Magnums will oxidize more slowly than 750's and side by side will have less temperature fluctuation than their 750 counterpart. Serious Champagne drinkers frequently tell me they prefer a magnum because of the superior taste, but I never get a clear answer why.
Some vineyards charge triple for magnums because they can get away with it. Perhaps that is the real bottom line.
Statistics: Posted by pizzler — Sat May 09, 2009 7:42 am
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Pays to keep your eyes open and buy, buy, buy when you have the chance. Case of too late - I cried, almost.
Statistics: Posted by Old Salt — Thu May 07, 2009 12:23 pm
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Bick wrote:Decca wrote:
Yes - in theory - there's less air per litre of wine in a magnum than a bottle, so it has less oxygen to react to and therefore ages slower.
But bottles are gassed with nitrogen (I think its nitrogen) when bottled..so there should actually be no air/oxygen in the bottle at all...so really a 750ml screwcap bottle should age exactly the same as a 1500ml bottle or even a 15000ml as long as they are all stored in exact conditions.
The volume of air Vs Volume of wine ratio really only works with wines under cork as there can be movement of air through the cork.
I could be wrong but I'm pretty sure this is how it works.
Magnums are great of entertaining but the costs involved in bottling and sales can be more of an issue than an advantage for a winery but deffinatly does not mean the wine should be 3x the price. 2x yes...maybe a tad over this due to increased costs and maybe a bit of "rarity"....ohh and a little bit of wank factor thrown in for good measure...but deffinatly not 3x....well unless there are customers stupid enough to pay it...then it may just be worth it
Regardless of air ratio at bottling, just about all magnums are cork sealed no? As such I would've thought that as they evolve, the natural exposure of air to greater volume of wine via cork seal would still mean slower (maybe better, I don't know) development? It could be me, but the magnums that have survived the cork lottery do seem noticably different (ie "younger" for lack of a better word) to 750mls.
Statistics: Posted by jeremy — Thu May 07, 2009 6:48 am
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Daryl Douglas wrote: 
as I said Brian, though perhaps I should've added "generally" before "best available". As a fellow pedant, I appreciate your clarification - you must be looking forward to editing Ric's next tour diary 
as I said Brian, though perhaps I should've added "generally" before "best available". As a fellow pedant, I appreciate your clarification - you must be looking forward to editing Ric's next tour diary Rak off hairy leggs.
Statistics: Posted by TORB — Thu May 07, 2009 5:30 am
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Red Bigot wrote:
Those are the readily available pb mixed dozen prices, including freight, not "mates rates" or spot specials.
"There is always a bettter price somewhere, usually just after you bought it."
Daryl Douglas wrote:Of course Brian's most likely quoting the best available prices for the single bottles, as he does
Those are the readily available pb mixed dozen prices, including freight, not "mates rates" or spot specials.
"There is always a bettter price somewhere, usually just after you bought it."
as I said Brian, though perhaps I should've added "generally" before "best available". As a fellow pedant, I appreciate your clarification - you must be looking forward to editing Ric's next tour diary Cheers
daz
Statistics: Posted by Daryl Douglas — Thu May 07, 2009 1:25 am
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Bick wrote:
Decca wrote:Yes - in theory - there's less air per litre of wine in a magnum than a bottle, so it has less oxygen to react to and therefore ages slower.
But bottles are gassed with nitrogen (I think its nitrogen) when bottled..so there should actually be no air/oxygen in the bottle at all...so really a 750ml screwcap bottle should age exactly the same as a 1500ml bottle or even a 15000ml as long as they are all stored in exact conditions.
The volume of air Vs Volume of wine ratio really only works with wines under cork as there can be movement of air through the cork.
I could be wrong but I'm pretty sure this is how it works.
Magnums are great of entertaining but the costs involved in bottling and sales can be more of an issue than an advantage for a winery but deffinatly does not mean the wine should be 3x the price. 2x yes...maybe a tad over this due to increased costs and maybe a bit of "rarity"....ohh and a little bit of wank factor thrown in for good measure...but deffinatly not 3x....well unless there are customers stupid enough to pay it...then it may just be worth it
Statistics: Posted by pokolbinguy — Wed May 06, 2009 11:57 pm
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Softie wrote:
Good old SC, about 3-4 years ago they had a clean out of their Lindemans cellar, apparently over stocked with Magnums. (Hmm, perhaps the asking prices were too high?) I bought six unlabelled St George 95 Magnums for $40 each. I think Brian would find that's less than x2 the price of a 750!
Wine buyers revenge?
griff wrote:Craig(NZ) wrote:Someone in the boardroom at SC is laughing really loud
Just before they restructure yet again and get fired.
cheers
Carl
Good old SC, about 3-4 years ago they had a clean out of their Lindemans cellar, apparently over stocked with Magnums. (Hmm, perhaps the asking prices were too high?) I bought six unlabelled St George 95 Magnums for $40 each. I think Brian would find that's less than x2 the price of a 750!
Wine buyers revenge?
Yeah, I got some Pyrus 2001 unlabelled magums for the same price.
Statistics: Posted by Red Bigot — Wed May 06, 2009 8:40 pm
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griff wrote:
Just before they restructure yet again and get fired.
cheers
Carl
Craig(NZ) wrote:Someone in the boardroom at SC is laughing really loud
Just before they restructure yet again and get fired.
cheers
Carl
Good old SC, about 3-4 years ago they had a clean out of their Lindemans cellar, apparently over stocked with Magnums. (Hmm, perhaps the asking prices were too high?) I bought six unlabelled St George 95 Magnums for $40 each. I think Brian would find that's less than x2 the price of a 750!
Wine buyers revenge?
Statistics: Posted by Softie — Wed May 06, 2009 8:18 pm
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Ultimately, as I mentioned before it all comes down to what someone is prepared to pay for it - last night at a committee meeting someone mentioned 2004 Rockford Basket Press magnums have now been released for $150 which is the same 3x hike: nobody will argue with that though because they would have to pay double that again to get one at auction.
agree. however there is a thing called competition. If 90% of wine firms allocate costs in such a way (it is just accounting after all and the assumptions you make in allocating costs) that affords them to market a magnum at 2x a 750mls, then the 10% that dont can expect the consumer to notice, comment and make conclusions. That is what I am doing
You could argue that magnum at 2x a 750ml means disproportionate costs assigned to 750mls...so are the 750mls overpriced???
Statistics: Posted by Craig(NZ) — Wed May 06, 2009 11:18 am
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Craig(NZ) wrote:
Great kiwi humour movie. One of my best friends had a role being eaten in Black Sheep. He was the chinese guy in the business suit
Ps. Craig, I noticed you seem to be missing your avitiar so may I suggest a replacement?
Great kiwi humour movie. One of my best friends had a role being eaten in Black Sheep. He was the chinese guy in the business suit
Glad you got a laugh out of it.
Craig(NZ) wrote:Not totally up to date with costs but heard where a 750ml glass bottle is say 50c a magnum may be $10
There is also a bit more cost associated to handling, filling, corking and capsuling, hand labelling etc
However this should fall into the "slightly more than 2x category", not the "$500 more" category
As you mentioned, if they have to be hand filled, hand labeled, hand sealed and otherwise made properly (ie. appropriate sulphur adjustments, and not just thrown together by whacking two already-made 750mls and into a magnum bottle as I've heard can occur) all this time & effort adds to the cost of making what's a (relatively) tiny batch. So assuming your $10/bottle figure is right, for Grange which could say cost (:cough:) about $25/bottle tops to make, a magnum would then cost a whole 240% extra - in that regard they could say they should be justified in charging a 200% premium for their trouble in doing it!
Ultimately, as I mentioned before it all comes down to what someone is prepared to pay for it - last night at a committee meeting someone mentioned 2004 Rockford Basket Press magnums have now been released for $150 which is the same 3x hike: nobody will argue with that though because they would have to pay double that again to get one at auction.
Cheers,
Ian
Ps. I agree the 'scarcity' tactic is usually rubbish to suck in the collectors - large format bottles because are so rarely drunk. On the other hand, those who do drink them appreciate the qualities a properly made and cellared bottle has - with about one or two rare exceptions (where I think appropriate breathing was an issue) every wine I've tried from magnum has been significantly better than the equivalent in 750ml.
Statistics: Posted by n4sir — Wed May 06, 2009 10:21 am
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