Hi all,
Once again, I am using you all for some advice. I am heading out to an Italian Restaurant tonite with my partner for my 30th. Apparently they have quite a selection of Italian wines.
I have no knowledge of Italian wines and am, therefore, asking for help.
I drink predominantly big aussie reds - can someone suggest a good Italian region or variety to look for?
Cheers
Italian Wines
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GravyMaker
- Posts: 58
- Joined: Mon Jun 25, 2007 12:09 pm
- Location: Adelaide
Italian Wines
“I feel sorry for people who don't drink. When they wake up in the morning, that's as good as they're going to feel all day." Frank Sinatra
Gravymaker,
Two Italian wines that I have enjoyed a lot are the following two Tuscan wines from the excellent 2001 vintage. These are mostly based on Sangiovese. Both the wines went very well wtih pasta dishes in tomato-based sauces. The Castello di Ama also complimented some pizzas quite well.
Fontodi Vigna del Sorbo 2001 (14%, cork)
90% Sangiovese
10% Cabernet Sauvignon
Purplish ruby. The nose was a little closed at first when I first poured it into the glass, but after 40 minutes and in subsequent glasses, there were plenty of blackberries, black cherries, and classy oak aromas. Initial entry felt like a Cabernet, but like a curtain lifting on a stage play, soon the main act of sour cherries and spice is revealed. It had a long finish which went on and on. This wine was all class and silky smooth with everything very nicely balanced. There were plenty of tannins to coat your mouth, but they felt ripe and slightly furry backed up by good levels of acid. This wine seemed to have all the stuffings, and nothing was out of place. I barely noticed the 14% alcohol on the nose and palate. This wine seems quite primary in its profile right now, but is drinking very nicely. I guess more cellaring is needed to reach its full potential. Now, where can I get more of this wine?
January 2007
Castello di Ama Chianti Classico 2001 (13%, cork)
80% Sangiovese
8% Canaiolo
12% Malvasia Nera and Merlot
Dark ruby but getting lighter on the rim, going almost watery clear. The initial nose showed stale oak hiding some of the dark fruits of blackberries and cherries. The attack of this wine is all dark fruits and quite velvety as it flows over the tip and onto the rest of the tongue. However, within two or three seconds, the firm but smooth tannins and underlying acidity kicks in leaving a drying, slightly grippy finish with some lingering plums.
After an hour, the bouquet of this wine has blossomed. The stale oak has turned more cedary with a more perfumed nose of sweetish black fruits, cherries, and some spice. With more time, the palate also included an element of sour cherries. This is a lovely wine, and for the price of around 3,200yen / A$33 is great value for money. This is a very good wine, and I have another three more bottles sitting in my cellar. I am not sure if it reflects the typicity of Chianti Classico wines because of the inclusion of Merlot, but for me, it is a really nice wine. I am planning to get a few more bottles as this is one of the best wines that I have had at this price level. I reckon this wine will still be drinking well in five plus years. Not sure about giving points for wines, but I have had three bottles of this wine since October 2006, and none have disappointed.
January 2007
Happy birthday and have a great night out.
Cheers,
Raymond
Two Italian wines that I have enjoyed a lot are the following two Tuscan wines from the excellent 2001 vintage. These are mostly based on Sangiovese. Both the wines went very well wtih pasta dishes in tomato-based sauces. The Castello di Ama also complimented some pizzas quite well.
Fontodi Vigna del Sorbo 2001 (14%, cork)
90% Sangiovese
10% Cabernet Sauvignon
Purplish ruby. The nose was a little closed at first when I first poured it into the glass, but after 40 minutes and in subsequent glasses, there were plenty of blackberries, black cherries, and classy oak aromas. Initial entry felt like a Cabernet, but like a curtain lifting on a stage play, soon the main act of sour cherries and spice is revealed. It had a long finish which went on and on. This wine was all class and silky smooth with everything very nicely balanced. There were plenty of tannins to coat your mouth, but they felt ripe and slightly furry backed up by good levels of acid. This wine seemed to have all the stuffings, and nothing was out of place. I barely noticed the 14% alcohol on the nose and palate. This wine seems quite primary in its profile right now, but is drinking very nicely. I guess more cellaring is needed to reach its full potential. Now, where can I get more of this wine?
January 2007
Castello di Ama Chianti Classico 2001 (13%, cork)
80% Sangiovese
8% Canaiolo
12% Malvasia Nera and Merlot
Dark ruby but getting lighter on the rim, going almost watery clear. The initial nose showed stale oak hiding some of the dark fruits of blackberries and cherries. The attack of this wine is all dark fruits and quite velvety as it flows over the tip and onto the rest of the tongue. However, within two or three seconds, the firm but smooth tannins and underlying acidity kicks in leaving a drying, slightly grippy finish with some lingering plums.
After an hour, the bouquet of this wine has blossomed. The stale oak has turned more cedary with a more perfumed nose of sweetish black fruits, cherries, and some spice. With more time, the palate also included an element of sour cherries. This is a lovely wine, and for the price of around 3,200yen / A$33 is great value for money. This is a very good wine, and I have another three more bottles sitting in my cellar. I am not sure if it reflects the typicity of Chianti Classico wines because of the inclusion of Merlot, but for me, it is a really nice wine. I am planning to get a few more bottles as this is one of the best wines that I have had at this price level. I reckon this wine will still be drinking well in five plus years. Not sure about giving points for wines, but I have had three bottles of this wine since October 2006, and none have disappointed.
January 2007
Happy birthday and have a great night out.
Cheers,
Raymond
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GravyMaker
- Posts: 58
- Joined: Mon Jun 25, 2007 12:09 pm
- Location: Adelaide
Italian Wines
Thanks Raymond - many thanks for your help. I will keep an eye out for them...
“I feel sorry for people who don't drink. When they wake up in the morning, that's as good as they're going to feel all day." Frank Sinatra
Inexpensive and bigger reds - look at Puglia and Siciliy. Negroamaro and the like. I really like them. Lots of character.
You could look at Amarone styles like Masi if you want something very big.
Otherwise 2003 Chianti is nice and big and ripe...2004 more classic.
Good Barolo and Barbaresco is not cheap but great. The fragrance of pinot with the structure of a cabernet....Would have to see the winelist to offer more.. Prunotto is a good for both Barbaresco and Produttori Dei Barbaresco is excellent.
GW
You could look at Amarone styles like Masi if you want something very big.
Otherwise 2003 Chianti is nice and big and ripe...2004 more classic.
Good Barolo and Barbaresco is not cheap but great. The fragrance of pinot with the structure of a cabernet....Would have to see the winelist to offer more.. Prunotto is a good for both Barbaresco and Produttori Dei Barbaresco is excellent.
GW
If it is a decent place, choose your food first then ask the staff what Italian wines they would recommend to accompany the dishes (mentioning your own preferences in terms of wine style, if you'd like to do so).
If it is not that kind of place, they may still have Italian gear by the glass, so trawl through a selection of those and try a bunch of stuff.
My own preferences are close to what Gary suggested: start with sangiovese (or a decent Valpolicella, or barbera) for something Italianate but reasonably all-purpose (as a red). If you want bigger reds, the Southern gear, like primitivo (zinfandel), negro amaro, etc may offer good value for money.
A good Italian list will usually have a couple of different amarone - in Australia, usually something by Masi or Speri or Tedeschi. A variant (and cheaper) reasonably wieghty red is to look for a ripasso wine (probably from the same makers as the amarone on the list). There are some good ripasso wines around, which should be half or a bit less the price of an amarone. Sagrantino can be another excellent bigger red option.
If it is not that kind of place, they may still have Italian gear by the glass, so trawl through a selection of those and try a bunch of stuff.
My own preferences are close to what Gary suggested: start with sangiovese (or a decent Valpolicella, or barbera) for something Italianate but reasonably all-purpose (as a red). If you want bigger reds, the Southern gear, like primitivo (zinfandel), negro amaro, etc may offer good value for money.
A good Italian list will usually have a couple of different amarone - in Australia, usually something by Masi or Speri or Tedeschi. A variant (and cheaper) reasonably wieghty red is to look for a ripasso wine (probably from the same makers as the amarone on the list). There are some good ripasso wines around, which should be half or a bit less the price of an amarone. Sagrantino can be another excellent bigger red option.
Paul.
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GravyMaker
- Posts: 58
- Joined: Mon Jun 25, 2007 12:09 pm
- Location: Adelaide
Assaggio
Not doing Assaggio tonite but have been there before and concur with the comments above - brilliant food and top service....
Heading to No10 Cucina tonite - the old Cibo site in North Adelaide.
Again, thanks for all the comments - this forum never fails me.
Heading to No10 Cucina tonite - the old Cibo site in North Adelaide.
Again, thanks for all the comments - this forum never fails me.
“I feel sorry for people who don't drink. When they wake up in the morning, that's as good as they're going to feel all day." Frank Sinatra
I ate at no. 10 a few months back when a guy I know was managing the place and he recommended a couple of stunning Italian wines. Unfortunately I don't remember the names of either of them (and we got them at mates' rates anyway) and he doesn't work there anymore, but hopefully the rest of the staff will know their stuff as well as he did... I remember one of them was one of the pricier Dolcettos... a real wine drinker's wine, lots of structure and secondary characteristics, so if you're in that sort of company I'd recommend that.
ChrisV wrote:I ate at no. 10 a few months back when a guy I know was managing the place and he recommended a couple of stunning Italian wines. Unfortunately I don't remember the names of either of them (and we got them at mates' rates anyway) and he doesn't work there anymore, but hopefully the rest of the staff will know their stuff as well as he did... I remember one of them was one of the pricier Dolcettos... a real wine drinker's wine, lots of structure and secondary characteristics, so if you're in that sort of company I'd recommend that.
It wasn't Boschi di Berri from Marcarini was it... on 100 year old ungrafted vines?
For a fan of big aussie wines, then Amarone shouts loud. After that, indeed Puglia (with the advantage of often offering great value). If the staff seem knowledgable, then probably best to take their advice direct - after all they'll know the wines they stock.
... and leave the Nebbiolo for me alright
Raymond W wrote:Gravymaker,
Castello di Ama Chianti Classico 2001 (13%, cork)
80% Sangiovese
8% Canaiolo
12% Malvasia Nera and Merlot
Dark ruby but getting lighter on the rim, going almost watery clear. The initial nose showed stale oak hiding some of the dark fruits of blackberries and cherries. The attack of this wine is all dark fruits and quite velvety as it flows over the tip and onto the rest of the tongue. However, within two or three seconds, the firm but smooth tannins and underlying acidity kicks in leaving a drying, slightly grippy finish with some lingering plums.
After an hour, the bouquet of this wine has blossomed. The stale oak has turned more cedary with a more perfumed nose of sweetish black fruits, cherries, and some spice. With more time, the palate also included an element of sour cherries. This is a lovely wine, and for the price of around 3,200yen / A$33 is great value for money. This is a very good wine, and I have another three more bottles sitting in my cellar. I am not sure if it reflects the typicity of Chianti Classico wines because of the inclusion of Merlot, but for me, it is a really nice wine. I am planning to get a few more bottles as this is one of the best wines that I have had at this price level. I reckon this wine will still be drinking well in five plus years. Not sure about giving points for wines, but I have had three bottles of this wine since October 2006, and none have disappointed.
Raymond
We-re in Italia at the moment and after several days in Tuscany, went through 3 bottles of the 04 Castello di Ama. Interestingly, comes it at about the same price, comparatively over here. Lovely wine, very impressive.
Just about to tuck into two beautiful Nebbiolos from the Lombardy region / Mazar Nero D-Avolo 2004 and an amarone style Nebbiolo from the same producer.
Cheers
Wayno
Give me the luxuries of life and I will willingly do without the necessities.
Wayno
Give me the luxuries of life and I will willingly do without the necessities.
They are indeed from the Valtellina region. Nino Negri from recollection.
Only tried the amarone-ed style last night which I found very massive and inky. Reminiscent of some of the heavily oaked Reynell wines in a way although obviously quite different varietally. Lovely complex nose with tons of interest but the wine itself a bit too concentrated and rich for me, at this stage anyway.
Will probably tuck into the base wine tonight. I had this last year - ironically whilst in Burgundy after traipsing it around from Bellagio on lake Como and really enjoyed it for its subtlety and balance. I suspect amarone-ing up nebbiolos is perhaps at cross purposes... but then again Im by no means an expert on Italian wines or this particular variety.
Weve tried a fair bit of wine whilst here - a week in Tuscany ensured constant exposure to Vino Nobiles, Chianti Classicos and Brunellos, procured from a range of places, mostly little bars and the odd supermercato.
Been enjoyable - were off to London for this weekend then a week in Paris and the Loire then home again to springtime Adelaide....
Only tried the amarone-ed style last night which I found very massive and inky. Reminiscent of some of the heavily oaked Reynell wines in a way although obviously quite different varietally. Lovely complex nose with tons of interest but the wine itself a bit too concentrated and rich for me, at this stage anyway.
Will probably tuck into the base wine tonight. I had this last year - ironically whilst in Burgundy after traipsing it around from Bellagio on lake Como and really enjoyed it for its subtlety and balance. I suspect amarone-ing up nebbiolos is perhaps at cross purposes... but then again Im by no means an expert on Italian wines or this particular variety.
Weve tried a fair bit of wine whilst here - a week in Tuscany ensured constant exposure to Vino Nobiles, Chianti Classicos and Brunellos, procured from a range of places, mostly little bars and the odd supermercato.
Been enjoyable - were off to London for this weekend then a week in Paris and the Loire then home again to springtime Adelaide....
Cheers
Wayno
Give me the luxuries of life and I will willingly do without the necessities.
Wayno
Give me the luxuries of life and I will willingly do without the necessities.
Wayno
I fully agree re: tricked up nebbiolo, though I'll caveat that by saying I love the mega-tricked up Barolo Chinato. The exception that proves the rule I s'pose
It's a slow discovery of Tuscany for me, though recently picked up some older Isole e Olena Cepparello from auction, together with a case of Monte Bernardi 'Paris' Chianti and 3 bottles of Selvapiana's reserve Chianti, so that's probably more Chianti than I'd previously drunk in my life before
The Monte Bernardi is the only one we've cracked to date and the first bottle was excellent. Vino Nobile is usually a decent hunting groud, but yet to get spending big on Brunello (there's time!).
By the way, when in London, you may be interested in this place which has got some decent feedback on the UK wine-pages forum: http://www.wine-pages.com/guests/natasha/sampler.htm
80 wines on sample at any point in time according to the blurb and usually a few £££'y bottles in the mix
Plenty of good wine shops and why not see if there's a Christies auction on when you're there?
Hope you're having a great time
regards
Ian
I fully agree re: tricked up nebbiolo, though I'll caveat that by saying I love the mega-tricked up Barolo Chinato. The exception that proves the rule I s'pose
It's a slow discovery of Tuscany for me, though recently picked up some older Isole e Olena Cepparello from auction, together with a case of Monte Bernardi 'Paris' Chianti and 3 bottles of Selvapiana's reserve Chianti, so that's probably more Chianti than I'd previously drunk in my life before
The Monte Bernardi is the only one we've cracked to date and the first bottle was excellent. Vino Nobile is usually a decent hunting groud, but yet to get spending big on Brunello (there's time!).
By the way, when in London, you may be interested in this place which has got some decent feedback on the UK wine-pages forum: http://www.wine-pages.com/guests/natasha/sampler.htm
80 wines on sample at any point in time according to the blurb and usually a few £££'y bottles in the mix
Plenty of good wine shops and why not see if there's a Christies auction on when you're there?
Hope you're having a great time
regards
Ian
Wayno wrote:
We-re in Italia at the moment and after several days in Tuscany, went through 3 bottles of the 04 Castello di Ama. Interestingly, comes it at about the same price, comparatively over here. Lovely wine, very impressive.
The Castello di Ama 04 has gone up a bit in price here. They go for between 4,200 to 4,700yen - A$43 to A$48. I've read mixed reviews about this wine on the Net but have decided to pick a bottle based on your positive experience having not just one but three bottles.
Were there any other Chiantis that impressed you?
Cheers,
Raymond
I really can't remember - and we were drinking these wines out of sh*t glasses but impressive wines shone through the limiting dull tulip profiles. The Castellos were probably some of the better wines we had, to be fair. We did work through a pile of other borderline vino-ordinaires too, which further highlighted the Castello 04 for it's concentration and focus. Another decent wine was the 99 Banfi Nobile de Montulpiciano Riserva (I think) which proved to be top end supermercato wine and none the worse for it.
Cheers
Wayno
Give me the luxuries of life and I will willingly do without the necessities.
Wayno
Give me the luxuries of life and I will willingly do without the necessities.
Thanks, Wayno. The Castello di Ama 2004 is the first Chianti that I have bought from this vintage as there are still plenty of very good 2001 Chiantis still being sold in Japan. Thanks for the tip about the Banfi, but 1999 Chiantis are quite hard to find in Japan except for the ultra-premium and mega-expensive stuff.
Cheers,
Raymond
Cheers,
Raymond