michel wrote: My recent bottle from auction was a tad flat but prior to that I had one that was purchased from cellar door and cellared brilliantly and it was long and pure.
the other freak great Australian cab was the Howard Park 1994.
1969 Lakes Folly, 1978 Cyril Henschke….ok, ok …
I do like Henschke's Abbott's Prayer as a BDX foil. Though generally, I find Barossan cab blends a mistake.
Cullen by a distance. Do not pass Go...... Never got to grips with Moss Wood & now avoid.its right no idea if it has improved: it was fine if lean, green, mean Old fashioned Claret was required.
Haven't bought it for a few years now, but had a couple of my older Moss Wood's this week. The 1996 Moss Wood is starting to drink beautifully. Certainly no greenness - intense cassis-plum fruit and the cedar-moccha oak is now in balance. The 1999 is similar in style but the oak needs a couple of years to soften like the 96 (which was firmly tannic in its youth).
Likewise haven't bought Cullen for a while now after they went bio-dynamic, but I have found the 1994 and 1995 to be very good Bordeaux style wines.
yea, the 94 and 95 Cullens (94 still had reserve bottling) were good, as was 96. Haven't been enamoured since then. much prefer Moss Wood, but it is a bit like when I was at school and half like the Beatles and the other half the Stones.... nobody is right or wrong, it is just a question of personal taste.
I'm still waiting for that Cullen moment...I'm sure it is coming one day...Could always see the potential but just never hit me right...Maybe Friday will be the day...
Unlike Grosset Polish Hill which I have a feeling I'll never have that ah ha moment with..
I got into Cullen Cab/Merlot with the 1998 vintage, bought a good few 1999s and then some 2001s.
I'll admit I bought them on pro tasting notes that emphasised the 'wall of tannins' and wines that would age very well and emerge with good complexity & not too big/flabby (i.e. right in the style I valued). I was disappointed with the 98/99s, partly as they didn't live up to the hype, but (I think relatively objectively) they hadn't developed much complexity and yet didn't suggest high hopes for further cellaring. The 2001s have been a little more impressive, but none have been as impressive as their 1997 Chardonnay, which made our whole tasting group go 'wow'. I'd be in the 'try before you buy' bracket at current prices for the DM.
I'm not against Biodynamics, but could it be that it just didn't work for them, or that it required a downward curve before maybe a more recent renaissance?
swirler wrote:Polymer, I've never had a Polish Hill moment and I'll probably never have one, but Cullen, that's quite different for me.
Yeap...I know plenty of people that really like it...I've been told by some that it just needs enough age on them..and I haven't had any with a good amount of age...
Interesting thread - I've been living in London (and some time in Paris) for the last 8 years where my appreciation for claret has grown. I have been in a search to find the Australian equivalent of both left bank and right bank wines. It has been an interesting journey as I have traditionally been a shiraz fan, but cab has really dominated my drinking over recent years (mainly as a function of my location).
The best I have found is Moss Wood and Cyril Henschke. I thought Cyril would make a good Bordeaux contest until I paired it recently with one of Latour's 3rd wines (Pauillic de Latour). On the surface possibly not a fair fight, but they do trade at a similar price point in the UK, and there really was no contest given the Pauillac's strong showing. Moss Wood I think is the closest I have seen to something that gets in the Bordeaux left bank zone, I have tried Cullen and thought it was decent, and have been surprised by the comments here about its inability to age well.
Its the right bank equivalent that has been elusive, I have struggled to find anything local that gets close to a decent mid-tier Pomerol/St Emilion. Merlot is a very different beast to Cab though.
Hawksmoor wrote:Interesting thread - I've been living in London (and some time in Paris) for the last 8 years where my appreciation for claret has grown. I have been in a search to find the Australian equivalent of both left bank and right bank wines. It has been an interesting journey as I have traditionally been a shiraz fan, but cab has really dominated my drinking over recent years (mainly as a function of my location).
The best I have found is Moss Wood and Cyril Henschke. I thought Cyril would make a good Bordeaux contest until I paired it recently with one of Latour's 3rd wines (Pauillic de Latour). On the surface possibly not a fair fight, but they do trade at a similar price point in the UK, and there really was no contest given the Pauillac's strong showing. Moss Wood I think is the closest I have seen to something that gets in the Bordeaux left bank zone, I have tried Cullen and thought it was decent, and have been surprised by the comments here about its inability to age well.
Its the right bank equivalent that has been elusive, I have struggled to find anything local that gets close to a decent mid-tier Pomerol/St Emilion. Merlot is a very different beast to Cab though.
I thought ibwas reading Mike Hawkins post at first. Mike, is that you?
Hawksmoor wrote:Interesting thread - I've been living in London (and some time in Paris) for the last 8 years where my appreciation for claret has grown. I have been in a search to find the Australian equivalent of both left bank and right bank wines. It has been an interesting journey as I have traditionally been a shiraz fan, but cab has really dominated my drinking over recent years (mainly as a function of my location).
The best I have found is Moss Wood and Cyril Henschke. I thought Cyril would make a good Bordeaux contest until I paired it recently with one of Latour's 3rd wines (Pauillic de Latour). On the surface possibly not a fair fight, but they do trade at a similar price point in the UK, and there really was no contest given the Pauillac's strong showing. Moss Wood I think is the closest I have seen to something that gets in the Bordeaux left bank zone, I have tried Cullen and thought it was decent, and have been surprised by the comments here about its inability to age well.
Its the right bank equivalent that has been elusive, I have struggled to find anything local that gets close to a decent mid-tier Pomerol/St Emilion. Merlot is a very different beast to Cab though.
some of the high-end Cali Cabs do pretty well in comparison to right-bank Bordeaux, but in Australia we have virtually none. Gaia in good years, that is it for me. Moss Wood has a bit of Pauillac, and old, top-notch Coonawarra can have similarities to St Julien IMO.
I'm going to be a bit challenging here, and say it might not be at the top end where Aussie Cab Sauv or Cab/Merlot blends deserve the accolades. For me it is a stunning achievement what Wynns seem to consistently deliver in their black label. It has good tannic structure and I've never found an overblown one. It ages really well, and for the price it is very competitive. Likewise in recent times Woodlands with their 'Margaret'. Although it never gets any mention, I'd also add in Best's Cabernet Sauvignon, which is really tight in youth but seems to age very nicely. All are very good indeed for the price, and I'm sure others could name another 10-20 wines that are also fine value.
At the top end there are certainly wines you could argue are better (more complex, more intense, more ageworthy) but that unlike (say) the better chardonnays, rieslings or Rutherglen stickies, trading up is often a lot more money for something that struggles to be much better.
Hawksmoor wrote:Interesting thread - I've been living in London (and some time in Paris) for the last 8 years where my appreciation for claret has grown. I have been in a search to find the Australian equivalent of both left bank and right bank wines. It has been an interesting journey as I have traditionally been a shiraz fan, but cab has really dominated my drinking over recent years (mainly as a function of my location).
The best I have found is Moss Wood and Cyril Henschke. I thought Cyril would make a good Bordeaux contest until I paired it recently with one of Latour's 3rd wines (Pauillic de Latour). On the surface possibly not a fair fight, but they do trade at a similar price point in the UK, and there really was no contest given the Pauillac's strong showing. Moss Wood I think is the closest I have seen to something that gets in the Bordeaux left bank zone, I have tried Cullen and thought it was decent, and have been surprised by the comments here about its inability to age well.
Its the right bank equivalent that has been elusive, I have struggled to find anything local that gets close to a decent mid-tier Pomerol/St Emilion. Merlot is a very different beast to Cab though.
I thought ibwas reading Mike Hawkins post at first. Mike, is that you?
I've eaten at Hawksmoor in London many a time, but no, it's not me !!
