TN: Penfolds Bin 389 2001- Danger, Danger!

[KMP]

Penfolds Bin 389 2001 $18.99USD

Given that Parker has refused to score wines like the Bin 389 "because their acid levels were beyond acceptable ranges" it was with trembling, and fully gloved hand, that I poured this wine into an acid proof glass. Peering through safety glasses I could just make out a dense cherry red with red edge. Initially a promising earthy, gamey nose underscored by a less than medium weight mouthfeel. Mouth drying tannins with refreshing acidity at the finish. Good retronasal. Needed time but opened nicely with plum, pepper and dark berry fruits overlaying a pleasant toasted character. Vigorous agitation revealed sweet vanilla oak. This is a wine that definitely needs some air to soften it. This adds some weight to the mouthfeel and creates a better balance between the structural components. 2, 2, 3.8, 9.8 = 17.6. 14.3% alcohol. 60% Cabernet sauvignon, 40% Shiraz. Tasted December 1-2, 2004.

This is the second bottle of the 2001 I have tried; the first being corked. If you drink the wine as soon as the cork is pulled (as I always do) you will not be impressed at all, at least I was not. The Penfolds description is "a firm base of ripe tannins" - that is putting it mildly! But with time (hours) the wine does loose that harshness and gains complexity and turns into a very nice wine. It tasted much better the next day. I got much more from the wine using an ISO than a Vinum-style of glass.

Whatever excessive acidity Parker is detecting in this wine never materialized in the particular bottle I tried.

Am I about to race out and buy more? No, I'm over the poor man's Grange mystique; no I can't afford Grange. The only 389 I have in the cellar is the 1997. Don't ask me why because I don't know. One thing I do know, at less than $20USD, Bin 389 has fallen in price than a few years ago when it was in the mid-20's. It is reasonable value.

Mike

[707]

The US pricing is interesting. Here in Australia it's had a steady increase until it's now in the overpriced category.

Can anyone in Australia remember what vintages like 97 & 98 were worth compared to know? I know my perception is they;'ve jumped quite a bit whilst quality has dropped off.

[GraemeG]

The US pricing is interesting. Here in Australia it's had a steady increase until it's now in the overpriced category.

Can anyone in Australia remember what vintages like 97 & 98 were worth compared to know? I know my perception is they;'ve jumped quite a bit whilst quality has dropped off.

I paid $20 for the 1996, $26 for the 98, both upon release. It was already climbing stupidly in price then; the 1993 on release I bought for $15, but I wasn't quite so savvy as now, and I'm sure it could be found for less. It will take a serious price cut, or a great vintage, to tempt me back to Bin 389 as things stand...

cheers,
Graeme

[707]

Thanks Graeme, it has taken the kind of big price hike I thought it had.

IMO the 1996 is superb, the 1998 not as good as I expected given the vintage, since then not worth talking, particularly as the price has rise.

What will 2002 bring? Better wine and lower price? Are they struggling to move these wines or are their enough sheep still buying the name?

[TORB]

What will 2002 bring? Better wine and lower price? Are they struggling to move these wines or are their enough sheep still buying the name?

Bah Bahhhhh,

Agreed Steve, the wine is trading on its name but IMO, it may be for two reasons. Firstly, there is no doubt the last few vintages were not as good as they could have been, eye off the ball or what ever. The second is the wine appears to have taken a little bit of a stylistic change since 96, not necessarily for the better.

The 02 won a gold at the NWS and those are not easy to come by, so there may be some improvement in the future.

Re the price, its a case of what each market will bare.

[RB - Guest]

What will 2002 bring? Better wine and lower price? Are they struggling to move these wines or are their enough sheep still buying the name?

The 02 won a gold at the NWS and those are not easy to come by, so there may be some improvement in the future.
quote]

I had a quick taste of the 2002 after the NWS and it's the best in a long time, I'll be considering it on release. A little hard to assess amongst about 80+ sips in 2 hours, it seemed to be softer and richer with more obvious fruit and fairly smart oak, more in the mould of the 90 rather than 91. Certainly seemed to deserve the Gold and a giant advance compared to the 2001 also in the same class that scored much lower (bronze I think).

Cheers
RB

[Alan Rath]

Mike, good note. Matches the couple of bottles I drank over the summer vacation travels - ordered at restaurants as a decent QPR compromise. We liked it just fine, and my wife wanted to make sure I bought some (want to know how often that happens? )

As for pricing here in the states, it's bounced around in the US$15-20 range since the 94 vintage. I paid $14 for 94, 95:17, 96:18, 97:19. I got a great deal of $15 for the 98. Currently 2001 is selling most places about $19, pretty remarkable considering the exchange rate drop. I'm actually waiting for it to drop a few bucks, and will then pick up a few.

Although I was perplexed with Mr. Parker's comments, I was also pleased with the knowledge that they will certainly help pricing here in the States on the entire Penfolds line.

Regards,
Alan

[KMP]

Mike, good note. Matches the couple of bottles I drank over the summer vacation travels - ordered at restaurants as a decent QPR compromise. We liked it just fine, and my wife wanted to make sure I bought some (want to know how often that happens? )

As for pricing here in the states, it's bounced around in the US$15-20 range since the 94 vintage. I paid $14 for 94, 95:17, 96:18, 97:19. I got a great deal of $15 for the 98. Currently 2001 is selling most places about $19, pretty remarkable considering the exchange rate drop. I'm actually waiting for it to drop a few bucks, and will then pick up a few.

Although I was perplexed with Mr. Parker's comments, I was also pleased with the knowledge that they will certainly help pricing here in the States on the entire Penfolds line.

Regards,
Alan

Alan: Where have you been getting those prices? Its been over $20 here in San Diego for several of the past vintages.

Mike

[Alan Rath]

Mike, how long have you been in SD? Wine Exchange shows the 2001 in their inventory for $18. Wine Club (where I've bought much of mine up here) has it for $19. I think the 99 and 2000 vintages were a couple bucks more, but I didn't buy much of those anyway.

I'm a San Diego native (we're down there twice a year to visit families), and unfortunately you don't have the big discount wine shops found in L.A. and the Bay Area (Wine Club, Wine Exchange, etc.), although if I lived down there I'd be making pilgrimages to Winex regularly

With the terrible Parker reviews, look to find 389 at Costco within the next 6 months!

Regards,
Alan

[KMP]

Mike, how long have you been in SD? Wine Exchange shows the 2001 in their inventory for $18. Wine Club (where I've bought much of mine up here) has it for $19. I think the 99 and 2000 vintages were a couple bucks more, but I didn't buy much of those anyway.

I'm a San Diego native (we're down there twice a year to visit families), and unfortunately you don't have the big discount wine shops found in L.A. and the Bay Area (Wine Club, Wine Exchange, etc.), although if I lived down there I'd be making pilgrimages to Winex regularly

With the terrible Parker reviews, look to find 389 at Costco within the next 6 months!

Regards,
Alan

Alan:

I've been in SD since '82 (with a brief absence from '85-87). Almost all of my wine buying has been with Vintage Wines, and some with WineSellar & Brasserie, etc. Its only been in the last year or so that I've actually bought from Wine Exchange; source of my Kalleske purchases.

Mike

[Alan Rath]

Yep, Vintage Wines is great, I've bought lots of stuff from John. But they don't tend to get the "pedestrian" stuff like Penfolds, Rosemount, etc. For those, you need the bigger bulk stores like Wine Club and Wine Exchange. I'm pretty sure I bought some of my earlier vintage 389's at Costco, which might have saved me a buck or two. Are you on the Garagiste email list? I get a lot of Aussie stuff from them as well. Used to bring back wines from U.K., when I was going over there more often - and before the dollar nosedived

Cheers,
Alan

[Red Bigot]

- and before the dollar nosedived

Cheers,
Alan

Now you know what it's like for us downunder looking at European and US wines. If this keeps up some US wines may even become affordable in Oz, pity the Euro just keeps on rising though.

[KMP]

Jeez, thank goodness the site is back up (I had to go over and post on the Wine* site just for something to do.)

Interesting little note on the price changes of Bin 389 here. I looked up my old notes and found that I had recorded prices for the wine for vintages between 1989 - 1993; all around $12-14USD. I agree with the article that the 1998 was a mid-$20's wine here in SoCal, and that was also about the time that St Henri went above $40. Its now down around $30, but was for many years in the mid-20's.

Mike

[KMP]

Yep, Vintage Wines is great, I've bought lots of stuff from John. But they don't tend to get the "pedestrian" stuff like Penfolds, Rosemount, etc. For those, you need the bigger bulk stores like Wine Club and Wine Exchange. I'm pretty sure I bought some of my earlier vintage 389's at Costco, which might have saved me a buck or two. Are you on the Garagiste email list? I get a lot of Aussie stuff from them as well. Used to bring back wines from U.K., when I was going over there more often - and before the dollar nosedived

Cheers,
Alan

John used to be a big Grange fan (maybe still is), and so they would have Penfolds. But his allocation seems to have taken a nose dive. I've had 2000 St Henri on order from them for about 4 months now and I'm tired of waiting. I might as well just go get it from Trader Joe's!!

I've heard about Garagiste and looked at the site a couple of times. Doesn't seem current. But they still list the 1998 Larrikin - now that is a nice little wine for $20. Might put my name down afterall.

Mike

[Alan Rath]

Now you know what it's like for us downunder looking at European and US wines. If this keeps up some US wines may even become affordable in Oz, pity the Euro just keeps on rising though.

Brian, yep, turnabout's fair play! We came through Sydney, then New Zealand a few years ago when the Aus $ was something like .53 US, and the NZ$ was down in the low 40 cents! We had some great dinners on that trip Amazingly, even with the big currency turnaround, most of the Aussie wines have held reasonably steady in US$ price. My sense is that there was always a lot of slop in the profit margins along the import/distribution chain, and those have just tightened up now to reasonable levels to keep prices from going through the roof. I feel sorry for the poor US importer having to buy a Ford these days instead of a Jaguar.

Mike: St Henri's 99 has been out for at least 6 months at $30 (which is also the price the 98 ended up, even as low as $26 - maybe I'm thinking of the 98 John Riddoch). You can find it at Wine Club, and probably Wine Ex. As for Garagiste, they don't have a usable web site for inventory. Get yourself on their email distribution list, which is basically the only way they sell wine. info@garagistewine.com. It may seem a bit low-key for a retailer, but they are extremely reliable.

Regards,
Alan

Cheers,
Alan