The Barolo / Barbaresco / Nebbiolo thread

[Ian S]

Lucky pot plants!

FWIW any significant sediment often ends up in a stew - arguably the sediment is the most flavoursome bit of the wine, and I don't get any grittiness coming through once cooked.

[winetastic]

FWIW what I've tried from Cappellano hasn't offended, but equally hasn't inspired me to the same heights of appreciation of others here (and elsewhere). No criticism of the wines, just that I don't share the level of admiration that is driving the prices up into the stratosphere. The most recent tasted were 2004 Cappellano Barolo Pie Franco Otin Fiorin & 2004 Cappellano Barolo Pie Rupestris Otin Fiorin

Concur, based on 2011 vintage tastings I was blown away by B Mascarello and thought that Cappellano was very good, on a similar footing to say Giovanni Rosso as far as my overall pleasure goes.

That being said, Cappellano Barolo Chinato is the real deal and all others are imitators

[JamieBahrain]

I haven't enough exposure to G Rosso and I'd like to change this- I've really been put off by the Berry Brother's sales pitch and pricing ( can be found in Italy much cheaper ). I have had Cappellano/ B Mascarello back to the 50's quite regularly and Cappellano is more consistent in older bottlings though B Mascarello can be individually spectacular . Prices seem to be pushing $1000 AUD for old Mascarello now which considering the inconsistency is really stupid.

Debating the producers over a few vintages can be misleading. Both have gone through a change in the reigns. Maria Teresa is well on her way but I'd suggest Augusto is there now too.

The 2010 vintage has changed the playing field in terms of availability of these wines in the future.

[JamieBahrain]

That being said, Cappellano Barolo Chinato is the real deal and all others are imitators

I taste from the barrel most years with my importer friend and every year, Augusto locks the room where the Chinato ingredients are being laid out and prepared. One ingredient is from the jungles of Malaysia, and when I asked where, as I jungle trek there often he got very nervous.

Other Barolistas make jokes that when Augusto and his mother make their annual trip to Turin to source other Chinato ingredients, they have complex urban evasion techniques as they suspect they are being followed.

All a little absurd, though the fact it's such an old and historically significant family recipe makes for a novel aperitif. There's a great summer cocktail that when its too hot for Barolo, you can still get a fix ! I'll search for the recipe.

If you ever stay at Castello di Verduno ( highly recommended ) the matriarch was a child of the colonies and can give you a run down of how chinato used as medicines back in those torrid times for all.

[Ian S]

Prices seem to be pushing $1000 AUD for old Mascarello now which considering the inconsistency is really stupid.

Fully agreed. Bartolo Mascarello seems to have acquired cult status for those passionately following traditional producers - the wines revered as much for what they stand for, as what is in the bottle. By comparison the 1999 vintage I picked up a few years ago was ~ €50-€60 from memory. My understanding is it leaves the winery very reasonably priced, but the worship of the icon creates this amazing pricing in the secondary market. I do reckon the 1996 'No barrique, no Berlusconi' labelled wine must be hitting the AUD1000 mark.

[winetastic]

My understanding is it leaves the winery very reasonably priced

2011 Barolo was 50 EUR from the Cantina.

[JamieBahrain]

38 euros for the 2010. Cash only.

[JamieBahrain]

Fontafredda Barolo 1958- No great wines, just great bottles. This was a magnificent bottle to show a good friend what aged Barolo is all about. Cork was in good condition suggesting a possible top-up/ re-corking at some stage but I found no evidence on the internet.

Snap from my iPhone doesn't capture the color quite, but it was what you'd expect from a near 60 year old wine. Complex tertiary aromatics but nothing tired or rusty, there was even an underlying fruit freshness, undeniably significantly aged, but like a standout fit-old bloke you may note in crowd. Palate was complete and weighted for the most part, but supple and delicate when you wanted it to be. The tertiary persistence of dark fruited tobacco/ leather was again, like the aromatics, aged but with a good order of freshness. Mesmerizing!

I could source more, but the old adage of great bottles only and why spoil a wonderful experiences ? I can still taste the greatest of old Barolo & Barbaresco from the 50's including Gaja cellar release. No need to hoard but what a wine to convert folks to Barolo with !

95pts

[winetastic]

My understanding is it leaves the winery very reasonably priced

2011 Barolo was 50 EUR from the Cantina.

Coincidentally I just received an email offer to buy Bartolo Mascarello Barolo 2012 here in Australia for $319 per bottle. To be honest id consider it under $150...

[Gavin Trott]

My understanding is it leaves the winery very reasonably priced

2011 Barolo was 50 EUR from the Cantina.

Coincidentally I just received an email offer to buy Bartolo Mascarello Barolo 2012 here in Australia for $319 per bottle. To be honest id consider it under $150...

Me too!

Not going to happen though, I can get that wine, but $150.00 is below my buy price so ... there it is!

.

[winetastic]

Me too!

Not going to happen though, I can get that wine, but $150.00 is below my buy price so ... there it is!

Tis a shame.

Visiting Piedmonte in May with a few family members, going to try source a bunch of bottles to bring back, 3 per suit case

[Ian S]

Fontafredda Barolo 1958- No great wines, just great bottles. This was a magnificent bottle to show a good friend what aged Barolo is all about.

Well this is the era to buy Fontanafredda from. A recent offline written up on Wine Pages also had a bottle of this, and I think it was in decent health.

[JamieBahrain]

2013 was a great vintage for Barolo, described as "outstanding" by the Wine Advocate. James Suckling went even further, stating "Barolo's 2013 vintage is indeed the region's best since 2008" and even better than the much-acclaimed 2010. According to Suckling "the 2013s have a comparable structure to the excellent 2010 vintage, but the 2013s are overall more refined and focused."

I have awaited 2013. Offers are coming in.

Ellio Grasso and Pio Cesare to open things up. I will get both I think. Ellio Grasso is spectacular in his two wines below the Runcot blend and Ornato, well, why not?

But really? As good as 2010? Now that he's so impressed with the grassy underrated 2008 gives credence.

Thoughts?

[Gary W]

2013 was a great vintage for Barolo, described as "outstanding" by the Wine Advocate. James Suckling went even further, stating "Barolo's 2013 vintage is indeed the region's best since 2008" and even better than the much-acclaimed 2010. According to Suckling "the 2013s have a comparable structure to the excellent 2010 vintage, but the 2013s are overall more refined and focused."

I have awaited 2013. Offers are coming in.

Ellio Grasso and Pio Cesare to open things up. I will get both I think. Ellio Grasso is spectacular in his two wines below the Runcot blend and Ornato, well, why not?

But really? As good as 2010? Now that he's so impressed with the grassy underrated 2008 gives credence.

Thoughts?

Suckling said 2011 was better than 2010! Crazy.

Meanwhile, those old Fontanas are super ex-cellar. Their non-oak-buggered more traditional, high quality arm 'Mirafiore' are making some beautiful wines now. Paiagallo and Lazzarito in 2010 are superb.

[JamieBahrain]

Thanks. Scary !

The 2008 references are clever then. Barolistas will be pleased. typo- 2008 grossly underrated not grassy.

Do you know if the Fontanafreddas were recorked like some of the old Borgogno Barolo ? I suspect so, no sediment in the 58!

[Gary W]

I'm trying to think on the corks in them. I've only had '67 twice, and '61 twice, but i think the corks looked to have some age - i.e. not new - but not like 50+ year old corks either. Maybe they did them in the 90s or something. I can find out though.

[JamieBahrain]

Thanks, I'd be grateful! They are a bargain compared to the old Borgognos that have appreciated massively- though I think its the red capsule that are more sort after than the black label which were removed of sediment and topped up with current vintage.

[Gary W]

I've put in an enquiry. All the bottles i've had are the lovely silver labels with red caps.

[Ian S]

Suckling said 2011 was better than 2010! Crazy.

Suckling carries little credibility, but the writing equivalent of a big mouth.

FWIW I've been happy with each of the (few) 2011s I've tasted from Barbaresco, and I've also tasted some disappointing 2010s at the wineries (though often the 2010s were very impressive). I've enjoyed pretty much all the 2008s I've tasted, but it's maybe not a showy vintage.

[JamieBahrain]

It was said Barbaresco 2011 a cracker. I found from tastings I leaned toward 2010 convincingly. 2011 sloppy and hot.

Then the Produttori a house quaffer from 2010. My, my ! Wow ! It shamed the 2011.

But anyways, so diverse a region now with vineyard aspects, very hard to generalize at times. Even today, a knowledgeable friend saying go long on 2012 yet here I am awaiting 2013.

[Ian S]

Also hard for me to speak boldly about 2011, as my exposure has been much more limited vs. 2006-2008 & 2010. It's trips to Piemonte that allow me that chance to get a better feel for vintages across a range of producers.

[winetastic]

2011 sloppy and hot

Bingo

[michel]

2011 sloppy and hot

Bingo

dont like 2011 either
they are gonna hang around for a while

[JamieBahrain]

I think Barolo more so. There is still some very good Barbaresco about if you can get some balance.

‘It’s one of the best vintages in memory. The wines are fuller bodied than usual, but retain their proverbial grace and charm, so there’s never been an easier time to become a Barbaresco lover.’ Angelo Gaja

I wonder if Angelo was riding the wave of the 2010 Barolo release hyperbole.

[michel]

I think Barolo more so. There is still some very good Barbaresco about if you can get some balance.

‘It’s one of the best vintages in memory. The wines are fuller bodied than usual, but retain their proverbial grace and charm, so there’s never been an easier time to become a Barbaresco lover.’ Angelo Gaja

I wonder if Angelo was riding the wave of the 2010 Barolo release hyperbole.

as in Burgundy
every year is a great year.
just ask the wine sellers telling me that the 2004 burgs are looking really great now ....

[Gary W]

Even today, a knowledgeable friend saying go long on 2012 yet here I am awaiting 2013.

I've bought quite a lot of 2012 (almost no 2011 aside some notables, even though it's my second son's birth year). The good 12s (and there's quite a few as far as I'm concerned) are super.

[michel]

Even today, a knowledgeable friend saying go long on 2012 yet here I am awaiting 2013.

I've bought quite a lot of 2012 (almost no 2011 aside some notables, even though it's my second son's birth year). The good 12s (and there's quite a few as far as I'm concerned) are super.

giacomo conterno cascina francia is super duper

[JamieBahrain]

Massolino Barolo Parafada 2011 en magnum- Great fun to draw the cork on a few Barolo on Sunday night and enjoy through the school week- even more fun a magnum from a warm and inviting vintage that delivers a different wine every night.

Day one was beautiful with forward fruit. Warm tar, chinato-cola, spices and red cherry layered on the front and mid palate with ripe, raspy tannins. Next day, was classic Serralunga structure in dominance. Steely minerality and fruit austerity, but beautifully layered and evenly spread across the palate with the next few days commanding food with earthiness and more balsamic & marmite like notes in firmer tannin.

I have had very old Massolino from average to poor vintages in the 60's and they delivered a great experience. Sure, this is 2011, perhaps an unfortunate snapshot of a warmer future in the foothills of the alps, but at giveaway prices and a great producer, no problems as a cellar bet.

92pts +

[JamieBahrain]

Even today, a knowledgeable friend saying go long on 2012 yet here I am awaiting 2013.

I've bought quite a lot of 2012 (almost no 2011 aside some notables, even though it's my second son's birth year). The good 12s (and there's quite a few as far as I'm concerned) are super.

giacomo conterno cascina francia is super duper

CF is in afterburner in the secondary market. And no 2012 Monfortino ? Sure bet.

[michel]

I've bought quite a lot of 2012 (almost no 2011 aside some notables, even though it's my second son's birth year). The good 12s (and there's quite a few as far as I'm concerned) are super.

giacomo conterno cascina francia is super duper

CF is in afterburner in the secondary market. And no 2012 Monfortino ? Sure bet.

2013 CF and monfortino looks special
unfortunately