Low Sulphur Dioxide Wines

Darren Masters · Post by **Darren Masters** » Sun Apr 22, 2007 5:52 pm

Hello all,
Have not posted for such a loooooooong time. Just wondering if any of you know of any low sulphur dioxide wines out there? I currently drink the Rymill Mc2 which states minimal sulphur dioxide. I tend to break out in skin irritations with a high sulphur dioxide content.Apparently there are many people in the same boat.I looked at some of the organic wines out there and they too had sulphur dioxide added. My local wine rep was unable to help me at the time and said he would get back to me.Any other suggestions some of you may have would be appreciated.

dkw · Post by **dkw** » Sun Apr 22, 2007 10:18 pm

You could look out for Happs (Margaret River) PF Red and White - might be worth a shot - take a look at their web site for more detail.

Cheers, Dave

Darren Masters · Post by **Darren Masters** » Mon Apr 23, 2007 7:59 am

Will have a look at that one Dave.Thanks for the suggestion

Sharkey · Post by **Sharkey** » Mon Apr 23, 2007 9:02 am

Botobolar in Mudgee make a preservative free red and a white.

Darren Masters · Post by **Darren Masters** » Mon Apr 23, 2007 9:21 am

Thanks for the suggestions.Keep them coming

Dave, Happs have quite a few stockists here in Sydney so best to maybe call before and have them order some in.Good stuff!

kirragc · Post by **kirragc** » Mon Apr 23, 2007 10:50 am

Also aged wines dont have much left as it denatures over time

Duncan · Post by **Duncan** » Mon Apr 23, 2007 11:23 am

As you mentioned Organic Wines do have SO2 added, but the permitted limit is less (125 ppm vs 200ppm), and organic winemakers generally aim to use as little as possible. So it's worth trying organic wines.
Cheers, Duncan

pokolbinguy · Post by **pokolbinguy** » Mon Apr 23, 2007 5:43 pm

You must remember that Sulphur is a natural preservative grown in the grape while on the vine.

The winery will add extra Sulphur ... either in a liquid solution (SO2) or powder form to boost this preservative to stop oxidisation of juice, this reduces colour distortion and keeps the fruit "fresh". Sulphur levels are then monitored during the winemaking procedures to stop infection and the like.

If you want to avoid high levels of sulphur the best bet is to...

- Do not drink cheap wine, the reason for higher sulphur levels in cheap wines is that the grapes used to make these are of lower quality and do not naturally stay "fresh" for very long.

- Attached to that DO NOT DRINK CASK WINE.... ok this might be a given thing but I thought I would just point it out.

While finding wine without sulphur is as impossible as fine wine without grape juice..... hmm that however could be very possible in the two solutions above... hehe

:lol:

If you find you have reactions to certain wines do not put a judgement on the whole winery/wine maker... as higher sulphur may have been used due to a batch of lower quality grapes. This then may not be the case in another wine/vintage etc.

and on a side note (I'm not meaning to be rude or single out people... and do not mean to say that "Darren Masters" is like this) but it is amazing the amount of people worried by sulphur these days. I work in a cellar door and soo many people ask. It seems that we are breeding a generation (or three) of hypercondriacs. If the wineries were not forced by law to put it on the bottle that there is sulphur in the wine (preservative 220) then they would not know and most probably would not care. Most people are more willing to drink Coca-cola and eat KFC and not complain about that... but when they see the dreaded number 220..... the whole world has to know about it.

just my 2 cents.

Brett

P.s Darren Masters, I hope you find wines that you can enjoy and not have to worry about the skin irritations you are getting. Every wine is different, so if its not painful or uncomfortable, try some more wines and see what happens.

Brett

Darren Masters · Post by **Darren Masters** » Fri Apr 27, 2007 4:17 pm

Thanks for all the info guys. Have just picked up a Hardys NPA (No Preservatives Added) 2006 Shiraz for about $14. It probably will not be the best but I will let you know after I have tried it tonight.

naomi · Post by **naomi** » Fri Apr 27, 2007 4:28 pm

I agree, stay off the cheap wines - who knows what (and how much of it) is in them.
Completely preservative free wines are fairly likely to be pretty ordinary because wine is very prone to oxidation and spoilage if not handled correctly by the winemaker.
Organic is not necessarily any better than any other premium wine in my opinion, and you are probably paying more for it.

Darren Masters · Post by **Darren Masters** » Fri Apr 27, 2007 5:10 pm

Agreed on your organic statement Naomi.Yes, you won't catch me drinking cask wine anyway (preservatives or not).I figured if I can find a quaffing wine at $14 with a reasonable everyday palate then I'll give it a go.After that I will look around a little further and experiment with some more preservative free wines.Also agreed that they will be quite ordinary due to no sulphur dioxide so no cellaring potential there (not that you would want to).Incidentaly, the Rymill MC2 low sulphur dioxide one I had the other week was not too bad but still affected me in the way of a rash.

naomi · Post by **naomi** » Sat Apr 28, 2007 2:44 pm

If a low sulphur wine still gave you a rash, maybe it is something else you are allergic to?
Do whites affect you more than reds? Because they usually have more preservatives.
I recently learnt that many wineries add extra tannin (non grape derived) to reds. I don't know if that would be an allergen or not.

Darren Masters · Post by **Darren Masters** » Sat Apr 28, 2007 2:58 pm

Ok well I tried these last night: The Hardys 06 NPA Shiraz and the Hardys 06 NPA Cab Sav. The Cab Sav was much nicer.A little more rounded, plummy and soft.The Shiraz was ok but nothing to write home about.In saying that there was sufficient pepper and berry fruits.I just found it was a little too tannic but apparently that will happen with no preservative wines.All in all I guess I would give the Shiraz a 5/10 and the Cab Sav maybe a 7. Being fair here due to my past drinking samples being a little more 'upper class' than these.The most important part?No rash at all!

But one rotten hang over :oops:

I was a little surprised at the hang over actually being they usually accuse that on the sulphur dioxide.They have a chardonnay too there Naomi so that may also be worth a go.

griff · Post by **griff** » Sun Apr 29, 2007 1:08 am

Darren Masters wrote:Ok well I tried these last night: The Hardys 06 NPA Shiraz and the Hardys 06 NPA Cab Sav. The Cab Sav was much nicer.A little more rounded, plummy and soft.The Shiraz was ok but nothing to write home about.In saying that there was sufficient pepper and berry fruits.I just found it was a little too tannic but apparently that will happen with no preservative wines.All in all I guess I would give the Shiraz a 5/10 and the Cab Sav maybe a 7. Being fair here due to my past drinking samples being a little more 'upper class' than these.The most important part?No rash at all! But one rotten hang over I was a little surprised at the hang over actually being they usually accuse that on the sulphur dioxide.They have a chardonnay too there Naomi so that may also be worth a go.

Hangovers are curious things. Can be due to many different things. Dehydration and methanol are the most common culprits though.

As for the skin irritation/rash: lets go through a process of elimination

Do you get skin irritation when eating dried fruit, canned fruit, pickles or other fruit juices? If so it may be the sulfite that is causing it

Is the reaction worse with red wine and chardonnay? If so then it is more likely a histamine related reaction (present due to fermentation and oak)

Lastly, when does the rash occur and where? If it is whithin a few hours and covers the entire body (at least the trunk) then it is more likely to be a true allergy. Most true allergies are due to proteins. Maybe you are allergic to the fish or egg protein they use to clarify the wine.

Hmmm....lots of rambling while waiting for it to stop raining in Barbados

cheers

Carl

Darren Masters · Post by **Darren Masters** » Mon Apr 30, 2007 5:20 pm

As for the skin irritation/rash: lets go through a process of elimination

Do you get skin irritation when eating dried fruit, canned fruit, pickles or other fruit juices? If so it may be the sulfite that is causing it

Is the reaction worse with red wine and chardonnay? If so then it is more likely a histamine related reaction (present due to fermentation and oak)

Lastly, when does the rash occur and where? If it is whithin a few hours and covers the entire body (at least the trunk) then it is more likely to be a true allergy. Most true allergies are due to proteins. Maybe you are allergic to the fish or egg protein they use to clarify the wine.

Answers are: No I do not get skin irritations when eating dried fruit,canned fruit,pickles and juices.

The reaction seems to be worse with red, although I have not had white in a while.

The rash normally occurs the next day although I feel lots of facial flushing when drinking the wine. I usually only get it about the face, nose, cheeks.

Darren Masters · Post by **Darren Masters** » Mon Apr 30, 2007 5:24 pm

Further, it's just interesting to note that this no preservative wine did not give me a reaction (well not as much as usual a little redness but nothing major). I will experience flushing naturally sometimes when flying open-air aircraft from the sun and wind but red wines with sulphur dioxide give me more of a hive type effect. I think I can enjoy wine every now and then and not daily due to what it does to me. It's not alcohol itself I know that as I drink beer too and it does not occur with this.Maybe a dermatologist is in order? :oops:

griff · Post by **griff** » Mon Apr 30, 2007 5:32 pm

Darren Masters wrote:
As for the skin irritation/rash: lets go through a process of elimination

Do you get skin irritation when eating dried fruit, canned fruit, pickles or other fruit juices? If so it may be the sulfite that is causing it

Is the reaction worse with red wine and chardonnay? If so then it is more likely a histamine related reaction (present due to fermentation and oak)

Lastly, when does the rash occur and where? If it is whithin a few hours and covers the entire body (at least the trunk) then it is more likely to be a true allergy. Most true allergies are due to proteins. Maybe you are allergic to the fish or egg protein they use to clarify the wine.

Answers are: No I do not get skin irritations when eating dried fruit,canned fruit,pickles and juices.

The reaction seems to be worse with red, although I have not had white in a while.

The rash normally occurs the next day although I feel lots of facial flushing when drinking the wine. I usually only get it about the face, nose, cheeks.

The flushing is just the vasodilation effect of ethanol itself. Some people have this worse than others. I wonder if it is a histamine reaction. Although a rash isn't described in the link below, histamine is an inflammatory mediator and could well produce this. Other options are if you are of Asian descent or allergic to salicylates (i.e. aspirin)

http://www.allergyclinic.co.nz/guides/54.html

Good luck!

cheers

Carl

edit: you said hives! Thats typical of histamine methinks

Try a test with an oaked and an unoaked red on separate occasions and see if there is any difference. Try to minimise variation so pick the same producer if possible e.g. Teusner Joshua (unoaked GSM) and the Avatar (old oak GSM)

Darren Masters · Post by **Darren Masters** » Mon Apr 30, 2007 5:53 pm

Now Drs would probably say know but how about an anti-histamine before a drinking session? How long before would taking it be suitable?

griff · Post by **griff** » Mon Apr 30, 2007 6:02 pm

I know a couple of people that take an antihistamine beforehand. Best to take a non-sedating one a couple of hours beforehand if possible. I think however its best to try the experiment first

cheers

Carl

Darren Masters · Post by **Darren Masters** » Mon Apr 30, 2007 6:05 pm

Yes, I think a Telfast would be the go a few hrs before and see what happens.I have got some interesting suggestions/recommendations from this forum and I am thankful for that.Encourages me to try different things and have a look around.I tell you though I miss my BIN 28's and 407's!There must be another answer.

smithy · Post by **smithy** » Sun May 06, 2007 2:58 pm

Actually No added Sulphur Dioxide is a bit of a misnomer.
Its also produced by the yeast in the ferment, so by choosing a high SO2 producing yeast, you can get a higher Finished sulphur than we would ever want.
All legal and organic and totally BS. and still labelled no added SO2
Sorry...
Smithy