Had some good luck at a bottle shop a few nights ago.
I went into a bottle shop and saw a fellow trying to buy some wines that were on sale. Each bottle that he brought to the counter either wouldn't scan or only showed the regular price, not the sale price which was clearly marked on the display tag. Without the manager present the cashier couldn't input the sale price. After several attempts to buy some less expensive sale-priced wines man picks up a bottle of '02 Dead Arm Shiraz. It was the only bottle and it had been reduced from C$70 to C$49.99. I asked the man if he knew anything about the Dead Arm and he said no, but it looked like a good wine. He was going to drink it that evening
Once again the cash register wouldn't scan the bottle, and a manual search of the register produced no results. So the fellow went and brought the display tag which had the original price and the written sale price. The lady took the tag, scanned it, and the cash register read C$23.99!! I almost choked.
Of course it had to be the only bottle of Dead Arm and I had seen the bottle before the buyer walked into the store. After getting over the feeling of injustice I decided that I too should try my luck. So I went and took every bottle of expensive sale-price wine to the cash register to do a price check.
With the last bottle I struck gold. The 2004 Langmeil 'Freedom' Shiraz priced at C$110, reduced to C$72, scanned at C$25.99.
Christmas can come early.........Mahmoud.
PS: Of course this disqualifies me for the lottery jackpot doesn't it?
2004 Langmeil 'The Freedom' Shiraz
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Mahmoud Ali
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Re: 2004 Langmeil 'The Freedom' Shiraz
Mahmoud Ali wrote:PS: Of course this disqualifies me for the lottery jackpot doesn't it?
No, but your place in heaven might be in doubt
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Mahmoud Ali
- Posts: 2954
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- Location: Edmonton, Canada
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Mahmoud Ali
- Posts: 2954
- Joined: Fri Aug 25, 2006 9:00 pm
- Location: Edmonton, Canada
Oh Roger, that a bit extreme, although you probably meant it in jest.
I had seen the Dead Arm for sale on the shelf when the fellow walked in and started to try to buy some sale items. I ended up helping him select wines. He wanted to buy the Nottage Hill that was on sale and I said that he would be better off taking the '04 St Hallet Faith that was reduced form C$25 to C$15.99. The cashier said he had to pay the $25 because thats what scanned. He went back to the shelf and selected another wine. I kept pointing out the better wines and he kept taking them to the cashier but had no luck.
So when he picked up the Dead Arm, a wine I had been eyeing, I felt a tinge of regret in not picking up the bottle. I hadn't expected him to opt for the C$49.99 wine (reduced from C$72). So when the cashier said C$23.99 my disappointment was palpable. Perhaps "injustice" was the wrong word but I did tell him about the Dead Arm and suggested he have it with a steak.
Nobody forced them to sell the wine at the low price. In fact the cashier had the tag in hand. It clearly, in red marker, showed the discount price of the Dead Arm as C$49.99, yet she went by what was scanned. I guessed that it was an error of some kind but what was I supposed to say, you can't sell it to him for that price?
And when it came to the Langmeil Freedom, do you reckon that I should have refused to buy it? Remember, they were charging the scanned price, wether it was higher or lower than the tagged price.
Anyway, I'm thinking, perhaps a new post on what is the correct and ethical thing to do in these circumstances.
Cheers.....Mahmoud.
I had seen the Dead Arm for sale on the shelf when the fellow walked in and started to try to buy some sale items. I ended up helping him select wines. He wanted to buy the Nottage Hill that was on sale and I said that he would be better off taking the '04 St Hallet Faith that was reduced form C$25 to C$15.99. The cashier said he had to pay the $25 because thats what scanned. He went back to the shelf and selected another wine. I kept pointing out the better wines and he kept taking them to the cashier but had no luck.
So when he picked up the Dead Arm, a wine I had been eyeing, I felt a tinge of regret in not picking up the bottle. I hadn't expected him to opt for the C$49.99 wine (reduced from C$72). So when the cashier said C$23.99 my disappointment was palpable. Perhaps "injustice" was the wrong word but I did tell him about the Dead Arm and suggested he have it with a steak.
Nobody forced them to sell the wine at the low price. In fact the cashier had the tag in hand. It clearly, in red marker, showed the discount price of the Dead Arm as C$49.99, yet she went by what was scanned. I guessed that it was an error of some kind but what was I supposed to say, you can't sell it to him for that price?
And when it came to the Langmeil Freedom, do you reckon that I should have refused to buy it? Remember, they were charging the scanned price, wether it was higher or lower than the tagged price.
Anyway, I'm thinking, perhaps a new post on what is the correct and ethical thing to do in these circumstances.
Cheers.....Mahmoud.
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bob parsons
- Posts: 282
- Joined: Mon Mar 08, 2004 5:42 pm
- Location: edmonton alberta canada
Bl.... hell, if they screw up and charge $30 for a $60 whatever, take it and smile as you walk out. Just in jest, see my last post here.
Last edited by bob parsons on Sun Nov 30, 2008 7:49 am, edited 1 time in total.
RogerPike wrote:Mahmoud Ali wrote:Anyway, I'm thinking, perhaps a new post on what is the correct and ethical thing to do in these circumstances.
Cheers.....Mahmoud.
Do you really need to ask?
Roger
I agree. The reduced price is marked on the bottle and you can't claim ignorance, unlike the shop assistant who you have dudded. $70 is an excellent price for an excellent wine, the rest is theft.
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Mahmoud Ali
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- Joined: Fri Aug 25, 2006 9:00 pm
- Location: Edmonton, Canada
Davo,
The prices were on the shelf tag, not the bottle. There was no price on the bottle. With the '02 Dead Arm the cashier had the shelf tag in her hand. On it was printed $72 and in bright red marker discounted to $49.99. Yet the two clerks turned to the gentleman and asked him to pay what appeared on the register: $23.99. Was that theft? Was he a thief to pay what they asked for or should he have refused to buy it and gone looking for another bottle?
No one is claiming ignorance. Sure the shop may be making mistakes but let there be no doubt, the gentleman who bought the Dead Arm and I merely took bottles to the register. The price they asked was entirely dependent on the register, they took no note of what the tags said. The gentleman who bought the Dead Arm had already taken 6-8 wines up to the counter and in every case but one it scanned at the regular price. One bottle wouldn't scan and so he couldn't buy it!
How did the gentleman who bought the Dead Arm "dud" the shop assistant? And when the same shop assistant was insisting that he had to pay the regular price for wines that were clearly marked down was she "dudding" the customer?
In my case I suppose you think I shouldn't have taken any sale-priced wines to the register. One bottle I took to the cash register was a California Cabernet. It wouldn't scan, and manually they couldn't find it on the computer. They wouldn't sell it to me. In the case of the Langmeil, it too didn't scan, and when they went through the register manually they found a price and asked me for $25.99. So I paid them.
Anyway, I'm glad you think the Freedom is an excellent wine.
Mahmoud.
The prices were on the shelf tag, not the bottle. There was no price on the bottle. With the '02 Dead Arm the cashier had the shelf tag in her hand. On it was printed $72 and in bright red marker discounted to $49.99. Yet the two clerks turned to the gentleman and asked him to pay what appeared on the register: $23.99. Was that theft? Was he a thief to pay what they asked for or should he have refused to buy it and gone looking for another bottle?
No one is claiming ignorance. Sure the shop may be making mistakes but let there be no doubt, the gentleman who bought the Dead Arm and I merely took bottles to the register. The price they asked was entirely dependent on the register, they took no note of what the tags said. The gentleman who bought the Dead Arm had already taken 6-8 wines up to the counter and in every case but one it scanned at the regular price. One bottle wouldn't scan and so he couldn't buy it!
How did the gentleman who bought the Dead Arm "dud" the shop assistant? And when the same shop assistant was insisting that he had to pay the regular price for wines that were clearly marked down was she "dudding" the customer?
In my case I suppose you think I shouldn't have taken any sale-priced wines to the register. One bottle I took to the cash register was a California Cabernet. It wouldn't scan, and manually they couldn't find it on the computer. They wouldn't sell it to me. In the case of the Langmeil, it too didn't scan, and when they went through the register manually they found a price and asked me for $25.99. So I paid them.
Anyway, I'm glad you think the Freedom is an excellent wine.
Mahmoud.
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Mahmoud Ali
- Posts: 2954
- Joined: Fri Aug 25, 2006 9:00 pm
- Location: Edmonton, Canada
Roger,
When I went to the drive-through bottle shop in the McLaren back in 2001 and spotted some 1998 Charles Melton Rose of Virginia in the cooler with no price tag should I have let them be?
When the shop assistant said $12 should I have refused to buy it because the Melton cellar door was selling the latest vintage for $17?
The wine was delicious and when we went back and asked how much he would charge if I bought the remaining bottles should I have been wearing a mask?
When I drank a bottle that I brought to Canada should I have felt guilty?
Do you think I should return my last bottle the next time I'm in Australia and apologize profusely?
Cheers.......Mahmoud.
PS: The Rose of Virginia had sediment back in 2001. Now in 2008 it is still a lovely elegant rose. If all roses were made like this we'd be drinking more of them.
When I went to the drive-through bottle shop in the McLaren back in 2001 and spotted some 1998 Charles Melton Rose of Virginia in the cooler with no price tag should I have let them be?
When the shop assistant said $12 should I have refused to buy it because the Melton cellar door was selling the latest vintage for $17?
The wine was delicious and when we went back and asked how much he would charge if I bought the remaining bottles should I have been wearing a mask?
When I drank a bottle that I brought to Canada should I have felt guilty?
Do you think I should return my last bottle the next time I'm in Australia and apologize profusely?
Cheers.......Mahmoud.
PS: The Rose of Virginia had sediment back in 2001. Now in 2008 it is still a lovely elegant rose. If all roses were made like this we'd be drinking more of them.
Re: 2004 Langmeil 'The Freedom' Shiraz
Mahmoud Ali wrote:Had some good luck at a bottle shop a few nights ago.
I went into a bottle shop and saw a fellow trying to buy some wines that were on sale. Each bottle that he brought to the counter either wouldn't scan or only showed the regular price, not the sale price which was clearly marked on the display tag. Without the manager present the cashier couldn't input the sale price. After several attempts to buy some less expensive sale-priced wines man picks up a bottle of '02 Dead Arm Shiraz. It was the only bottle and it had been reduced from C$70 to C$49.99. I asked the man if he knew anything about the Dead Arm and he said no, but it looked like a good wine. He was going to drink it that evening
Once again the cash register wouldn't scan the bottle, and a manual search of the register produced no results. So the fellow went and brought the display tag which had the original price and the written sale price. The lady took the tag, scanned it, and the cash register read C$23.99!! I almost choked.
Of course it had to be the only bottle of Dead Arm and I had seen the bottle before the buyer walked into the store. After getting over the feeling of injustice I decided that I too should try my luck. So I went and took every bottle of expensive sale-price wine to the cash register to do a price check.
With the last bottle I struck gold. The 2004 Langmeil 'Freedom' Shiraz priced at C$110, reduced to C$72, scanned at C$25.99.Christmas can come early.........Mahmoud.
PS: Of course this disqualifies me for the lottery jackpot doesn't it?
If you think that the above, which I have underlined, equates to spotting a bargain then you are deluding yourself.
To me it is pretty close to theft.
Roger
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Mahmoud Ali
- Posts: 2954
- Joined: Fri Aug 25, 2006 9:00 pm
- Location: Edmonton, Canada
Roger,
If you want to continue to call me a thief then I guess it’s your prerogative. I admit that the way my first post reads implies that I thought I could “steal†a wine. However, my thinking at the time, which perhaps didn’t come out as I should have written it, was that the real prices for these wines may not have been adjusted and that if I didn’t check out the prices I might be missing out on a good deal.
Why would I think that the tag price might not be correct? Well it all started out with the Dead Arm Shiraz. Here in Edmonton the price of the Dead Arm is usually around $70-80. Most places have the ’04 or ’05. Well about a month ago I saw the ’04 Dead Arm at an affiliated store selling for C$50. On the day of the “theft†I see a single bottle of an older vintage, the ’02, on sale for C$50. So I think to myself, not such a good deal because their affiliated store is selling the ’04 for C$50 and it’s a better vintage. When the register scanned the C$24 price I couldn’t be sure that it wasn’t the cost price of an earlier vintage, or possibly a mistake. All I knew for certain was that the tags were not the correct prices and that the only way to find the true price of the wine was to scan it at the register.
You might wonder why I would think that the store would be selling some wines at cost. Well, in this very store were different bottles of older Burgundy that were reduced from $95-100 to about C$55-60. There were some ’78, ’82, ’85, ’89 and ’98 Burgundies. A friend of mine had e-mailed me to say that he purchased one of the Burgundies, the ’82, for C$40 at another store. He told me to “ignore the tag†that said C$60. I went to the store he mentioned to pick up a bottle and there was a brand new new tag saying “Blowout Sale-Cost Priceâ€Â. There were other wines in that store that had fresh tags, including a ’94 d’Yquem reduced from C$500 to C$375. So it was evident to me that some stores were selling some slow movers at cost price.
With the knowledge that some stores were selling wines at cost price and that C$50 was not the best price in town nor the wholesale price of the Dead Arm, it was conceivable that C$24 might be the wholesale price at which the store was selling the back vintage. My hope was, and it was with that hope that I took the pricier wines I could never afford, that I might find a wine that was scheduled to be sold at wholesale. When the lady said C26 I thought great, its my lucky day for if the wine was to be tagged at a lower price i wouldn’t have been on hand to buy it. Now admittedly, in hindsight, I don’t think that C$26 is the wholesale price of the Langmeil Freedom, or is it?
Anyway, I wasn’t expecting to “steal†a bottle of wine, I was hoping to get a cost-price bargain. Did I get one, or was it a mistake on the cashier’s part (apparently one of two that evening)? I can’t be sure.
Roger, we all like bargains and I’m sure most every wine buyer has a story to tell, even the guy who went home with the Dead Arm instead of the Nottage Hill. If I wanted to steal wine I could have kept quiet when I bought two bottles each of the ’90 Wynn’s Ovens Valley and the ’93 O’Shea at a bottle shop in the Barossa. I paid the bill, the shop assistant handed me the 4 bottles in the bag, and I looked at the receipt which said “3 itemsâ€Â. I didn’t have to tell him that he forgot to charge me for one of the bottles but I did.
My initial post was, I confess, full of excitement and glee. I didn't feel the need to explain the string of events that brought me to think about the underlying reasons why the prices might be lower than the tagged price. Sitting here in Edmonton I didn't think that I need bore people with details of the Edmonton wine scene. Perhaps I should have thought about mentioning the whole thing about cost price but in my excitement I wrote only about the essential element of the story, the great deal. After all, years from now all I expected was to remember the great price at which i acquired a wine I couldn't afford.
Now, however, the details will forever be etched in my mind.
Say, do you want to hear the one about the 1976 Bordeau.......?
Mahmoud.
If you want to continue to call me a thief then I guess it’s your prerogative. I admit that the way my first post reads implies that I thought I could “steal†a wine. However, my thinking at the time, which perhaps didn’t come out as I should have written it, was that the real prices for these wines may not have been adjusted and that if I didn’t check out the prices I might be missing out on a good deal.
Why would I think that the tag price might not be correct? Well it all started out with the Dead Arm Shiraz. Here in Edmonton the price of the Dead Arm is usually around $70-80. Most places have the ’04 or ’05. Well about a month ago I saw the ’04 Dead Arm at an affiliated store selling for C$50. On the day of the “theft†I see a single bottle of an older vintage, the ’02, on sale for C$50. So I think to myself, not such a good deal because their affiliated store is selling the ’04 for C$50 and it’s a better vintage. When the register scanned the C$24 price I couldn’t be sure that it wasn’t the cost price of an earlier vintage, or possibly a mistake. All I knew for certain was that the tags were not the correct prices and that the only way to find the true price of the wine was to scan it at the register.
You might wonder why I would think that the store would be selling some wines at cost. Well, in this very store were different bottles of older Burgundy that were reduced from $95-100 to about C$55-60. There were some ’78, ’82, ’85, ’89 and ’98 Burgundies. A friend of mine had e-mailed me to say that he purchased one of the Burgundies, the ’82, for C$40 at another store. He told me to “ignore the tag†that said C$60. I went to the store he mentioned to pick up a bottle and there was a brand new new tag saying “Blowout Sale-Cost Priceâ€Â. There were other wines in that store that had fresh tags, including a ’94 d’Yquem reduced from C$500 to C$375. So it was evident to me that some stores were selling some slow movers at cost price.
With the knowledge that some stores were selling wines at cost price and that C$50 was not the best price in town nor the wholesale price of the Dead Arm, it was conceivable that C$24 might be the wholesale price at which the store was selling the back vintage. My hope was, and it was with that hope that I took the pricier wines I could never afford, that I might find a wine that was scheduled to be sold at wholesale. When the lady said C26 I thought great, its my lucky day for if the wine was to be tagged at a lower price i wouldn’t have been on hand to buy it. Now admittedly, in hindsight, I don’t think that C$26 is the wholesale price of the Langmeil Freedom, or is it?
Anyway, I wasn’t expecting to “steal†a bottle of wine, I was hoping to get a cost-price bargain. Did I get one, or was it a mistake on the cashier’s part (apparently one of two that evening)? I can’t be sure.
Roger, we all like bargains and I’m sure most every wine buyer has a story to tell, even the guy who went home with the Dead Arm instead of the Nottage Hill. If I wanted to steal wine I could have kept quiet when I bought two bottles each of the ’90 Wynn’s Ovens Valley and the ’93 O’Shea at a bottle shop in the Barossa. I paid the bill, the shop assistant handed me the 4 bottles in the bag, and I looked at the receipt which said “3 itemsâ€Â. I didn’t have to tell him that he forgot to charge me for one of the bottles but I did.
My initial post was, I confess, full of excitement and glee. I didn't feel the need to explain the string of events that brought me to think about the underlying reasons why the prices might be lower than the tagged price. Sitting here in Edmonton I didn't think that I need bore people with details of the Edmonton wine scene. Perhaps I should have thought about mentioning the whole thing about cost price but in my excitement I wrote only about the essential element of the story, the great deal. After all, years from now all I expected was to remember the great price at which i acquired a wine I couldn't afford.
Now, however, the details will forever be etched in my mind.
Say, do you want to hear the one about the 1976 Bordeau.......?
Mahmoud.
Re: 2004 Langmeil 'The Freedom' Shiraz
Mahmoud Ali wrote:Had some good luck at a bottle shop a few nights ago.
I went into a bottle shop and saw a fellow trying to buy some wines that were on sale. Each bottle that he brought to the counter either wouldn't scan or only showed the regular price, not the sale price which was clearly marked on the display tag. Without the manager present the cashier couldn't input the sale price. After several attempts to buy some less expensive sale-priced wines man picks up a bottle of '02 Dead Arm Shiraz. It was the only bottle and it had been reduced from C$70 to C$49.99. I asked the man if he knew anything about the Dead Arm and he said no, but it looked like a good wine. He was going to drink it that evening
Once again the cash register wouldn't scan the bottle, and a manual search of the register produced no results. So the fellow went and brought the display tag which had the original price and the written sale price. The lady took the tag, scanned it, and the cash register read C$23.99!! I almost choked.
Of course it had to be the only bottle of Dead Arm and I had seen the bottle before the buyer walked into the store. After getting over the feeling of injustice I decided that I too should try my luck. So I went and took every bottle of expensive sale-price wine to the cash register to do a price check.
With the last bottle I struck gold. The 2004 Langmeil 'Freedom' Shiraz priced at C$110, reduced to C$72, scanned at C$25.99.
Christmas can come early.........Mahmoud.
PS: Of course this disqualifies me for the lottery jackpot doesn't it?
You knew the prices, you knew what you should have been charged, you admit you scanned every "expensive" bottle until you found one that scanned incorrectly.
You could have alerted the shop staff as to what was going on but you decided to keep your mouth shut and buy the bottle at a price you knew to be much cheaper than it should have been.
I have had the same thing happen on several occasions, not just with wine, but chose to inform the shop assistants concerned of the error at the time.
Your action was dishonest and immoral at the very least but I think it equates to theft because you acted in a calculated manner in the full knowledge you were not paying the true cost of the wine.
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bob parsons
- Posts: 282
- Joined: Mon Mar 08, 2004 5:42 pm
- Location: edmonton alberta canada
I agree with Davo. A similar event happened to me years ago and I did buy at the "low price". Now I feel guilty about it and if I have a query about a price I always check. Old age I guess! And being in the hospitality biz too!!
Many times I have seen possible wrong prices and have queried.
In fact, once in westend here, I came across some LBV port at around $80. I told the store this was a price for VP, not LBV. They did not understand, even after 2 phone-calls!!
Have a great day.
Many times I have seen possible wrong prices and have queried.
In fact, once in westend here, I came across some LBV port at around $80. I told the store this was a price for VP, not LBV. They did not understand, even after 2 phone-calls!!
Have a great day.
I'm going to back Mahmoud on this one, and I'm someone who will buy direct from a winery at a dollar more than at a shop.
The shop would not sell wine at the marked price which is both wrong and illegal. The excuse/reason that the manager was not there is not sufficient. In fact, here in Australia anyway, there is a code of practice that if an item scans at a higher price, then the first of each such item is free http://www.ara.com.au/fileadmin/user_upload/ss-pir/ARA_Scanning_Code_2004.pdf.
Too often as customers we just let people get away with bad service becuase it's too much trouble. In this case, the cashier did know what was going on, and the manager would also be told (unless the cashier was unfit to be employed). And hopefully fix both the issue of items not being sold at their marked price, as well as scanning too low.
I have pointed out to a retailer that wine is on the shelf at lower than cost price, but they were not dishonouring their marked prices at the time.
This week I settled out of court with a travel company that failed to deliver what I had paid for. Mahmoud didn't buy a case at the wrong price, just one bottle. He made a point, and it we all did that, we wouldn't keep getting such substandard service.
edited: Thinking some more, this only holds water if Mahmoud was also refused the purchase of wine at sale price, and wasn't just trying his luck.
The shop would not sell wine at the marked price which is both wrong and illegal. The excuse/reason that the manager was not there is not sufficient. In fact, here in Australia anyway, there is a code of practice that if an item scans at a higher price, then the first of each such item is free http://www.ara.com.au/fileadmin/user_upload/ss-pir/ARA_Scanning_Code_2004.pdf.
Too often as customers we just let people get away with bad service becuase it's too much trouble. In this case, the cashier did know what was going on, and the manager would also be told (unless the cashier was unfit to be employed). And hopefully fix both the issue of items not being sold at their marked price, as well as scanning too low.
I have pointed out to a retailer that wine is on the shelf at lower than cost price, but they were not dishonouring their marked prices at the time.
This week I settled out of court with a travel company that failed to deliver what I had paid for. Mahmoud didn't buy a case at the wrong price, just one bottle. He made a point, and it we all did that, we wouldn't keep getting such substandard service.
edited: Thinking some more, this only holds water if Mahmoud was also refused the purchase of wine at sale price, and wasn't just trying his luck.
Hide the rum Captain Jack Sparrow
Duncan wrote:
edited: Thinking some more, this only holds water if Mahmoud was also refused the purchase of wine at sale price, and wasn't just trying his luck.
I think you need to re-read his post.
He continued to go the the checkout with expensive bottles until he got one that scanned low.
Was the girl at checkout stupid? Possibly.
Was he calculating in his attempt to buy wine far cheaper than he knew it should be, and did he take advantage of the ignorance of the staff? Definitely
Says it all for me.
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Mahmoud Ali
- Posts: 2954
- Joined: Fri Aug 25, 2006 9:00 pm
- Location: Edmonton, Canada
I couldn't understand how the shop's sale pricing worked. All I knew was that these wines were brought in from the liquor chain's other shops. I was directed to it by another shop manager who told me he had packed off cases of sale-priced wines that weren't selling at his shop. The clearance section was a jumble of wines, there were stickers of different colours all over the place, some bottles had no shelf price, and there were unpacked wines still in cartons. There were some "25% off" stickers on the shelves and indeed some of them were reduced by 25%. But there were bottles that were clearly discounted by a bigger margin, some by as much as 40-50%. On one occasion when I asked the manager if she could reduce the price on a bottle of sale-priced '70 Chateau Musar (Lebanon) because the fill was below the shoulder she told me it had already been priced at cost.
On another visit to the shop I bumped into a friend and we surveyed the clutter of wines. He pointed out a pair of bottles, an older California Cabernet, that was reduced from C$55 to C$34. He told me that he saw the same wine selling for C$170 in another store. I was shocked, if the wine is that expensive how is it that the regular price, never mind the sale price, is so low. He rightly said "Who cares". He graciously took only one bottle allowing me to buy the other one. Later, all I could think of was this wine had an old price price tag and was now reduced by 40%.
I found out that many of these wines came from a premium wine store in a northern town. A liquor chain bought the store and moved the wines to outlets in Edmonton and put the wines on sale. Some of those that didn't sell were transferred to this clearance section. Hence the many expensive wines in the clearance section and all the different discounts. (Some of the wines had a sticker with the name of the wine store up north). I had already picked up quite a few wines from this store and it did involve taking many unmarked bottles to the counter to get them priced.
Duncan, it is true that the store refused to sell bottles at the marked price. On a previous occasion they refused to sell me a bottle because the bottle wouldn't scan and they couldn't find it when they looked it up manually. I had to call back the next day to get the price from the manager. These "problem bottles" were from their clearance section. The gentleman ahead of me was refused the sale price on 6-8 bottles. Finally he picked up the Dead Arm and got it for less than the sale price. The sale price was roughly 30% off the regular price and I assumed that it had been further reduced to cost price.
I took sale-priced bottles to the register to see if any other bottles were similarly reduced to cost price. If I was scouting for mistakes then I would have taken even the expensive items NOT on sale. I took the expensive wines for two simple reasons. First, I had already suggested the medium-priced wines to the gentleman before me and as I said they wouldn't sell it to him at the sale price. Secondly, if some wines were going to be sold at cost I wanted to buy wines I normally couldn't afford. One bottle was a 200 Henry's Drive Shiraz and I was relieved that it didn't scan low enough to tempt me. Another bottle wouldn't scan at all and they wouldn't sell it. I figured the Langmeil, at cost price, might be C$35-40. Higher than that and I probably wouldn't have bought it. As it turned out it was less. What was I supposed to say "Your cash register is wrong" or "Your discount price is wrong, please give me another price, preferably higher"?
Davo, I don't think the sales staff were stupid or ignorant, nor were they inconsiderate by refusing to sell people wines at the prices that were marked on the tag. They followed their procedures. They relied entirely on what the cash register told them and apparently hadn't the authority to override it. People who came to the counter were having to return bottles because the sales staff would only go by what price was in the cash register not the sticker price.
The staff had the Dead Arm's shelf tag in their hands. They could see that it was originally C$72, and they could see that it was marked down to C$50. They chose to charge the cash register price. Sure you can assume they're stupid but I look at it another way. If the discounted price of some wines were on the shelf tag but not in the cash register, couldn't there be wines discounted in the register that had not been written on the tag--like the Dead Arm? The man didn't ask to buy the Dead Arm for less, he was prepared to pay the C$50. The staff told him the price was lower than the tagged price. If there was another bottle of Dead Arm I would have picked it up.
Yes I took the bottles to the register but not to look for an error but to see if any of them were further reduced, just like the Dead Arm. If the Dead Arm was priced lower than the shelf price why couldn't some other wines. I was performing a kind of price check, a sale-price check if you will.
Besides, I don't see why I shouldn't buy a wine at a good price just so another customer who took the Langmeil to the counter could get it at the cash register price.
Cheers......Mahmoud.
PS: Please stop over-analyzing my original post. I already said that it was written to convey a sense of good fortune and did not explain what I thought had happened. First I thought "error" then I thought "cost price" and "price-cut" . Then, as I said in my original post "to the cash register to do a PRICE CHECK".
On another visit to the shop I bumped into a friend and we surveyed the clutter of wines. He pointed out a pair of bottles, an older California Cabernet, that was reduced from C$55 to C$34. He told me that he saw the same wine selling for C$170 in another store. I was shocked, if the wine is that expensive how is it that the regular price, never mind the sale price, is so low. He rightly said "Who cares". He graciously took only one bottle allowing me to buy the other one. Later, all I could think of was this wine had an old price price tag and was now reduced by 40%.
I found out that many of these wines came from a premium wine store in a northern town. A liquor chain bought the store and moved the wines to outlets in Edmonton and put the wines on sale. Some of those that didn't sell were transferred to this clearance section. Hence the many expensive wines in the clearance section and all the different discounts. (Some of the wines had a sticker with the name of the wine store up north). I had already picked up quite a few wines from this store and it did involve taking many unmarked bottles to the counter to get them priced.
Duncan, it is true that the store refused to sell bottles at the marked price. On a previous occasion they refused to sell me a bottle because the bottle wouldn't scan and they couldn't find it when they looked it up manually. I had to call back the next day to get the price from the manager. These "problem bottles" were from their clearance section. The gentleman ahead of me was refused the sale price on 6-8 bottles. Finally he picked up the Dead Arm and got it for less than the sale price. The sale price was roughly 30% off the regular price and I assumed that it had been further reduced to cost price.
I took sale-priced bottles to the register to see if any other bottles were similarly reduced to cost price. If I was scouting for mistakes then I would have taken even the expensive items NOT on sale. I took the expensive wines for two simple reasons. First, I had already suggested the medium-priced wines to the gentleman before me and as I said they wouldn't sell it to him at the sale price. Secondly, if some wines were going to be sold at cost I wanted to buy wines I normally couldn't afford. One bottle was a 200 Henry's Drive Shiraz and I was relieved that it didn't scan low enough to tempt me. Another bottle wouldn't scan at all and they wouldn't sell it. I figured the Langmeil, at cost price, might be C$35-40. Higher than that and I probably wouldn't have bought it. As it turned out it was less. What was I supposed to say "Your cash register is wrong" or "Your discount price is wrong, please give me another price, preferably higher"?
Davo, I don't think the sales staff were stupid or ignorant, nor were they inconsiderate by refusing to sell people wines at the prices that were marked on the tag. They followed their procedures. They relied entirely on what the cash register told them and apparently hadn't the authority to override it. People who came to the counter were having to return bottles because the sales staff would only go by what price was in the cash register not the sticker price.
The staff had the Dead Arm's shelf tag in their hands. They could see that it was originally C$72, and they could see that it was marked down to C$50. They chose to charge the cash register price. Sure you can assume they're stupid but I look at it another way. If the discounted price of some wines were on the shelf tag but not in the cash register, couldn't there be wines discounted in the register that had not been written on the tag--like the Dead Arm? The man didn't ask to buy the Dead Arm for less, he was prepared to pay the C$50. The staff told him the price was lower than the tagged price. If there was another bottle of Dead Arm I would have picked it up.
Yes I took the bottles to the register but not to look for an error but to see if any of them were further reduced, just like the Dead Arm. If the Dead Arm was priced lower than the shelf price why couldn't some other wines. I was performing a kind of price check, a sale-price check if you will.
Besides, I don't see why I shouldn't buy a wine at a good price just so another customer who took the Langmeil to the counter could get it at the cash register price.
Cheers......Mahmoud.
PS: Please stop over-analyzing my original post. I already said that it was written to convey a sense of good fortune and did not explain what I thought had happened. First I thought "error" then I thought "cost price" and "price-cut" . Then, as I said in my original post "to the cash register to do a PRICE CHECK".
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Daryl Douglas
- Posts: 1361
- Joined: Fri Sep 05, 2003 7:23 pm
- Location: Nth Qld
There were similar discounts available at the local ex-HedleyLiquor Superstore, 1st Choice outlet after Hedley sold his chain to Coles for several hundreds of $millions. I wonder how many of Mahmoud's detractors wouldn't hesitate to force a bargain price on a stallholder in a third world marketplace.
If a large business, it's local managers, can't put in place appropriate measures to ensure the customer is charged correct price, why deny the consumer any opportunity to take advantage of it's mistakes, enforce mea culpa?
Moralism is a broader church than some here espouse.
daz
If a large business, it's local managers, can't put in place appropriate measures to ensure the customer is charged correct price, why deny the consumer any opportunity to take advantage of it's mistakes, enforce mea culpa?
Moralism is a broader church than some here espouse.
daz
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bob parsons
- Posts: 282
- Joined: Mon Mar 08, 2004 5:42 pm
- Location: edmonton alberta canada
I saw this jumble of bottles in this store 6 months ago when I popped in to talk to the manager who I knew from other parts. At that time he had not priced anything and on enquiring about certain wines and their price I was told "make me an offer".
I have not got a clue where these wines had been since leaving Grande Prairie and I was concerned about poor storage along the way. Neck levels were very low in some cases and I was quite wary. I guess I too could have gone through dozens of bottles to find something decent but I had to move on.
I have not got a clue where these wines had been since leaving Grande Prairie and I was concerned about poor storage along the way. Neck levels were very low in some cases and I was quite wary. I guess I too could have gone through dozens of bottles to find something decent but I had to move on.
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Waiters Friend
- Posts: 2775
- Joined: Mon May 02, 2005 4:09 am
- Location: Perth WA
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Mahmoud Ali
- Posts: 2954
- Joined: Fri Aug 25, 2006 9:00 pm
- Location: Edmonton, Canada
Bob,
You say that 6 months ago the manager was a "he"? Well, the first time I visited the store a couple of months ago the manager was a woman. I spoke to her on the phone. The next time I called the store (to get the price of a Spanish wine) the manager was man. That's 3 managers in the last 6 months.
The current manager seems to be making an attempt to clean up things. The old ALCB wire shelves have been replaced with a tall wooden shelves. Some of the wines I saw in cartons have gone, either sold off quite quickly or transfered to another store. (I had peeked in the cartons and was waiting to see what they were going to price the '03 Kaesler Cabernet and '04/05 Schild Estate Shiraz but they were gone). The evening I bought the Langmeil the staff were replacing every price tag in the regular priced main section of the store. It was interesting because first they took every tag off the shelves and when I walked in there were no price tags on any of the shelve. They were just starting to put the new tags on.
Bob, one of the low level wines was the '70 Chateau Musar, shockingly low level, about mid-shoulder, and reduced from C$98 to C$60. A week later I was served a bottle of '70 Musar that had been purchased at the same store and it was glorious. So maybe no worries on the storage side. I called the manager to see if they still had the wines. There were two bottles. I asked if she could do something about the price since the levels were so low and she said they were at cost price and there was nothing she could do. I said I would take a bottle and thats when she said she would take C$20 off the price to get them out. so I bought the two bottles for C$40 each. You just never know.
Cheers.....Mahmoud.
PS: Bob, they had the Peter Howland Parson's Vineyard Shiraz (your namesake) reduced from $46.19 to $27.89--I hope you got some?
You say that 6 months ago the manager was a "he"? Well, the first time I visited the store a couple of months ago the manager was a woman. I spoke to her on the phone. The next time I called the store (to get the price of a Spanish wine) the manager was man. That's 3 managers in the last 6 months.
The current manager seems to be making an attempt to clean up things. The old ALCB wire shelves have been replaced with a tall wooden shelves. Some of the wines I saw in cartons have gone, either sold off quite quickly or transfered to another store. (I had peeked in the cartons and was waiting to see what they were going to price the '03 Kaesler Cabernet and '04/05 Schild Estate Shiraz but they were gone). The evening I bought the Langmeil the staff were replacing every price tag in the regular priced main section of the store. It was interesting because first they took every tag off the shelves and when I walked in there were no price tags on any of the shelve. They were just starting to put the new tags on.
Bob, one of the low level wines was the '70 Chateau Musar, shockingly low level, about mid-shoulder, and reduced from C$98 to C$60. A week later I was served a bottle of '70 Musar that had been purchased at the same store and it was glorious. So maybe no worries on the storage side. I called the manager to see if they still had the wines. There were two bottles. I asked if she could do something about the price since the levels were so low and she said they were at cost price and there was nothing she could do. I said I would take a bottle and thats when she said she would take C$20 off the price to get them out. so I bought the two bottles for C$40 each. You just never know.
Cheers.....Mahmoud.
PS: Bob, they had the Peter Howland Parson's Vineyard Shiraz (your namesake) reduced from $46.19 to $27.89--I hope you got some?
Daryl Douglas wrote:
Moralism is a broader church than some here espouse.
daz
I believe I am ethical and have morals and try to live my life treating other people in the manner in which I would like to be treated. I am certain other people are not made of the same fabric.
Do you have a problem with that?
Davo wrote:I believe I am ethical and have morals and try to live my life treating other people in the manner in which I would like to be treated. I am certain other people are not made of the same fabric.
Do you have a problem with that?
No problem here
Hence I don't take advantage of people's and organisation's mistakes where they treat me right. If there's a mistake, admit it immediately, work out a way to fix it.
Hide the rum Captain Jack Sparrow
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Michael McNally
- Posts: 2084
- Joined: Thu Sep 08, 2005 3:06 pm
- Location: Brisbane
Davo wrote:I believe I am ethical and have morals and try to live my life treating other people in the manner in which I would like to be treated. I am certain other people are not made of the same fabric.
I find it very hard to reconcile these two sentences. They appear to contradict one another.
Bonum Vinum Laetificat Cor Hominis
Michael McNally wrote:Davo wrote:I believe I am ethical and have morals and try to live my life treating other people in the manner in which I would like to be treated. I am certain other people are not made of the same fabric.
I find it very hard to reconcile these two sentences. They appear to contradict one another.
In what way MM? I am sure there are people who lack ethics /morals otherwise there would not be a criminal element. (Or indeed, lawyers
) Perhaps you think it unethical and immoral of me to suggest that folk of this ilk exist.Michael McNally wrote:Davo wrote:I believe I am ethical and have morals and try to live my life treating other people in the manner in which I would like to be treated. I am certain other people are not made of the same fabric.
I find it very hard to reconcile these two sentences. They appear to contradict one another.
Take it easy there Michael those who are ethical and have morals would never think they are better than anyone else
JF wrote:
Take it easy there Michael those who are ethical and have morals would never think they are better than anyone else
You're right JF.
I don't "think" I am better than anyone else. But I do know I am better than some.
You of course are welcome to your opinion of me and whatever level of society you wish to enjoin.
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Mahmoud Ali
- Posts: 2954
- Joined: Fri Aug 25, 2006 9:00 pm
- Location: Edmonton, Canada
Okay Davo,
I get the feeling that you are not prepared to believe me when I said I really thought that the Dead Arm was intentionally reduced in price; that it was not a cashier mistake because they had the shelf tag in their hands; and that I went to see if any other bottles were similarly reduced.
If you aren't prepared to believe what I thought and did at the time the event took place, then we have no foundation of facts or actions on which to judge ethics or morality.
Here's a question for you. The gentleman ahead of me was asked to pay C$24 for the Dead Arm instead of the reduced price of C$50. Was it immoral or unethical of him to buy it since he thought it was sale-priced at C$50?
If there had been another bottle of the Dead Arm on the shelf would it have been immoral or unethical for me to then buy a bottle?
If the gentleman had instead been trying to buy the Langmeil, would it have been immoral or unethical for me to buy a bottle as well?
Or are we only talking about it being immoral and unethical for me to seek out other bargains (keeping in mind that I thought that some of the wines were likely to have a further reduction to or near cost price).
Cheers...........Mahmoud
I get the feeling that you are not prepared to believe me when I said I really thought that the Dead Arm was intentionally reduced in price; that it was not a cashier mistake because they had the shelf tag in their hands; and that I went to see if any other bottles were similarly reduced.
If you aren't prepared to believe what I thought and did at the time the event took place, then we have no foundation of facts or actions on which to judge ethics or morality.
Here's a question for you. The gentleman ahead of me was asked to pay C$24 for the Dead Arm instead of the reduced price of C$50. Was it immoral or unethical of him to buy it since he thought it was sale-priced at C$50?
If there had been another bottle of the Dead Arm on the shelf would it have been immoral or unethical for me to then buy a bottle?
If the gentleman had instead been trying to buy the Langmeil, would it have been immoral or unethical for me to buy a bottle as well?
Or are we only talking about it being immoral and unethical for me to seek out other bargains (keeping in mind that I thought that some of the wines were likely to have a further reduction to or near cost price).
Cheers...........Mahmoud