The Auswine Forum

George Krashos wrote:

Rossco wrote: 2010 Petaluma Coonawarra.

This bottle was quite flat and uninviting. Gave very little away despite a 2+ hours Decant.

Still quite a bit of cedar on the nose. Very thin palate....austere or stringent if you will.

Lacking fruit and weight. Can help but thinking this was faulty in some way....dumb phase after 10 years?
Screw cap so not sure what to expect.

Confusing!

Sounds oxidised. Seal didn't take or issue when bottling.

Can also get "corked" wine under screwcap. I know that sounds dumb, but I had my first screw-capped corked wine last year. Bacteria in the barrel.

Definitely not oxidised, I can pick that from a mile away as im quite sensitive to that.

After some deeper thoughts and discussions with some other wine guys, we think it maybe TCA..... and yes as you mentioned most likely from the Barrels. Apparently can also present itself in water, so when washing the equipment or barrels as well.
My first TCA'd screwcap as well!

Lucky the Mayer was singing (Diam)!

2018 Bowen Shiraz, wonderful nose, medium weight silky smooth fruit profile, generous mouth feel and drying tannins
2018 Bowen Cabernet, black blue fruits fantastic palate very integrated, no harshness or acid that others have complained about, gentle tannins. Both wines a delight and will go 20 years
2012 Wynns Red Stripe, have had a few vintages of this lately, right in the slot, rich plush such a good wine for $9, another 5 easily.
Cheers Craig

Rossco wrote: 2010 Petaluma Coonawarra.

This bottle was quite flat and uninviting. Gave very little away despite a 2+ hours Decant.

Still quite a bit of cedar on the nose. Very thin palate....austere or stringent if you will.

Lacking fruit and weight. Can help but thinking this was faulty in some way....dumb phase after 10 years?
Screw cap so not sure what to expect.

Confusing!

Considering your bad run of bottles posted here, you must be wondering if it's your palate that's corked

Sometimes it just goes like that, and opening a replacement bottle carries increasing dread that it's f*cked as well... and then you'll probably go on a 50 bottle streak without a faulty bottle.

Ian S wrote:
Considering your bad run of bottles posted here, you must be wondering if it's your palate that's corked

Sometimes it just goes like that, and opening a replacement bottle carries increasing dread that it's f*cked as well... and then you'll probably go on a 50 bottle streak without a faulty bottle.

Tell me about it!!! Had three this week (including one last night I posted in the Neb thread).

One forumite suggested it may be my glass (zalto burg) and how it's washed every time, but that doesn't explain the next bottle being fine.

I think you are right..... Just a run of very bad luck.

Rossco wrote:

George Krashos wrote:

Rossco wrote: 2010 Petaluma Coonawarra.

This bottle was quite flat and uninviting. Gave very little away despite a 2+ hours Decant.

Still quite a bit of cedar on the nose. Very thin palate....austere or stringent if you will.

Lacking fruit and weight. Can help but thinking this was faulty in some way....dumb phase after 10 years?
Screw cap so not sure what to expect.

Confusing!

Sounds oxidised. Seal didn't take or issue when bottling.

Can also get "corked" wine under screwcap. I know that sounds dumb, but I had my first screw-capped corked wine last year. Bacteria in the barrel.

Definitely not oxidised, I can pick that from a mile away as im quite sensitive to that.

After some deeper thoughts and discussions with some other wine guys, we think it maybe TCA..... and yes as you mentioned most likely from the Barrels. Apparently can also present itself in water, so when washing the equipment or barrels as well.
My first TCA'd screwcap as well!

Lucky the Mayer was singing (Diam)!

I had a bottle of this under screw cap last year - the wine was perfectly fine and drinking really well, with plenty of time on its side for mine.

Rossco wrote:

George Krashos wrote:

Rossco wrote: 2010 Petaluma Coonawarra.

This bottle was quite flat and uninviting. Gave very little away despite a 2+ hours Decant.

Still quite a bit of cedar on the nose. Very thin palate....austere or stringent if you will.

Lacking fruit and weight. Can help but thinking this was faulty in some way....dumb phase after 10 years?
Screw cap so not sure what to expect.

Confusing!

Sounds oxidised. Seal didn't take or issue when bottling.

Can also get "corked" wine under screwcap. I know that sounds dumb, but I had my first screw-capped corked wine last year. Bacteria in the barrel.

Definitely not oxidised, I can pick that from a mile away as im quite sensitive to that.

After some deeper thoughts and discussions with some other wine guys, we think it maybe TCA..... and yes as you mentioned most likely from the Barrels. Apparently can also present itself in water, so when washing the equipment or barrels as well.
My first TCA'd screwcap as well!

Lucky the Mayer was singing (Diam)!

OK, literature says is can happen, but are we sure this is TCA without a cork in this instance? I guess there is a range of biological factors that might affect wine, trichloroanisole being one of them, I am not sure that "flat and uninviting" says TCA to me. Regardless, Rossco I would suggest persevering with this wine.

In other news, I did hear a perhaps apocryphal story years ago, that some maker still had TCA with stelvin closures, because the thin seal inside the top of the stelvin closure was actually cork d'oh!

mjs wrote:
OK, literature says is can happen, but are we sure this is TCA without a cork in this instance? I guess there is a range of biological factors that might affect wine, trichloroanisole being one of them, I am not sure that "flat and uninviting" says TCA to me. Regardless, Rossco I would suggest persevering with this wine.

In other news, I did hear a perhaps apocryphal story years ago, that some maker still had TCA with stelvin closures, because the thin seal inside the top of the stelvin closure was actually cork d'oh!

Nope we are not sure its TCA at all, mainly because it was tipped down the drain an no scientific testing was done (not that I can do it, and would have had to send the bottle off to the winery). Dont worry, i am persevering with this wine/producer, I have had many sensational old bottles (ironically with a cork) that were simply stunning. Also have a fair few 2012's as a birth year wine for my daughter, so I expect them to be wonderful in the next 15 years!

Rossco wrote: .

2010 Petaluma Coonawarra.

This bottle was quite flat and uninviting. Gave very little away despite a 2+ hours Decant.

Still quite a bit of cedar on the nose. Very thin palate....austere or stringent if you will.

Lacking fruit and weight. Can help but thinking this was faulty in some way....dumb phase after 10 years?
Screw cap so not sure what to expect.

Confusing!

I suspect your Petaluma is just going through that really horrible dumb phase that good cabernets seem to go through especially around 10 years out. I had the same experience with a case of the 01 Petaluma Coonawarra. At around the 10 year mark, I found the wine so thin and uninteresting I started using it as cooking wine given I couldn't see it ever being anything more.

Then I lost sight of the case and found it out around the 16 year mark and tried another bottle. The rest of the case was like chalk and cheese, it had come out of it shell, filled out and become a fantastic wine. I was also furious I had opened too many bottles way too early. I have some of the 2010 but I am not looking to open any for at least another half decade. My suggestion is bury it deep and forget about it.

deleted

Yes have a sixer of the '10 and '12 Petaluma's. I bank on looking at the first one in 2025. I think its a case of such slow development under stelvin and the Merlot almost provides a protective factor, that allows the Cabernet to slowly take over. I think these are 25-30 year propositions. Brought a museum release '97 pack for the youngest lad's birth year. We both thought it's just entering its drinking window, when we tried one last year.
Cheers Craig

1996 Wendouree Shiraz, just the most beautiful wine I have had in ages. My good/bad ratio with Wendouree is 1:1 but this has made up for it big time. Halliday's 'Iron fist in velvet glove' is quite apt. Still with secondary fruit structure and oh so smooth. Bordering on full bodied even after 23 years. Such a long finish. Shows no sign of falling over but I cannot see it improving from here. GW says the cabernet is king with Wendouree but based on this I would challenge the premise.

2010 Petaluma Coonawarra.

This bottle was quite flat and uninviting. Gave very little away despite a 2+ hours Decant.

Still quite a bit of cedar on the nose. Very thin palate....austere or stringent if you will.

Lacking fruit and weight. Can help but thinking this was faulty in some way....dumb phase after 10 years?
Screw cap so not sure what to expect.

Confusing!

...... this is why I do not buy any cabernet, shiraz or 'big" red under screw-cap. I have had this similar experience as often as I have had TCA'd wines sealed under cork. Love SC for whites, I am ambivalent but hopeful for pinot under SC, but no way does that seal work for big red wines. Give me cork any day.

deleted

felixp21 wrote:2010 Petaluma Coonawarra.

This bottle was quite flat and uninviting. Gave very little away despite a 2+ hours Decant.

Still quite a bit of cedar on the nose. Very thin palate....austere or stringent if you will.

Lacking fruit and weight. Can help but thinking this was faulty in some way....dumb phase after 10 years?
Screw cap so not sure what to expect.

Confusing!

...... this is why I do not buy any cabernet, shiraz or 'big" red under screw-cap. I have had this similar experience as often as I have had TCA'd wines sealed under cork. Love SC for whites, I am ambivalent but hopeful for pinot under SC, but no way does that seal work for big red wines. Give me cork any day.

I also wonder how cabs mature under screwcap. I had a 2005 Moss Wood last week which was under screwcap. It was a lot more primal than I was expecting. I definitely won't open another bottle from the case for another 5 years or so. Funny enough some of the wines i have been getting the most pleasure out of during this period are a selection of CNuPs from '01-07 inlcuding Clos Des Papes, Vieux Telegraphe. I really wish I had collected more. The old ones are almost Baroloish in nautre but with more spice and leather.

rooman wrote:

felixp21 wrote: ...... this is why I do not buy any cabernet, shiraz or 'big" red under screw-cap. I have had this similar experience as often as I have had TCA'd wines sealed under cork. Love SC for whites, I am ambivalent but hopeful for pinot under SC, but no way does that seal work for big red wines. Give me cork any day.

I also wonder how cabs mature under screwcap. I had a 2005 Moss Wood last week which was under screwcap. It was a lot more primal than I was expecting. I definitely won't open another bottle from the case for another 5 years or so. Funny enough some of the wines i have been getting the most pleasure out of during this period are a selection of CNuPs from '01-07 inlcuding Clos Des Papes, Vieux Telegraphe. I really wish I had collected more. The old ones are almost Baroloish in nautre but with more spice and leather.

Pretty interesting comments. I thought the cabernet dead spot also occurs under cork?

Had a Woodlands 'Heather Jean' Cabernet Sauvignon 2010 a month ago, under screw cap. Astonishingly fresh. Note as follows: "Ruby garnet colour at rim, plum dark interior, no sediment. Beautiful beautiful nose. Ever changing. Intense. Cassis. Cedar. Cigar box. Meat (smoked?). Violets. Lift. In the mouth, starting to integrate and flow smoothly to a very acid driven, blackcurranty, extremely long finish. Oak still poking out a bit. Tannins frame and support, never intrusive. Tremendous, peak 10-15 years away?"

I was shocked by the fact that there was no sediment. It looks like this will be extremely long lived wine under screw cap.

Alex F wrote:

rooman wrote:

felixp21 wrote: ...... this is why I do not buy any cabernet, shiraz or 'big" red under screw-cap. I have had this similar experience as often as I have had TCA'd wines sealed under cork. Love SC for whites, I am ambivalent but hopeful for pinot under SC, but no way does that seal work for big red wines. Give me cork any day.

I also wonder how cabs mature under screwcap. I had a 2005 Moss Wood last week which was under screwcap. It was a lot more primal than I was expecting. I definitely won't open another bottle from the case for another 5 years or so. Funny enough some of the wines i have been getting the most pleasure out of during this period are a selection of CNuPs from '01-07 inlcuding Clos Des Papes, Vieux Telegraphe. I really wish I had collected more. The old ones are almost Baroloish in nautre but with more spice and leather.

Pretty interesting comments. I thought the cabernet dead spot also occurs under cork?

Had a Woodlands 'Heather Jean' Cabernet Sauvignon 2010 a month ago, under screw cap. Astonishingly fresh. Note as follows: "Ruby garnet colour at rim, plum dark interior, no sediment. Beautiful beautiful nose. Ever changing. Intense. Cassis. Cedar. Cigar box. Meat (smoked?). Violets. Lift. In the mouth, starting to integrate and flow smoothly to a very acid driven, blackcurranty, extremely long finish. Oak still poking out a bit. Tannins frame and support, never intrusive. Tremendous, peak 10-15 years away?"

I was shocked by the fact that there was no sediment. It looks like this will be extremely long lived wine under screw cap.

There’s definitely a dead spot for Cab Sav under cork. I suppose what I’m trying to work out is whether the screw cap dead spot just lasts so much longer. The Moss Wood was almost too fresh at 15 years with min development. It’s a birth year wine for my son so I have no concerns it won’t be in fine form by the the time he’s in his late twenties early thirties.

Alex F wrote:

rooman wrote:

felixp21 wrote: ...... this is why I do not buy any cabernet, shiraz or 'big" red under screw-cap. I have had this similar experience as often as I have had TCA'd wines sealed under cork. Love SC for whites, I am ambivalent but hopeful for pinot under SC, but no way does that seal work for big red wines. Give me cork any day.

I also wonder how cabs mature under screwcap. I had a 2005 Moss Wood last week which was under screwcap. It was a lot more primal than I was expecting. I definitely won't open another bottle from the case for another 5 years or so. Funny enough some of the wines i have been getting the most pleasure out of during this period are a selection of CNuPs from '01-07 inlcuding Clos Des Papes, Vieux Telegraphe. I really wish I had collected more. The old ones are almost Baroloish in nautre but with more spice and leather.

Pretty interesting comments. I thought the cabernet dead spot also occurs under cork?

Had a Woodlands 'Heather Jean' Cabernet Sauvignon 2010 a month ago, under screw cap. Astonishingly fresh. Note as follows: "Ruby garnet colour at rim, plum dark interior, no sediment. Beautiful beautiful nose. Ever changing. Intense. Cassis. Cedar. Cigar box. Meat (smoked?). Violets. Lift. In the mouth, starting to integrate and flow smoothly to a very acid driven, blackcurranty, extremely long finish. Oak still poking out a bit. Tannins frame and support, never intrusive. Tremendous, peak 10-15 years away?"

I was shocked by the fact that there was no sediment. It looks like this will be extremely long lived wine under screw cap.

There’s definitely a dead spot for Cab Sav under cork. I suppose what I’m trying to work out is whether the screw cap dead spot just lasts so much longer. The Moss Wood was almost too fresh at 15 years with min development. It’s a birth year wine for my son so I have no concerns it won’t be in fine form by the the time he’s in his late twenties early thirties.

Another bottle of the 2016 Gomersal Barossa Shiraz...brilliant with a Spag Bol and so smashable for the price!!
Cheers craig

2015 Torbreck "The Struie" Shiraz

A blend of Shiraz from the Barossa and Eden Valley. Decanted for an hour, a reasonable amount of sediment. Medium/full bodied. Blackberries, ripe plums, mocha/coffee tones, vanilla. Very good mouthfeel and length. Soft tannins. Overall a delicious wine. Another 3-5 years in the cellar and I reckon this will be a great spot. 15.5% Alc.

Just finishing off a bottle of 1996 Reynell Basket Press Cabernet Sauvignon after dinner with Osso Buco and Risotto alla Milanese I cooked today.

This is in perfect place for me right now considering the back label says cellar for up to 10 years.

I would have picked this as Coonawarra with the dark fruit and some capsicum and dried chillies on the nose, couldn’t stop smelling it.
Tannins well integrated, lots of sweet fruit on the palate and a long blueberry, blackberry finish.

Absolutely loved it.

Cheers Con.

2017 Eperosa 'Elevation' Shiraz, Eden Valley

Medium/full bodied. Quite dark and inky. The palate is generous and delicious, the fruit does all the talking, with subtle oak playing a supporting role. Blueberries, raspberry pastilles, blackberry, savoury/deli meats with a slightly earthy tone. Mouthfeel is great, with softer type tannins and long lingering finish. I've enjoyed each vintage of Brett's Eden Valley Shiraz and this is another fine example. If you have some of this, decant now for enjoyment or safely hold for a decade.

I like field blends, and I can’t remember ever having many Chambers wines that were not Fortified, so I decided to take a bottle of this to try.

My man at Dans, gave a shake of the head and he was correct. First observation upon opening and checking the bottle was not that Vermintino was the major grape - it smelt and tasted of Muscat - but actually that the wine was made by Chalmers..hmm. Dry. flowers, high acidity and lots and lots of grapes. It’s amazing that I always use the taste of Grapes in Wine to be a negative, but it is. Needs some skin contact to give it a bit of body. Next time I will believe my man and read the label more closely.

2014 Moorooduc The Duck Chardonnay.

Some matchstick on opening, settled down nicely. Phenolic textures, rounded mouthfilling flavours with enough acid to keep it fresh.
In a great place, wont need any more time in the cellar.

deleted

A 2016 Escarpment Pinot Noir
2016 Escarpment Pinot Noir

Bad news mate I think your vase is corked

Sean wrote:

A2FB5288-32AA-4AD7-BF0F-AC1805B8032A.jpeg

Fraser Gallop Estate Cabernet Merlot 17 - Last year I did a vertical of these. Recent vintages, all of them very good. Lots of colour and lovely red/dark fruits, one or two a bit greener and more tannic in their youth. Longer hang time this vintage and 9 months in French oak. The fruit in this shines. Purpley and jumping out of the glass. This is warm and robust. Blackcurrant, cherry, violets, spice, cedar and aniseed. The latter is really noticeable in this. Full of intensity, with berries and dried herbs romping through it. Slow, dry tannins with each glass. Drink some and keep some.

Gday Sean.

Have you looked at the Parterre series? For not much more coin (on special) these are the way to go:

http://forum.auswine.com.au/viewtopic.php?f ... op#p160150

Cheers
Allan

Hey Ian


Thanks for the update I greatly appreciate it but let me inform you the Vass is not broken or cracked but it does need to be clean....

Ian S wrote:Bad news mate I think your vase is corked

deleted

[url=https://postimg.cc/626DpV9M][img]https://i.postimg.cc/QtcsSSvZ/1-D1550-AA-D91 ... -D5991.jpg[/img][/url]

Te Mata Coleraine is an old favourite. I recall buying it for 30 kiwi in the mid-90's and drinking them way too young. I still have a case of 98.

Anyways, the 2009 was a crystal-pure Bordeaux blend with beautiful essence and clarity. Seamless delivery, either in flat spot or just lacking a bit of energy for first class marks.