The Auswine Forum

I am looking to cellar wine(s) from both the 1990 & 1986 vintage with the aim to get them to 50 years, around $600 value for each year. I'm not after a specific style or region, just something that will get there.

I've been reading a few posts here and there and the Penfolds Bin90A crops up a few times as a great special wine, wondering how this wine compares against the Bin 920, 1990 Grange and others?

My considerations so far, not really an exhaustive list, but early days:

90A
920
HofG
Grange
Krug Vintage
Dom Perignon
D'yquem

Bruno Giacosa Santo Stefano Riserva 1990. The great winemaker won't always be here, this vineyard in Albesani isn't selling grapes to Giacosa post 2011 and the wine is a 50 year wine no worries.

1990 Hill of Grace is poetic and I have a case of perfectly stored bottles ( down to the last 6 and was hoping to replace with 2012 but don't think so ) though 2040 it may not be so poetic. Having the 86 next week let you know!

Grange is OK in 1990 having had a bottle recently and will be fine in 2040

I have the 90 HOG, but I wouldn't bet on it being great at 2040, nor the 86 in 2036. That said, 90a, 920 and Grange (from both vintages) are a chance, but I would recommend getting the cellar to 9 or 10 degrees to slow down their evolution. Large format, while expensive, would also help.

90 Krug (magnum - but in turn, way more than $600) would be a chance, albeit it was a warmer vintage in France. The 90 DP would be a risk - but large format would help. The only DP made in 86 was the Rose from memory...

Both vintages were good for d'Yquem, and if well cellared (750 ml and above), they'd probably be ok.

Monghead amazingly & kindly provided us with a mini-horizontal of the 90a vs 920 last year and all I can say is, both are great but the 90a in particular knocked our socks off...

Having said that, I haven't had the 90 Grange so I have no idea which will hit 50 years better.

If you're only buying 1 for a very special occasion and want to push them to 50 years of age - not to mention cashing in all your chips - probably better to use a reputable source of known provenance (therefore it won't be that cheap). Be warned that Dans are Woolies and therefore Langtons so provenance can be unknown (at one point a couple of years ago they advertised the Langtons name all over the aged wines section).

Wynn's John Riddoch from both 1986 & 1990 are still powerful wines right now, they shouldn't be overlooked.

Penfolds Bin 707 may be worth a shot too, if you are tolerant of the style. Don't forget St. Henri either.

without wanting to seem a one-dimensional bore, , I guess you realise that 1986 and 1990 are both excellent to sensational years in Bordeaux.
for $600 a bottle, you should be able to get, even in Australia, a 1986 Leoville las Cases, which should be approaching it's peak at age 50, and a 1990 Montrose, which will require another 10 or 20 years at the age of 50 to reach it's peak.
the LLC is a sensational wine, none better in 86. However, I think the 86 Grange is extraordinary, and as good as the LLC, although a different animal. The 86 Grange will still be cruising around at it's 50th, no problem,
Montrose is the best $600 wine for me in 1990. Grange is a disappointment, 90A a much better wine. HoG is excellent, but no way it will see age 50. Actually, I reckon the Pennies 707 is the best bet to reach 50 years from all the Aussie stuff available.

oh, and the Krug and the DP have a snowball's chance in hell of being excellent at that age. 86 was a crap year for Champagne, and 90 was too ripe to age that long, although they are very nice. (and no, not even a magnum of Salon will go that distance)

I was going to suggest you look at magnum+ sized bottles. They age slower than
Standard bottles and are a better chance of being great at the ages you are intending to
Cellar them for.

Many thanks for the suggestions so far. I really appreciate the knowledge, as I am very limited to Australian-centric wines. Good idea about the larger formats, that will open up a few other considerations. please keep the suggestions coming. Cheers.

I have a couple of bottles of 90A, that I bought when released.

felixp wrote:Grange is a disappointment, 90A a much better wine. HoG is excellent, but no way it will see age 50. Actually, I reckon the Pennies 707 is the best bet to reach 50 years from all the Aussie stuff available.

This. I bought 1990 Grange after all the hype and sold it - but am keeping my Bin 90As and 920s.

The 1986 Bin 389 was my epiphany wine that set me on the road to wine enjoyment (although a 1978 Seaview Cabernet was a close contender a decade earlier) and the Bin 90A is the best wine I've ever enjoyed.

Carl

Hi all,

I have just tasted a bottle of Penfold's Bin 90A Cab-Shiraz last night, it was superb, but not much better than a Bin389 98'. The cork which was in had no Penfold's marking on it, just the letters "J.B.M." printed on the cork. I have never opened pre-1994 Penfold's bottles before, and I bought the Bin90A from an independent retailer back in 2001, so I was worrying that the Bin90A could be fake. Could anyone please enlighten me regarding the cork closure of Bin90A? Thank you.

the letters "J.B.M." printed on the cock

I assume you mean "cork".

Had the same quest to find the JBM history and have found this http://www.wisa.org.au/old_newsletters/ ... 202002.pdf
on page 4 is an advert for a cork supplier and they may have used the JBM branding for their product.

JBM Juvenal Australia was formed in April 2000 and is a joint venture between well- known wine industry supplier JB McMahon
and leading Portugese natural cork producer Juvenal Ferreira De Silva (JFS). In mid 2000, JBM Juvenal Australia released
the new DELFIN natural wine corks. These corks use new technology called DELFIN (Direct Environmental Load Focused
Inactivation), using microwave technology to significantly reduce TCA and other “off flavours” in natural wine corks.

This process seems to be no more successful than other washings and treatments of the time as i have recently had a rank TCA wine under a JBM cork.

more information from here http://www.google.com.au/url?sa=t&rct=j ... 9771,d.d24

JBM Juvenal Australia Pty Ltd
Company profile
JBM Juvenal imports, processes and sells natural wine corks and is a joint
venture sales company between JB Macmahon (JBM) based in Adelaide and
Juvenal Ferreira Da Silva (JFS) based in Portugal. Established in April 2000

Yalumba imports cork from Portugal, which is sent to JBM for treatment and
processing.

and

04-Jun-2013 NOTICE OF PROPOSED DEREGISTRATION - ASIC initiated

cheers
phill

Thanks Crusty I hope those Bin90A I bought aren't fake.

mse wrote:Hi all,

I have just tasted a bottle of Penfold's Bin 90A Cab-Shiraz last night, it was superb, but not much better than a Bin389 98'. The cork which was in had no Penfold's marking on it, just the letters "J.B.M." printed on the cork. I have never opened pre-1994 Penfold's bottles before, and I bought the Bin90A from an independent retailer back in 2001, so I was worrying that the Bin90A could be fake. Could anyone please enlighten me regarding the cork closure of Bin90A? Thank you.

Most of the older Australian wines used ordinary, and often small corks with few if any markings. I often winder if the use of cheaper corks was the reason so many wines in Australia had cork issues.

Mahmoud.

I opened a few older Aussie wines of the weekend, and remember one of them had those letters. I wouldn't be worried

mse wrote:Hi all,

I have just tasted a bottle of Penfold's Bin 90A Cab-Shiraz last night, it was superb, but not much better than a Bin389 98'. The cork which was in had no Penfold's marking on it, just the letters "J.B.M." printed on the cork. I have never opened pre-1994 Penfold's bottles before, and I bought the Bin90A from an independent retailer back in 2001, so I was worrying that the Bin90A could be fake. Could anyone please enlighten me regarding the cork closure of Bin90A? Thank you.

Just had the same experience. The J.B.M. was a concern when I saw the cork.
A search of the inter webs and nothing.
A search of Auswine-Bingo!
Relief. Waiting for the decanter to do its thing....

Try a Loire Sweet Vouvray or a German Reisling. Both age incredibly well. I saw Marc Bredif 1990 on wine-searcher and that will age to 50 - even his Demi sec sparkler had some life at 50. Don't think the Huet 90 is at the same level as 89, but my 66 and 59 huets have been stimulating - not full of life, but plenty of earthy terror.

Dry white Bordeaux is anther option. I will drink my last bottle of Domaine de Chevalier 1966 Blanc next month and it's been superb - one of the best wines I have ever drank. 2 years ago I drank it with a 64 Laville Haut Brion , another wine that ages well. Imagine Haut Brion Blanc will be fine as well at 50, but it's poor QPR.