Rockford Black Shiraz

graham · Post by **graham** » Wed Nov 05, 2003 8:40 am

My friends and I can not agree :!:

I think that The Rockford Black is the best sparkling shiraz around, they however like the Great western. Any opinions :?:

Guest - Barry · Post by **Guest - Barry** » Wed Nov 05, 2003 10:07 am

Give me the Seppelt any day - maturity, complexity and length with prolonged ageing in great vintages. The Black is only good IMO - sort of like Vanilla Coke and I have had disgorged bottles from the early 90s and not one has gone anywhere! The 99 disgorged one is the best I have ever had from Rockford but still not in the league of Seppelt.

People on this forum love the Black though and I'm sure its defenders will come out. To me it tastes like an upmarket Vanilla Coke! Love Parker's review in recent Buyer's Guide (along lines of) - "I cannot understand what would possess someone to drink this disgusting concoction" and he rated in in the 70s (of course, he hates sparkling reds but according to this book the Black Shiraz is the worst rated)

Murray · Post by **Murray** » Wed Nov 05, 2003 10:39 am

Different styles I think.

I find the Rockford Black needs plenty of time in the cellar to show best. The young ones I've tied have sometimes been aggressive, but cellaring time will soften them.

Love the Seppelt too.

Adair · Post by **Adair** » Wed Nov 05, 2003 11:30 am

graham wrote:My friends and I can not agree
I think that The Rockford Black is the best sparkling shiraz around, they however like the Great western. Any opinions

Seppelt, Rockford or Primo? Personally I don't care.

I drink them all and enjoy!

Guest - Barry wrote:The 99 disgorged one is the best I have ever had from Rockford

Out of interest, I have not had a 1994 Rockford Basket Press Shiraz. Does anyone have any impressions?

Thanks,
Adair

Pana · Post by **Pana** » Wed Nov 05, 2003 11:51 am

Pound for Pound - Seppelt's Original Sparkling Shiraz is phenomenal.
It cellars for ever, and at sub $15 on special, it is probably the best VFM wine in the country.

Adair · Post by **Adair** » Wed Nov 05, 2003 11:56 am

Pana wrote:Pound for Pound - Seppelt's Original Sparkling Shiraz is phenomenal.
It cellars for ever, and at sub $15 on special, it is probably the best VFM wine in the country.

I can't disagree. It is definitely in the top 5 best VFM wines in Australia with:

Mount Pleasant Elizabeth and probably Tahbilk Marsanne

Adair

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Wed Nov 05, 2003 1:39 pm

[Out of interest, I have not had a 1994 Rockford Basket Press Shiraz. Does anyone have any impressions?]

I've recently had 93 and 94 both were outstanding but then again I have a definate preference to Rockford. My 95 to present vintages will just have to wait :twisted:

markg · Post by **markg** » Wed Nov 05, 2003 5:28 pm

So are you saying that the Seppelt's Original Sparkling Shiraz cf Rockford SBS is as complex or just better value.

What vintages of the Seppelts would you consider are better than the Rockfords then ?

TORB · Post by **TORB** » Wed Nov 05, 2003 6:35 pm

Me, I love them both! They are very different but both top examples of SS. The others on the top of the list include Joseph, Black Pepper (in good years) and Classic Clare.

JamieBahrain · Post by **JamieBahrain** » Wed Nov 05, 2003 7:11 pm

Always believed Rockford Black needs a few years. Would be nice if they released 12 year old sparkling shiraz as Seppelts do. So a true comparison could be made.

I like both, haven't had the pleasure of a 91 Rockfords(current release Show), enjoying the different style and even some regionality.

Seppelt's Original is a great way of stocking up the cellar with affordable sparkling shiraz. I am currently drinking the 93's. Soft and rounded, with very pleasant compexity. Not the length of it's big brother.

Paul T · Post by **Paul T** » Wed Nov 05, 2003 8:53 pm

I'm with Torb..

They are both excellent..as it the Classic Clare.I was dissapointed with the E&E Black Pepper but it may have been a bad year..a bit one dimensional from memory.

I couldn't care less what Robert Parker Jr thinks of any wine..everyones palates are different. I for one are glad he hates sparkling reds (keeps them affordable..lets hope no one changes his mind!!)

Every year on christmas day we have a couple of bottles of Sparkling Black Shiraz with lunch at the beach....and i am counting the days again!!!MMMMMMMMMMMM Red Bubbles!!!!

Cheers

Paul

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Fri Nov 07, 2003 12:13 am

Cards on the table, I love the rockford black shiraz - rich and complex. I think the seppelt (SR 1990) is simple.

Now that out the way, what I don't understand is why the rockford would be vanilla coke? ignoring my preferences, this wine is made from the same fruit as the basket press shiraz - and to my knowledge no one suggests that is as one dimensional as ascribed to the sparkling?

Michael

guest · Post by **guest** » Wed Dec 03, 2003 10:35 pm

Both the Seppelt and Rockford Black are great wines.

I see the Seppelt as great value for money and a very straight forward, rich style that is great to drink.

The Rockford Black is a non-vintage wine made from some serious aged base material and some younger fresh rich Shiraz. It does take a few years in the bottle to really settle down and show all the richness and complexities that Barossa Shiraz can show - I love it and have never had one that disapointed!

What is Parker on about?? - Vanilla Coke?? - he just doesn't understand Australian sparkling reds and obviously drinks too much American soft drink!!!

Brett Stevens · Post by **Brett Stevens** » Thu Dec 04, 2003 11:30 am

was going to reply but i agree with everything guest said above.

michaelw · Post by **michaelw** » Thu Dec 04, 2003 12:14 pm

JamieBahrain wrote:Always believed Rockford Black needs a few years. Would be nice if they released 12 year old sparkling shiraz as Seppelts do. So a true comparison could be made.

I like both, haven't had the pleasure of a 91 Rockfords(current release Show), enjoying the different style and even some regionality.

Seppelt's Original is a great way of stocking up the cellar with affordable sparkling shiraz. I am currently drinking the 93's. Soft and rounded, with very pleasant compexity. Not the length of it's big brother.

Jamie,

I find this thread, and your reply in particular, very interesting. This is the first year I have been able to purchase the the Rockford Black and did so on the advice of many and the pedigree of the other wines I have tasted from this stable.

Many of the TN's I have read and much of the advice I have listened to (from those I know and trust with similar palates) suggests that this wine is a drink young proposition.

I don't have a great deal of experience with sparkling reds but am taking up the fight now. I have tasted the Seppelts Great Western, some Brown Bros and a couple of others. The oldest one I have tasted was a 1995 and was readily able to distinguish the differences on the palate between the older and younger wines. Although I have not tasted youngand old vintages of the same sparkling red.

From experience and gazing into your crystal ball, what changes should I expect to see between the current release of Rockford Black now and again in 10 years?

Adair · Post by **Adair** » Thu Dec 04, 2003 12:32 pm

michaelw wrote:Jamie,

I find this thread, and your reply in particular, very interesting. This is the first year I have been able to purchase the the Rockford Black and did so on the advice of many and the pedigree of the other wines I have tasted from this stable.

Many of the TN's I have read and much of the advice I have listened to (from those I know and trust with similar palates) suggests that this wine is a drink young proposition.

I don't have a great deal of experience with sparkling reds but am taking up the fight now. I have tasted the Seppelts Great Western, some Brown Bros and a couple of others. The oldest one I have tasted was a 1995 and was readily able to distinguish the differences on the palate between the older and younger wines. Although I have not tasted youngand old vintages of the same sparkling red.

From experience and gazing into your crystal ball, what changes should I expect to see between the current release of Rockford Black now and again in 10 years?

MichaelW,

I don't have great experience with the Black as I have only been buying it for 4 years but, for example, I loved the 2003 disgorgement's mouthfeel, length, power and its absolute ease to drink, however, I think the 1998 Seppelt Original has more complexity including hints of savouriness - which the Black will gain. And the Black's mouthfeel will exhibit more depth and more creaminess (like a "spider/fire engine" - ice cream in creaming soda for those less fortunate) with age. On the topic of creaming soda (creaming soda is raspberry/strawberry fizzy drink with vanilla in it somewhere), the recent Black did have a Ãƒâ€šÃ¢â‚¬Å“creaming sodaÃƒâ€šÃ¢â‚¬Â (and therefore vanilla) aspect but I expect that this will settle down once the aspects that we all know that are in the standard Basket Press Shiraz and age come to the fore.

My thoughts and lunch time waffle to take my mind off work,
Adair

Mike Hawkins · Post by **Mike Hawkins** » Thu Dec 04, 2003 7:40 pm

I've got to admit I love both the Seppelts and the Rockford, and both are only a tad in front of the Leasingham CC.

That having been said, I would prefer to drink the Seppelts with food due to its savouriness, and the Rockford on its own. That is not to say that one is better than the other.

If anyone is interested, last time I was at Rockford (October) they were selling magnums of the 1995 disgorgement.

Vertullo · Post by **Vertullo** » Thu Dec 04, 2003 10:08 pm

I was interested in the groups opinion of the Peter Lehmann's Black Queen? I have both the Black Shiraz and the Black Queen and prefer the Black Queen. Any comments ?

Adair · Post by **Adair** » Fri Dec 05, 2003 9:18 am

Mike Hawkins wrote:I've got to admit I love both the Seppelts and the Rockford, and both are only a tad in front of the Leasingham CC.

That having been said, I would prefer to drink the Seppelts with food due to its savouriness, and the Rockford on its own. That is not to say that one is better than the other.

If anyone is interested, last time I was at Rockford (October) they were selling magnums of the 1995 disgorgement.

And it is $250 - even I didn't buy it!

Adair

Mike Hawkins · Post by **Mike Hawkins** » Fri Dec 05, 2003 9:33 am

Adair,

Ouch, I didn't realise the price. At $250, they don't miss, do they. Anyway, they are not profiteerers by nature.

As for the Peter Lehmann BQ, the current release 96 is much better IMO than the 94. From memory the former won the trophy in its class at the Sydney show. Its more in the Rockford style than the savouriness of the Seppelts.

michel · Post by **michel** » Fri Dec 05, 2003 9:42 am

Vertullo wrote:I was interested in the groups opinion of the Peter Lehmann's Black Queen? I have both the Black Shiraz and the Black Queen and prefer the Black Queen. Any comments ?

which release Chris?
I had one a year or so ago and it was brilliant.
the most recent one at cellar door is a bit simple and dissapointing.
the port at cellar door the king is mind blowing
cheers
michel

TORB · Post by **TORB** » Fri Dec 05, 2003 6:54 pm

Agree with Michael and disagree with Mike. :shock:

IMO the 94 black Queen was a ripper but I was underwhelmed by the 96.

Brucer · Post by **Brucer** » Mon Dec 15, 2003 10:05 am

Nobody has mentioned Charlie Melton Sparkling red.
I have all the top sparkling reds, and drink them regularly.

I think the top wines are....

Charlie Melton disgorge 96 and 99
Seppelt Mellinium release 1993,91
Classic Clare 91 and 94
Anderson from Rutherglen 95,97 and 98
Seppelt Original 94,95,96
Rockfords are good, but at the price, there are others offering better value/drinking pleasure.
Peter Lehmann Black Queen 96

radioactiveman · Post by **radioactiveman** » Mon Dec 15, 2003 10:33 pm

Brucer wrote:Nobody has mentioned Charlie Melton Sparkling red.

Is this still made? I haven't seen it on the order form for the last couple of years.

Cheers

Jamie

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