. ( I worked for the big 'O' in the mid-seventies, and can remember opening the first carton of a new red to be put on the shelf, labelled 'Jacob's Creek Claret!)

Great story, thanks very much for sharing. I love it.

Mahmoud.

BillT wrote:Thanks Mahmoud,

Admittedly, I was hoping it was something like this:
http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/1963-ORLANDO ... 1991242628

Though I imagine if it was a vintage port bottle around the same time, it too would have a date label like the linked one.

Let's put it this way, I think I'm going to open it up and see what kind of genie comes out

I just finished a bottle of this recently, yup, the 1963. Slightly different labeling (I think 'Vintage' was vertical), but I'm guessing very similar as it also said 'old' on the back label. Quite tasty, although I'd expect it had been in the bottle at least 25 years (so, probably 25 in the barrel, 28 in bottle by my estimate).
Had much more success with a coheita from 1938 (for my father). Very interesting flavour. Seemed to be almost completely sugarless and quite light in both colour and viscosity - but the taste was something of a peppery sherry sort of flavour. Very different from the old 'coheitas' from Seppeltsfield.

WineRick, hoping you may know of this one also?

While cleaning my garage I found the bottle I was given about 12 years ago in return for some work.

Of course I opened this one way back then and thoroughly enjoyed it!

Any ideas on it's origins?

Thanks again,
Bill

Bill,
One of many limited bottlings they use to do in those years, though not that common for fortifieds. From the label it's a 333 case bottling, years in oak is obscured, a Shiraz/Mataro blend - I'd hazard a guess at a 10 - 15 year old blend released in late 70's/early '80's. Strange bottle though - imported, by the look of the odd neck size. Hope this helps. WineRick.