The Auswine Forum

The big Supermarket wine fairs begin in Sept. If you are actually after value stuff to drink, then, you may find a bargain or 2.

If you are going to be there for a few days, then buy a few bottles first and go back for more - saves any need to worry about resale auction value.

Thanks Mychurch!

Polymer. I think we're going around in circles. Thanks for your input. Let's leave it there.

I would only try and find and buy one wine if I was in France: Clos Rougeard.

The greatest Cab Franc in the world from the Loire Valley. I would go online, find where I can order it in France, have it shipped to my hotel and bring them back to Oz. This is a fantastic wine that is well worth the effort to find. Expensive but not insanely so

Brodie

Thanks Brodie. It seems to go for around AUD400 on winesearcher. But one Australian store has it at $190!!! Unfortunately, it seems to be out of stock.

Yes that is an amzing cab franc !!!

I hope I'm not the only one to get where Swirler is coming from.

Yep, sure, bring back a wonderful provencial rose you can't get your hands on in oz and drink like a hipster.

Or, consider maximizing commercial advantage and take a look at some vino which is a rare and expensive and fun to hunt on holidays. Down the track you have wines worth a small fortune that have a story to tell or you can unload them.

JamieBahrain wrote:I hope I'm not the only one to get where Swirler is coming from.

Well, I guess I do. He's bringing back three bottles from France and clearly they must be all the same. He drinks one, getting the satisfaction of drinking a wine nobody else in Australia can buy or perhaps afford. Then, if he doesn't like it, he can sell the remaining two, clearly to other members on this forum because we're the ones he's asking to recommend which wine to buy!

Cheers..........................Mahmoud.

I'm always happy to help someone get the most out of their holiday. If the focus is genuinely (and I'm not saying it's true here) on financial gain, then we're the wrong forum to ask. I'm not against anyone doing that, but I'm not the person to ask for that information.

Why is it the wrong forum to ask Ian?

The Australian secondary market is peculiar and seems to offer up more than a bargain or two in obscure foreign wines not unlike some of wines the suggested to swirler to lug all the way back from France.

I'd say you'd be a goose to come back with 3 bottles of really interesting French wine which could turn up for bugger all on the auction scene. If you go abroad all the time, yeah sure, bring back a funky biodynamic orange wine.

If it's a a rare occurrence, get into the trophy stuff I say. Hard to beat Chave due local interest and some Bordeaux. I'd be careful with Burgundy. You may smash local retail but auction prices seem to fluctuate toward veritable bargains by international standards.

I bring a few hundred bottles of foreign wine into Australia every year. Been shocked to see some of them on the secondary market for a similar price but I have the spare capacity to bring in what I like to build an offbeat cellar of eclectic interest. Now, the trophy stuff I've brought in, well I wish I'd brought in more instead of all the effort on some of the other wines ( Austrian sav blanc for example ) . Cases of 2009 Chave or 2004 Monfortino come to mind. Original outlay and effort based on how well priced they were abroad and in comparison to local Aussie icons.

Swirler, perhaps by accident, has raised a great topic of discussion. What foreign wines realize a good profit on the Aussie secondary market scene?

Most forumities here discuss wines drunk or bought for drinking/cellaring rather than wines sold or what to buy with the sole purpose of resale at a profit. Seems almost distasteful to me.

Jamie,

I agree about the Chave...it was one of my recommendations..

But I think the problem I have is the OP starts off saying he's interested in the wine..when in fact he's more interested in the price he can get at auction..

And if you start at the beginning that you want to make money at auction that is fine..because people who want to contribute will...Some people may even knowing contribute their own research...

But if you mask it in the name of finding a great wine to drink that you can't find in AU...some people may end up actually spending time looking for this person thinking they're helping find someone a great wine to drink when in fact they've done leg work to make this person money. THIS part is the part that bothers me.

Not only the Australian market peculiar.
Jamie you appear to be in an extremely fortunate and might I say envious position to be able to bring back hundreds of bottles of wine to Oz every year. Going on form and indeed the selections that can be sourced either on your travels or from BBR or from failed investor schemes in Honkers it must be like a diabetic wandering through Cadbury's.

In what scant opportunity I have had with a few weeks in UK/Europe to try as much as possible, I would love to be able to bring home a heap of wines from Bordeaux/Rhone/Alsace, purely for drinking. My bad, but the investment bit does not interest me...I don't possess the grey matter to be able to work it all out.

There are a couple of things here that appear obvious. Swirler is dipping his toe in the water re considering what to buy. Whether the purchase is for drinking/profit/whatever is pretty immaterial...and its hard to argue, he might as well aim high and worse case scenario flog it.
I suspect these practices occur every day of the week, where individuals have purchased something that they no longer like and then off load it.
Otherwise there must merchants/importers sitting on a shit load of stock drip feeding it into the secondary market.

What I would like to see is a thread started on what Australian wines can be purchased offshore and shipped back cheaper than some of the outrageous local prices seen here...though probably a rather useless and idealistic exercise bearing in mind storage conditions and level of tax incurred.

Good discussion though

Cheers
Craig

Craig,

Glad you see what I'm doing. It's not rocket science.

I bring in 50+ bottles a year from France and these are always with the intention of consuming. True,there are plenty of wines i could buy and flip, but the thought of making a few hundred bucks while at the same time forgoing an opportunity to have something rare to drink in the future doesnt really appeal to me. That said, each to his own...

Have you tried one of the French places that sell older wines, chateau.com has a large range not sure if they are cheap or not. Probably pick up some Late 80's, middle 90's Bordeaux that are ready to drink now.

Chris H wrote:Most forumities here discuss wines drunk or bought for drinking/cellaring rather than wines sold or what to buy with the sole purpose of resale at a profit.

Hi Jamie
Chris explains my reasoning really well. We're wine enthusiasts, not financial advisors.
regards
Ian

.. and just to put this in context, before we get in our heads that swirler is some sort of spivvy, wheeler-dealer just out to make a quick buck, then the return on 3 bottles of wine would not exactly be something to retire on, even before taking into account the cost of the trip! Even if they 'weren't as expected taste wise', that would mean 1 of 3 bottles having been drunk, so the concept of a profit is nonsensical.

It's a chance perhaps to drink above the pricing level he'd normally drink at, and expressed like that it's no bad thing at all.

I bought back a 2009 Château La Mission Haut-Brion a few years ago. Sold it at auction and pocketed $500 in the transaction. Did not retire but bought some other great wine in the process.

Mike Hawkins wrote:I bring in 50+ bottles a year from France and these are always with the intention of consuming. True,there are plenty of wines i could buy and flip, but the thought of making a few hundred bucks while at the same time forgoing an opportunity to have something rare to drink in the future doesnt really appeal to me. That said, each to his own...

you carry them in and pay tax on the purchase price ?

Ian S wrote:.. and just to put this in context, before we get in our heads that swirler is some sort of spivvy, wheeler-dealer just out to make a quick buck, then the return on 3 bottles of wine would not exactly be something to retire on, even before taking into account the cost of the trip! Even if they 'weren't as expected taste wise', that would mean 1 of 3 bottles having been drunk, so the concept of a profit is nonsensical.

It's a chance perhaps to drink above the pricing level he'd normally drink at, and expressed like that it's no bad thing at all.

To me it seemed a massive overreaction from the forum over three bottles some of which may even turn up at an offline anyways. I've seen guys here mention buying 2 cases of BDX from an awesome vintage to sell one in the future to pay for the other. If it works out a great initiative as many of us have to make this obsession affordable or to maximize our bang for buck.

JamieBahrain wrote:To me it seemed a massive overreaction from the forum over three bottles some of which may even turn up at an offline anyways. I've seen guys here mention buying 2 cases of BDX from an awesome vintage to sell one in the future to pay for the other. If it works out a great initiative as many of us have to make this obsession affordable or to maximize our bang for buck.

Jamie,

It isn't that he's selling the wine..that's fine..No issues at all.

Just don't represent it as something else.

Just say, I want to bring back some wine...Looking to buy 6 bottles..will probably sell 4 or 5 of them to pay for the 1-2 I will drink...what wines resell the best at auction?

michel wrote:

Mike Hawkins wrote:I bring in 50+ bottles a year from France and these are always with the intention of consuming. True,there are plenty of wines i could buy and flip, but the thought of making a few hundred bucks while at the same time forgoing an opportunity to have something rare to drink in the future doesnt really appeal to me. That said, each to his own...

you carry them in and pay tax on the purchase price ?

Correct... Half the time at Sydney airport they reduce the apllicable tax (WET, GST and duty) considerably (it should be about 2 grand most of the time), the rest of the time I sadly pay the full 49%. Most of the time I'm bringing in wines that are rarely available here, particularly grower champagne, or Taittinger Comtes mags which are outrageously expensive in Oz

I've found they have tightened up of late Mike. But that's ADL.

Find them very good if you honest and legit' and sometimes they do wave you through if bigger fish to fry- so if 300 bogans just arrived from Denpasar in the jet behind it could be your lucky day.

I just bought a 10 year-old Australian Bordeaux blend, a 2005 Paracombe 'The Rueben', Adelaide Hills (Cab, Merlot,Cab Franc, Malbec, and Shiraz). I've never had a Paracombe red but it was on sale for $10 and I thought it was a real bargain. When I got home and checked to see what it was worth it turns out that it sells for only $23 at cellar door. So a decent bargain overall but I'm sure it would taste much better if it was worth more. Not much point in trying to sell it so I guess I'll just have to drink it.

Cheers.................Mahmoud.

JamieBahrain wrote:I've found they have tightened up of late Mike. But that's ADL.

Find them very good if you honest and legit' and sometimes they do wave you through if bigger fish to fry- so if 300 bogans just arrived from Denpasar in the jet behind it could be your lucky day.

Sydney too the last 2 trips. In 2014 they reduced it by about 60% both times

John Louis Chave Hermitage - best wine I've ever had. Having said that, I've not had much French wine. La Chapelle was nice too.

Cheers
Ian

Mike Hawkins wrote:

michel wrote:

Mike Hawkins wrote:I bring in 50+ bottles a year from France and these are always with the intention of consuming. True,there are plenty of wines i could buy and flip, but the thought of making a few hundred bucks while at the same time forgoing an opportunity to have something rare to drink in the future doesnt really appeal to me. That said, each to his own...

you carry them in and pay tax on the purchase price ?

Correct... Half the time at Sydney airport they reduce the apllicable tax (WET, GST and duty) considerably (it should be about 2 grand most of the time), the rest of the time I sadly pay the full 49%. Most of the time I'm bringing in wines that are rarely available here, particularly grower champagne, or Taittinger Comtes mags which are outrageously expensive in Oz

I am the same
I always declare but only carry 3 dollars per person
Do they ask you for a receipt to confirm the price of the wine ?
I have heard of them googling prices of wine and charging on big prices via the net.

If you don't have receipts Michel you are can be at the mercy of wine searcher! I have had this happen to me but thankfully explained a few things about wine searcher and wasn't slugged unreasonably.So my advice is to always have a receipt makes it easier for everyone.

I do know of someone who was caught with expensive wine claimed as cheap stuff and they withheld the wine as he wouldn't pay the duty.

JamieBahrain wrote:If you don't have receipts Michel you are can be at the mercy of wine searcher! I have had this happen to me but thankfully explained a few things about wine searcher and wasn't slugged unreasonably.So my advice is to always have a receipt makes it easier for everyone.

I do know of someone who was caught with expensive wine claimed as cheap stuff and they withheld the wine as he wouldn't pay the duty.

cool - I may exceed my limit next time - with a receipt
problem is travelling home it can be a bit of a drag with tired family paying the duty