The Auswine Forum

Mike Hawkins wrote:Superb line up Michel.... were the Perrin Brett-monsters?

You are the second person to ask
We had a zero brett experience
All wines purchased upon realease
Cellared at 13 degrees

michel wrote:

Mike Hawkins wrote:Superb line up Michel.... were the Perrin Brett-monsters?

You are the second person to ask
We had a zero brett experience
All wines purchased upon realease
Cellared at 13 degrees

I had a couple of releases About 10 or 15 years ago from memory and they were definitely impacted by Brett. Glad yours were in good nick.

nice line-up Michel!!!!!
all great wines, I too have had brett in the Hommage most times I've seen it, so maybe provenance really important.
I really love 03 Latour, incredible wine... hope it showed well for you guys.
haha, love the price tag!!! ahhhh, those were the days!!!

felixp21 wrote:nice line-up Michel!!!!!
all great wines, I too have had brett in the Hommage most times I've seen it, so maybe provenance really important.
I really love 03 Latour, incredible wine... hope it showed well for you guys.
haha, love the price tag!!! ahhhh, those were the days!!!

Yes great line up.

Had the 2000 Hommage Perrin about 6 weeks ago and it had brett and it did detract from the wine.
Sent the 01,04,05,07 and 10 to auction along with most of my other wines from Chateauneuf du Pape.

Cheers Con.

Nice line up !

Now, the old chestnut! Mourvèdre is often confused with Brett and Hommage is 100% Mourvèdre . Not telling anyone to suck eggs but are you sure? I have found it a fantastic wine and have drunk it in verticals with the Perrins.

Regular bottling of beaucastel have had massive issues and proven so. But I've done verticals with the winemaker and owners and they say Brett in modern vintages is varietal confusion .

Last night with a rack of lamb, mash and broccolini we enjoyed the first of a half case of Miotolo 2015 Cantiniere McLaren Vale Shiraz. In the Ben Glaetzer style bursting with upfront black fruits and full bodied. Softer tannins than expected. Well balanced and quite approachable despite its youth. A style to be enjoyed with hearty winter food in front of an open fire. It would be hard work at a summer BBQ. Will be better in around 5 years.

Carl

1998 Bowen Cabernet...a foil for the recently tasted Ampelon (should it be corked)
Just a beautiful lovely wine, faint browning round the edges, mellow secondary characters with fruit and oak and tannin all gently swinging in the breeze...no evidence at all of harsh acid that some critics of late have suggested is a problem.
Interestingly this carton was not well stored as it got lost in a housing reno after the rest of the collection was moved out...cork stained 1 mm so something to be said for a stable but not low temperature. Trust that the remaining 6 or so will be as good.

Cheers
Craig

JamieBahrain wrote:Nice line up !

Now, the old chestnut! Mourvèdre is often confused with Brett and Hommage is 100% Mourvèdre . Not telling anyone to suck eggs but are you sure? I have found it a fantastic wine and have drunk it in verticals with the Perrins.

Regular bottling of beaucastel have had massive issues and proven so. But I've done verticals with the winemaker and owners and they say Brett in modern vintages is varietal confusion .

There were 6 of us that night and I’m pretty sure everyone thought there was brett, most more experienced than I am.
This was only my second time drinking the Hommage and the first time was the 1990 that was like stagnant drain water, that’s how bad it was.
Both wines I've had were auction purchases, maybe it's storage.
Either way I’m done with Chateauneuf du Pape.

Cheers Con.

brett is brett is brett, not sure you can mistake it for Mouvedre. However, it is well known that high-percentage Mouvedre wines are like Champagne, and are notoriously sensitive to storage conditions, so that could certainly be an issue, as could travel to Australia.
I have had Hommage many times, and my brett stike rate is similar to pre-mox in Leflaive. Stopped buying it years ago for that reason.
A winemaker in Burgundy I know who worked in Chateauneuf for years in a very famous Domaine reckons every last bottle of Hommage he has ever seen has been brett-affected.

Wish I could put the argument to bed. Someone did that with regular beaucastel and the results interesting but concluded Brett was reducing I vaguely recall. 500USD a bottle Hommage will get away with it a little longer .

Don't laugh but tonight we had 2 wines with dinner with relos. Both Margaret River. One a 15 cab merlot and the other a 14 straight cab. Both quite pleasant for mid week wines. The latter was slightly better but only by a smidgen. More full bodied with a little more acid and tannins. The former was an Aldi wine for sub $10. Great value.

Carl

Hi Jamie
Was it your namesake?
http://www.wineanorak.com/brettanomyces.htm
regards
Ian

Thanks I an, interesting article.

Some good points, esp with natural wine-making. I have noticed a significant amount of brett in many 2015 Bojo's, Marcel Lapierre's range has been terribly affected by it. Whilst this is usually ok for the first 36 months or so, and makes drinking on the fruit a more interesting exercise due to the added complexity, after that period of time it just builds and builds making the wine close to undrinkable.
The 89 and 90 Beaucastels drank superbly for the first 15-20 years of their lives, but the brett is now really a factor. Sadly, my last three bottles of the 1990, all from the same case and purchased at release, were largely tipped down the sink. I can say that at 10 years of age, this wine was an absolute super-star. (all from the same single case)

I am one of those that likes controlled/contained brett in big wines, such as the Rhone varietals. The problem is, there is so little margin for error, and the tipping point comes so very quickly... from an interesting addition to the complexity of the wine, to an unpleasant distraction that renders it undrinkable. I suspect Beaucastel will always sit on ,or close to, this edge.

Felix Said:

controlled/contained brett

Felix, it is not possible to "control/contain" Brett. There is no scientific formula to do that. I am always a bit amazed when people say this.
Perhaps you are saying you don't mind a "little" brett in your wines? And then brett will always bloom worse and worse the longer you cellar the wine.

Disclaimer: I am a Brett Nazi!

JamieBahrain wrote:Nice line up !

Now, the old chestnut! Mourvèdre is often confused with Brett and Hommage is 100% Mourvèdre . Not telling anyone to suck eggs but are you sure? I have found it a fantastic wine and have drunk it in verticals with the Perrins.

Regular bottling of beaucastel have had massive issues and proven so. But I've done verticals with the winemaker and owners and they say Brett in modern vintages is varietal confusion .

Discussion arround the table
No mention of brett
Wines were stored at 13 degrees
We recalled Homage was about 60% mourvedre
Am happy to be corrected

2003 Latour needs 20 years more

Rory wrote:Felix Said:

controlled/contained brett

Felix, it is not possible to "control/contain" Brett. There is no scientific formula to do that. I am always a bit amazed when people say this.
Perhaps you are saying you don't mind a "little" brett in your wines? And then brett will always bloom worse and worse the longer you cellar the wine.

Disclaimer: I am a Brett Nazi!

apologies Rory, bad choice of words!! I didn't mean to imply there was a way of controlling brett, I meant to say that in small doses it can actually add complexity to the right style of wine (I absolutely hate brett in Burgundy and Bordeaux, but find it interesting in shiraz and grenache based wines.)
having said that, I would rather purchase clean wines, knowing that they will cellar well.

Hi Michel,
many thanks re the 2003 Latour, yes, it will peak in 20-30 years, but I have found it to drink suoerbly now, sadly I cracked my case from HK an have gone thru half of them over the past year

Tried a few 04s to celebrate the oldest's teenager-hood:

Rockford Moppa Springs GSM: Developed, soft in the glass, easy to drink, and grenache providing the taste profile. Not going to improve, but will likely hold for up to 5.

Penfolds Bin 28 Shiraz: Still dark and inky (as they all are), chalky tannins and savoury on the palate. Not sure this has the fruit to go long, long term but a decent drink and will hold.

Penfolds Bin 128 Shiraz: Less dark and softer on the palate. A more enjoyable drink than the Bin 28 now but has hit its plateau.

-- George Krashos

went to a superb tasting of 2015 Auktion rieslings in HK yesterday, nine wines extending from GG thru to Auslese.
2015 Germany is the real deal, absolutely no doubt about it. Some of the wines shown would rank amongst my all-time best rieslings. The incredibly-hyped Egon Mueller Auslese was great, and as expected full of botrytis, whereas the Willi Schaeffer Auslese was clean as a whistle, and IMO all the better for it.
Hard to believe the purity and length of the GG's presented, quite stunning.
The two kabinetts were incredibly lively and long, again I was almost knocked off my feet by the purity and vibrancy.
Of course, being Auktion wines, I doubt much, if any, will been seen for sale in Australia, but never-the-less I thought they gave a very good snap=shot of what the best wines of the vintage have to offer.

If I ever get to work-out how to post pics on this forum, i will happily do so!!!!

michel wrote:

JamieBahrain wrote:Nice line up !

Now, the old chestnut! Mourvèdre is often confused with Brett and Hommage is 100% Mourvèdre . Not telling anyone to suck eggs but are you sure? I have found it a fantastic wine and have drunk it in verticals with the Perrins.

Regular bottling of beaucastel have had massive issues and proven so. But I've done verticals with the winemaker and owners and they say Brett in modern vintages is varietal confusion .

Discussion arround the table
No mention of brett
Wines were stored at 13 degrees
We recalled Homage was about 60% mourvedre
Am happy to be corrected

2003 Latour needs 20 years more

Yes That's what I've been reading that the average blend has 60% mourvedre, the 1998 has only 20%.

Cheers Con.

Yep my error, must be mixing myself up with the old vine white which Is 100% roussanne. Still could have swore there was a 100% Mourvèdre as I was a regular buyer before 2007 vintage . I'll sift back through winery notes but again probably bad memory on my part .

felixp21 wrote:went to a superb tasting of 2015 Auktion rieslings in HK yesterday, nine wines extending from GG thru to Auslese.
2015 Germany is the real deal, absolutely no doubt about it. Some of the wines shown would rank amongst my all-time best rieslings. The incredibly-hyped Egon Mueller Auslese was great, and as expected full of botrytis, whereas the Willi Schaeffer Auslese was clean as a whistle, and IMO all the better for it.
Hard to believe the purity and length of the GG's presented, quite stunning.
The two kabinetts were incredibly lively and long, again I was almost knocked off my feet by the purity and vibrancy.
Of course, being Auktion wines, I doubt much, if any, will been seen for sale in Australia, but never-the-less I thought they gave a very good snap=shot of what the best wines of the vintage have to offer.

If I ever get to work-out how to post pics on this forum, i will happily do so!!!!

Is that Fine Wine Experience?

felixp21 wrote:went to a superb tasting of 2015 Auktion rieslings in HK yesterday, nine wines extending from GG thru to Auslese.
2015 Germany is the real deal, absolutely no doubt about it. Some of the wines shown would rank amongst my all-time best rieslings. The incredibly-hyped Egon Mueller Auslese was great, and as expected full of botrytis, whereas the Willi Schaeffer Auslese was clean as a whistle, and IMO all the better for it.
Hard to believe the purity and length of the GG's presented, quite stunning.
The two kabinetts were incredibly lively and long, again I was almost knocked off my feet by the purity and vibrancy.
Of course, being Auktion wines, I doubt much, if any, will been seen for sale in Australia, but never-the-less I thought they gave a very good snap=shot of what the best wines of the vintage have to offer.

If I ever get to work-out how to post pics on this forum, i will happily do so!!!!

Are the two kabinetts from Egon Mueller or Willi Schaeffer. I'm hoping it is the later as I tucked away a case of the WS 2015 standard kabinetts for another year to come.

Mark

A few over the weekend
2012 Gaelic Cemetery Clare Shiraz...made by Neil Pike... a very nice wine great mouth feel
2013 Olivers Taranga Shiraz...this was a medium bodied wine, will go another 5, pleasant without being spectacular
2008 Reschke Cabernet Merlot...a real surprise, very balanced and probably at its peak now...good drinking
2013 Running with Bulls Tempranillo...a 12 PM wine, soft, surpable...some interest here for the non Shiraz crowd.
2015 Ingoldy MV Shiraz, quite solid, good lick of fruit/tannin/acid, great for the money
2012 Bleasdale LC sparkling Shiraz...pleasant but not in the class of Seppelts, Grilli and others.

Cheers
Craig

yea, Jamie, FWE.

The two kabinett's were from Maxime Grunhauser and Peter Lauer.

The Schaeffer and Mueller wines were both Auslese.

Ian S wrote:http://www.wineanorak.com/brettanomyces.htm

Very interesting article Ian, thanks.

Musar is often considered a "love it or hate it" wine because of low levels of Brett (and volatile acidity) and as far as I know it has no mourvedre in it and is made with minimal sulphur, confirming the thesis by Jamie Goode.

Cheers ............... Mahmoud

Hi Mahmoud
Wikepedia suggests 5 varieties including Mourvedre

Cabernet Sauvignon, Cinsault, Carignan, Grenache, and Mourvèdre

however on their website they currently only mention the first three grapes for the main wine. Grenache seems to make it into the Hochar, but not such about the mourvedre.

regards
Ian

p.s. I've just noticed the Rose is a blend of red & white Obaideh 55～65％、Merwah 30～40％、Cinsault5％, so no wonder it ages well, as that's pretty close to the white blend.

Mastrojanni San Pio Rosso 2004

Usually an 80% Cabernet, 20% Sangiovese blend.
In a blind line up, this would be hard to pick as a new world or old world, perhaps going with new world, but difficult to pick a region.
Clean, powerfull Cabernet lifted by bright Sangiovese, that if you didn't know it was there, you wouldn't pick it. Still looking wonderfully youthfull, another decade in front of it to develop to maturity.

Not quite as bad on the 2nd night, but a proper grump from me about misguided use of barriques as a form of wine flavouring... the equivalent of putting a false beard and moustache on for your photo.

• 2009 La Torre Salice Salentino Riserva - Italy, Puglia, Salice Salentino (20/06/2017)
  The previous bottle (4 years ago) was a bit OTT, but it's definitely settled down now, albeit now overwhelmed by the oak.
  
  The creosote on the nose has subsided a little, but I can't help wondering whether the bitterness on the finish is related. I certainly have issue with the overt vanillan oak, from their trumpeted use of French barrels. For me this obscures the wine itself, like trying to enjoy the wine between eating squares of milk chocolate. I would love to try a bottling with less new oak, and indeed less heavy toasting or more neutral oak. The wine underneath has good sweet & dark fruit, and I sense there is more complexity hidden behind that damned oak.

2014 Chalmers Montevecchio Rosso (Rutherglen) Nothing too serious, good enjoyable wine to accompany pizza or pasta. Red fruits with a touch of liquorice, mild tannins, very slurpable. Alcohol sitting at 13% which is rare for a Rutherglen wine. Priced around $25, good value.