05 Hill of Grace vs 05 Grange

graham · Post by **graham** » Tue Jan 13, 2009 4:45 pm

Have heard on the grapevine :lol:

that the Hill is something special.
Any views on how these two will stack up against each other?

graham

Craig(NZ) · Post by **Craig(NZ)** » Tue Jan 13, 2009 7:57 pm

not sure how they will stack against each other. All i know is at the prices they are asking neither of them will be stacking in my cellar

Waiters Friend · Post by **Waiters Friend** » Tue Jan 13, 2009 10:13 pm

Craig(NZ) wrote:not sure how they will stack against each other. All i know is at the prices they are asking neither of them will be stacking in my cellar

Ditto. Last time I bought Grange was the 1990, which cost me the staggering price of $130 a bottle.

Mike Hawkins · Post by **Mike Hawkins** » Wed Jan 14, 2009 4:46 am

Graham,

When I spoke to Peter Gago, he indicated the 2004 Grange is the one to look out for. I'll be buying more of it than the 2005.

OTOH, The 2005 Mt Ed is better than its 2004 counterpart, so I'm guessing the same may hold true with HOG.

I guess that doesn't exactly answer your question - sorry.

Mike

Rawshack · Post by **Rawshack** » Thu Jan 15, 2009 9:43 am

Craig(NZ) wrote:not sure how they will stack against each other. All i know is at the prices they are asking neither of them will be stacking in my cellar

Ha ha, good post and my sentiments exactly.

Paullie · Post by **Paullie** » Thu Jan 15, 2009 11:36 pm

Agreed Craig.

JamieH · Post by **JamieH** » Fri Jan 16, 2009 7:52 am

if your going to spend the money, buy the Hill of Grace always. Imo a beautifully crafted single vineyard shiraz. i too have heard 2005 is something special from Stephen and Prue!

Cheers

Jamie

Jay60A · Post by **Jay60A** » Fri Jan 16, 2009 9:58 am

JamieH wrote:if your going to spend the money, buy the Hill of Grace always. Imo a beautifully crafted single vineyard shiraz. i too have heard 2005 is something special from Stephen and Prue!

Cheers

Jamie

There was a WineState vertical of Grange vs HOG a few years back from about the 1980 up to about the 1994(?) vintage which is when Henschke were making great wines. I've mislaid the mag but the tasters were Steve and Pru Henschke, Tim ??? (Adams or Knappstein) and Peter Gago, John Duval. It made fascinating reading. The wines were scored non-blind with detailed TNs from everyone and points. Generally Grange had the edge with I think the 1990 and 1986 Granges leading the pack, then maybe the HOGs from those two vintages. I remember that one of the Penfolds winemakers (Peter Gago I think) loved the 1991 Grange and rated it above all others (19.5/20).

I've drunk a single Grange (1990 though!) and no HOGs so I'm unqualified to answer. But I'd rather have 4-5 bottles of say RWT 1999, or 4-5 bottles of Edelstone 04/05 than a single Grange or HOG so I have to agree with Craig also ...

JamieH · Post by **JamieH** » Fri Jan 16, 2009 8:34 pm

Jay60a
I would probably take 5-6 of the super seconds too (not that rich) and most would probably vote for grange as a better wine across decades. i'm just a single vineyard nut when it comes to super premium wines and i think (this will probably get me in trouble) Grange is a cheat!

Feeling my ears burning now.

Cheers

Jamie

griff · Post by **griff** » Fri Jan 16, 2009 8:44 pm

JamieH wrote:Jay60a
I would probably take 5-6 of the super seconds too (not that rich) and most would probably vote for grange as a better wine across decades. i'm just a single vineyard nut when it comes to super premium wines and i think (this will probably get me in trouble) Grange is a cheat!

Feeling my ears burning now.

Cheers

Jamie

But Jamie. Have you tried Grange? Not trying to say it is worth the money but it can be fantastic wine and there is a reason it is king of the Australian heap.

cheers

Carl

JamieH · Post by **JamieH** » Fri Jan 16, 2009 9:25 pm

Carl,
i've tried ,89, 92,96,99 and 2001 all outstanding wines, the 1996 will probably still be in my top 50 wines of my life when i die. My beef is, Penfolds take the best fruit from Mclaren vale, coonawarra and barossa (this is just the 2003 vintage), within these regions multiple vineyards. with all this access to some of the most expensive and supposedly best fruit in south australia it should be spectacular, year in year out, which it usually is. Only for me, its still cheating, my idea of a true fine wine is not a blend of fruit from a whole state, but at the very least 1 region. all the other icon wines of the world i can think of come from one region at the very least. it would like to see penfolds produce grange all from Barossa fruit or even better a single vineyard, just for one year. all of this is just my opinon though, like i said i'm a big single vineyard fan.

griff · Post by **griff** » Fri Jan 16, 2009 9:38 pm

JamieH wrote:Carl,
i've tried ,89, 92,96,99 and 2001 all outstanding wines, the 1996 will probably still be in my top 50 wines of my life when i die. My beef is, Penfolds take the best fruit from Mclaren vale, coonawarra and barossa (this is just the 2003 vintage), within these regions multiple vineyards. with all this access to some of the most expensive and supposedly best fruit in south australia it should be spectacular, year in year out, which it usually is. Only for me, its still cheating, my idea of a true fine wine is not a blend of fruit from a whole state, but at the very least 1 region. all the other icon wines of the world i can think of come from one region at the very least. it would like to see penfolds produce grange all from Barossa fruit or even better a single vineyard, just for one year. all of this is just my opinon though, like i said i'm a big single vineyard fan.

That is well considered opinion then. Tried some great Granges there. Would like to try the 99 actually but haven't come across it.

I guess I am less romantic in that for me a fine wine is what is in the glass in front of me

cheers

Carl

Jay60A · Post by **Jay60A** » Sat Jan 17, 2009 7:16 am

griff wrote:
JamieH wrote:Carl,
i've tried ,89, 92,96,99 and 2001 all outstanding wines, the 1996 will probably still be in my top 50 wines of my life when i die. My beef is, Penfolds take the best fruit from Mclaren vale, coonawarra and barossa (this is just the 2003 vintage), within these regions multiple vineyards. with all this access to some of the most expensive and supposedly best fruit in south australia it should be spectacular, year in year out, which it usually is. Only for me, its still cheating, my idea of a true fine wine is not a blend of fruit from a whole state, but at the very least 1 region. all the other icon wines of the world i can think of come from one region at the very least. it would like to see penfolds produce grange all from Barossa fruit or even better a single vineyard, just for one year. all of this is just my opinon though, like i said i'm a big single vineyard fan.

That is well considered opinion then. Tried some great Granges there. Would like to try the 99 actually but haven't come across it.

I guess I am less romantic in that for me a fine wine is what is in the glass in front of me

cheers

Carl

Show you how great the terroir is for Latour, Margaux etc. They are making tens of thousands of cases of the stuff from a single site.

Just a thought ... Wonder what a Latour-Margaux blend would be like?
:shock:

griff · Post by **griff** » Sat Jan 17, 2009 11:24 am

Jay60A wrote:
griff wrote:
JamieH wrote:Carl,
i've tried ,89, 92,96,99 and 2001 all outstanding wines, the 1996 will probably still be in my top 50 wines of my life when i die. My beef is, Penfolds take the best fruit from Mclaren vale, coonawarra and barossa (this is just the 2003 vintage), within these regions multiple vineyards. with all this access to some of the most expensive and supposedly best fruit in south australia it should be spectacular, year in year out, which it usually is. Only for me, its still cheating, my idea of a true fine wine is not a blend of fruit from a whole state, but at the very least 1 region. all the other icon wines of the world i can think of come from one region at the very least. it would like to see penfolds produce grange all from Barossa fruit or even better a single vineyard, just for one year. all of this is just my opinon though, like i said i'm a big single vineyard fan.

That is well considered opinion then. Tried some great Granges there. Would like to try the 99 actually but haven't come across it.

I guess I am less romantic in that for me a fine wine is what is in the glass in front of me

cheers

Carl

Show you how great the terroir is for Latour, Margaux etc. They are making tens of thousands of cases of the stuff from a single site.

Just a thought ... Wonder what a Latour-Margaux blend would be like?

And what about bit of Hermitage in the mix?

cheers

Carl

JamieH · Post by **JamieH** » Sat Jan 17, 2009 10:07 pm

Jay60a wrote-
Show you how great the terroir is for Latour, Margaux etc. They are making tens of thousands of cases of the stuff from a single site.

Just a thought ... Wonder what a Latour-Margaux blend would be like?

Now wouldn't that be interesting, a five first growth blend, called the Bordeaux,

if only we of the the normal world could every hope to try it.

Jamie