Hi Good Peoples,
If I disliked corks before, I now beginning to seriously hate what they are doing to wine. Three nights ago I opened up a 1992 Leasingham Classic Clare Cabernet Sauvignonand it was badly corked. So I opened up a 1994 Peter Lehmann Mentor and it was oxidised.
As outlined here previously, Wirra Wirra was kind enough to replace a corked 1996 RSW with another one of the same vintage from their museum stock. I opened it last night only to find the bloody thing badly oxidised.
So instead, I opened a Primo Estate 1996 Joseph This wine has thrown a huge, chunky crust and definitely needed decanting. The colour was a concern as the browning indicated a wine of a much greater age. Initially the nose showed very little complexity and was dominated by very ripe blackberry. After only a short time in the glass, the real character of the wine started to emerge with sweet red and blue berries being the dominant aromas. Initially, chewy tannins dominated the uptake but the buried fruit is sufficiently powerful to poke its head up and be noticed. Blackberry, blueberry, chocolate, five spice and aniseed finish with adequate persistence. With time, the true colours emerged and the class of the wine showed. Perfectly balanced, the fruit shone through and it was vastly improved by food. Rated as Excellent.
Now what have you guys when drinking?
Sunday drinking reports and corks!
Jim Barry Watervale Riesling 2000
Golden colour, showing kero & honey on the nose, which were joined on the palate by a touch of lemon (rind). Acidity soft but strong. Fairly weak finish. Overall it was a decent wine, but there's better Clare Rieslings around & this one wasn't about to get much better.
A particularly awful food match with Chicken Satay as well![/b]
Golden colour, showing kero & honey on the nose, which were joined on the palate by a touch of lemon (rind). Acidity soft but strong. Fairly weak finish. Overall it was a decent wine, but there's better Clare Rieslings around & this one wasn't about to get much better.
A particularly awful food match with Chicken Satay as well![/b]
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David Lole
I'm trying to maximise my AFD's during the week, which may or may not be a good thing, when you tend to drink more on the weekends! After two offlines last Saturday (a big one) and Monday (thankfully much better behaved) my body organs needed a good rest, so nothing was consumed until .......
Thursday saw the arrival of a case of Tyrrell's 2002 Vat 47 Chardonnay - I had to try one, didn't I!
Pale straw but bright with green flashes. Grilled nuts, green melon, guava, minerals, subtle, smoky, spicy oak and a hint of nitroglycerine (Wink) on the nose. Excels on the palate with a tightness of structure, superb oak handling, perfectly-wrought barrel-ferment characters (bacon fat and cashew), crisp, minerally acidity and beautifully poised, mostly green spectrum fruit aka nose. Predictably, finishes complex, long and with a promise for much better things to come. Needs time. Drink 2007- 2012. Rated as Excellent. 13.0%
Last night we had the folks over for Mum's 75th Birthday and the women only drink white so I opened a '98 Penfolds Aged Release Clare Riesling that I thought too pineapply and a bit ordinary, so while everyone sipped away, decided to crack another 2002 Vat 47 to gauge bottle consistency (:wink:) and am pleased to report this was identical to the bottle on Thursday.
Dad loves his reds and we cracked a '94 Henschke Mt Edelstone with a nice piece of beef fillet and mushroom sauce for mains - (running commentary below over a 4 hour period)
14.2% A/V.
Deep magenta, holding well. Deepset bouquet of ground beef, game, earth and macerated plum with a touch of DMS (cassis) interplaying with complex, savoury oak-derived nuances of mocha, spice box, cigars, cedar and reef oil. Almost too much of a good thing. In comparison, the palate is a little attenuated with road tar, spicy plum and cedary oak, robust, angular acids and bitter tannins followed by a terrifically long, dry, mouth-puckering finish with just a twist of sweetness at the death, saving the day. Not sure where this is heading. Enigmatic. Very good, for sure, but no better.
Fleshing out more on the palate, 2 hours later. More integration of the acid and tannin, too. Nose is very moorish. Happier now. Final comment before I hit the sack - alcohol level is the stumbling block on the palate methinks.
Best wine of the night was the Excellent/Outstanding DP63 Show Muscat from Seppelt (375 ml). Nectar of the Gods and so little hard earned needed to secure it.
Thursday saw the arrival of a case of Tyrrell's 2002 Vat 47 Chardonnay - I had to try one, didn't I!
Pale straw but bright with green flashes. Grilled nuts, green melon, guava, minerals, subtle, smoky, spicy oak and a hint of nitroglycerine (Wink) on the nose. Excels on the palate with a tightness of structure, superb oak handling, perfectly-wrought barrel-ferment characters (bacon fat and cashew), crisp, minerally acidity and beautifully poised, mostly green spectrum fruit aka nose. Predictably, finishes complex, long and with a promise for much better things to come. Needs time. Drink 2007- 2012. Rated as Excellent. 13.0%
Last night we had the folks over for Mum's 75th Birthday and the women only drink white so I opened a '98 Penfolds Aged Release Clare Riesling that I thought too pineapply and a bit ordinary, so while everyone sipped away, decided to crack another 2002 Vat 47 to gauge bottle consistency (:wink:) and am pleased to report this was identical to the bottle on Thursday.
Dad loves his reds and we cracked a '94 Henschke Mt Edelstone with a nice piece of beef fillet and mushroom sauce for mains - (running commentary below over a 4 hour period)
14.2% A/V.
Deep magenta, holding well. Deepset bouquet of ground beef, game, earth and macerated plum with a touch of DMS (cassis) interplaying with complex, savoury oak-derived nuances of mocha, spice box, cigars, cedar and reef oil. Almost too much of a good thing. In comparison, the palate is a little attenuated with road tar, spicy plum and cedary oak, robust, angular acids and bitter tannins followed by a terrifically long, dry, mouth-puckering finish with just a twist of sweetness at the death, saving the day. Not sure where this is heading. Enigmatic. Very good, for sure, but no better.
Fleshing out more on the palate, 2 hours later. More integration of the acid and tannin, too. Nose is very moorish. Happier now. Final comment before I hit the sack - alcohol level is the stumbling block on the palate methinks.
Best wine of the night was the Excellent/Outstanding DP63 Show Muscat from Seppelt (375 ml). Nectar of the Gods and so little hard earned needed to secure it.
Drinking/Tasting from this week:
NV Billecart: new label, fresh batch. light, crisp refreshing, green acid and lemon.
04 Haselgrove Adelaide Hills Viognier - strange: great fruit but badly made? flat with a short finish
04 Haselgrove Adelaide Hills Shiraz - mice enough, pineapple fruit
98 Giaconda Chardonnay - Excellent. Holding its colour well, no real hints of gold yet. Struck match nose, white peach, roast nuts palate, touch of creamy oak. Just lovely
01 Henri Gouges NSG les St Georges - very young and tight, started to blossom after 4 hours in decanter. Black fruits, roasted meats. needsa long time to open up.
01 Rousseau Clos St Jacques - Stunning! Roses and white flowers nose, crunchy red fruit palate, perfectly balanced, intense and mouth coating. great acid profile, will live for ages.
01 Murdoch Pinot - erk, oaky and bitter.
03 Valli Bannockburn Pinot - better, less oak
03 Valli Gibbston Pinot - best of these three, rounder and fleshier, black fruited.
03 Cloudy Bay Pinot - slightly unripe, like the white part of a strawberry, and a touch stinky.
03 Summerfield Merlot - hot and alcoholic, very ripe. Think of flat Coke.
03 Summerfield Reserve Shiraz - amazing colour. Big beast of a wine but well balanced and holds its 15% alcohol.
03 Summerfield Reserve Cabernet Shiraz Didnt see the cabernet component come out untl the second night, when it showed as a vert "correct" blend, with both grapes havign their say. Big and very ripe (well, its Summerfield!), but balances well. Oak is very malty, giving this a soft licorice type of taste.
99 Clos Des Papes: Some grenache driven turkish delight/icing sugar, and heaps of earthy notes. beautifully smooth and rounded palate, quite satisfying and silky.
99 Brown Bros Patricia Noble Riesling: Lovely, taking on the musky character that noble riesling can get.
with tonight and tomorrow to come yet!
AB
NV Billecart: new label, fresh batch. light, crisp refreshing, green acid and lemon.
04 Haselgrove Adelaide Hills Viognier - strange: great fruit but badly made? flat with a short finish
04 Haselgrove Adelaide Hills Shiraz - mice enough, pineapple fruit
98 Giaconda Chardonnay - Excellent. Holding its colour well, no real hints of gold yet. Struck match nose, white peach, roast nuts palate, touch of creamy oak. Just lovely
01 Henri Gouges NSG les St Georges - very young and tight, started to blossom after 4 hours in decanter. Black fruits, roasted meats. needsa long time to open up.
01 Rousseau Clos St Jacques - Stunning! Roses and white flowers nose, crunchy red fruit palate, perfectly balanced, intense and mouth coating. great acid profile, will live for ages.
01 Murdoch Pinot - erk, oaky and bitter.
03 Valli Bannockburn Pinot - better, less oak
03 Valli Gibbston Pinot - best of these three, rounder and fleshier, black fruited.
03 Cloudy Bay Pinot - slightly unripe, like the white part of a strawberry, and a touch stinky.
03 Summerfield Merlot - hot and alcoholic, very ripe. Think of flat Coke.
03 Summerfield Reserve Shiraz - amazing colour. Big beast of a wine but well balanced and holds its 15% alcohol.
03 Summerfield Reserve Cabernet Shiraz Didnt see the cabernet component come out untl the second night, when it showed as a vert "correct" blend, with both grapes havign their say. Big and very ripe (well, its Summerfield!), but balances well. Oak is very malty, giving this a soft licorice type of taste.
99 Clos Des Papes: Some grenache driven turkish delight/icing sugar, and heaps of earthy notes. beautifully smooth and rounded palate, quite satisfying and silky.
99 Brown Bros Patricia Noble Riesling: Lovely, taking on the musky character that noble riesling can get.
with tonight and tomorrow to come yet!
AB
I only opened one but GREAT Easter wine, the 2002 Redbank SALLY'S PADDOCK. What powerhouse and character. Absolutely loved it although still a baby. More about this ripper later.
Ps: By the way, the best Easter reading was provided by Ric with his South Australian tour diary part 1-2. Excellent.
Cheers,
Attila
Ps: By the way, the best Easter reading was provided by Ric with his South Australian tour diary part 1-2. Excellent.
Cheers,
Attila
"(Wine) information is only as valuable as its source" DB
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JamieBahrain
- Posts: 3754
- Joined: Sat Aug 16, 2003 7:40 am
- Location: Fragrant Harbour.
Clos de lus Siete 2002- Mendoza blend, mostly malbec but a good dollop of shiraz. French winemaking expertise and investment produces a New World style of wine. Powerful, grippy malbec is tamed by the blending of shiraz and friend to produce a very good wine. W/Spectator gave it 90pts and a bit of a rap for a first up effort which I would concur with- about $30 AUD.
Hamelin Bay 5 Ashes Reserve Shiraz 2001- Austere, earthy blackberry notes and a not distracting hint of horse hair. The fruit doesn't fill the structure of the wine, fine berries and some brett coming through in a medium weight palate. The acids long and tannin coarse. Cork indicated a possible sunbaking somewhere along the line!
Leeuwin Estate Prelude Chardonnay 2001- Should be called "Prelude Only" or " Not The Art Series" as dinner guests where excited I had pulled this one out. Clean citrus aromas, with developed melon-peach and butterscotch coming out with a swirl. Medium weight with an unusual creamy-dusty texture and a quickfire finish. Not bad.
Houghton's Margaret River 2001 Cabernet Sauvignon- Distinctly new world & new wave cabernet. Needs a good deal of air to take away youthful rawness. In doing so, the ripe fruit tamed and some discernible savoury oak comes through. Bit more time and more variatal characters come through including blackcurrant, leaf and black olive. Smmooth in the mouth, grainy ripe tannins and the wine completes in good balance- mid palate hole evident.
Three strains of flu have hit HK and I have one! Frustrating as last nights drinking supposed to include a 96 Craiglee shiraz & 2001 Classic Clare Shiraz.
DLo- The 94 Mt Ed does seem to improve with a air. Just looking back at my notes from past. Brought one up from Aus' last trip and will try once my three month "wine travel shock quarantine" expires!
Hamelin Bay 5 Ashes Reserve Shiraz 2001- Austere, earthy blackberry notes and a not distracting hint of horse hair. The fruit doesn't fill the structure of the wine, fine berries and some brett coming through in a medium weight palate. The acids long and tannin coarse. Cork indicated a possible sunbaking somewhere along the line!
Leeuwin Estate Prelude Chardonnay 2001- Should be called "Prelude Only" or " Not The Art Series" as dinner guests where excited I had pulled this one out. Clean citrus aromas, with developed melon-peach and butterscotch coming out with a swirl. Medium weight with an unusual creamy-dusty texture and a quickfire finish. Not bad.
Houghton's Margaret River 2001 Cabernet Sauvignon- Distinctly new world & new wave cabernet. Needs a good deal of air to take away youthful rawness. In doing so, the ripe fruit tamed and some discernible savoury oak comes through. Bit more time and more variatal characters come through including blackcurrant, leaf and black olive. Smmooth in the mouth, grainy ripe tannins and the wine completes in good balance- mid palate hole evident.
Three strains of flu have hit HK and I have one! Frustrating as last nights drinking supposed to include a 96 Craiglee shiraz & 2001 Classic Clare Shiraz.
DLo- The 94 Mt Ed does seem to improve with a air. Just looking back at my notes from past. Brought one up from Aus' last trip and will try once my three month "wine travel shock quarantine" expires!
It has been quite a long time since my last report... not really drinking too many exciting things.
Had a couple of disapointments too - corked 98 Forrest Hill riesling, oxidised or heat affected 94 Bailey's 1920's Block shiraz (pungent bitter/sour aroma and taste).
1998 Happs Late Picked Verdelho, expected to be past it, actually very enjoyable honeyed dessert wine.
Berry Farm rasberry liqueur very rasberry and sweet, though with acid to almost cleanse the palate.
Good stuff dragged out for a recent BBQ with a couple of friends from the wine course last year... no notes, just enjoyed!
1997 Petaluma Tiers chardonnay very enjoyable, fairly complex, well aged.
1995 Vasse Felix Heytsbury cabernet blend ditto.
2002 Picardy pinot a bit simple, cloudy... faults? Okay to drink, though not special.
Remarkably drinkable at father-in-laws last friday... 2002 Mc Guigan Black Label (f#$@ing) Merlot ex magnum ($14!!!) Well suited to bring out when entertaining undiscerning heavy drinkers. Didn't get to open the good bottle I took. Brought it home to take down again next time!!
cheers
Had a couple of disapointments too - corked 98 Forrest Hill riesling, oxidised or heat affected 94 Bailey's 1920's Block shiraz (pungent bitter/sour aroma and taste).
1998 Happs Late Picked Verdelho, expected to be past it, actually very enjoyable honeyed dessert wine.
Berry Farm rasberry liqueur very rasberry and sweet, though with acid to almost cleanse the palate.
Good stuff dragged out for a recent BBQ with a couple of friends from the wine course last year... no notes, just enjoyed!
1997 Petaluma Tiers chardonnay very enjoyable, fairly complex, well aged.
1995 Vasse Felix Heytsbury cabernet blend ditto.
2002 Picardy pinot a bit simple, cloudy... faults? Okay to drink, though not special.
Remarkably drinkable at father-in-laws last friday... 2002 Mc Guigan Black Label (f#$@ing) Merlot ex magnum ($14!!!) Well suited to bring out when entertaining undiscerning heavy drinkers. Didn't get to open the good bottle I took. Brought it home to take down again next time!!
cheers
Gavin's Picks!
http://www.auswine.com.au/page.asp?PageID=1064
http://www.auswine.com.au/page.asp?PageID=1064
2000 Tyrrells Vat 47 Chardonnay (Hunter)
My word. Tight as a drum. Light nuts, lots of grapefruit, and minimal oak on the nose. Powerful but restrained. The palate has plenty of acid for the long haul, the oak is virtually unnoticeable, the wine has lovely balance over the palate, although it's quite subdued. The whole thing screams quality, without seeming overworked. Leave another 5 years at least!
cheers,
Graeme
My word. Tight as a drum. Light nuts, lots of grapefruit, and minimal oak on the nose. Powerful but restrained. The palate has plenty of acid for the long haul, the oak is virtually unnoticeable, the wine has lovely balance over the palate, although it's quite subdued. The whole thing screams quality, without seeming overworked. Leave another 5 years at least!
cheers,
Graeme
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Daryl Douglas
- Posts: 1361
- Joined: Fri Sep 05, 2003 7:23 pm
- Location: Nth Qld
Bannockburn Shiraz 2001 First time I've tasted this wine. Fruit was muted but there with restrained oak support. Savoury, medium finish. Don't know French wines but this may be a reasonable emulation Recommended * value @ $40.
Tahbilk Shiraz/Malbec 1990 American vanillan oak dominates the nose. Plummy shiraz fruit is still there on the palate, admirably supported by sweet oak, the malbec adding savouriness. A dry finsih with prominent tannins that make me wonder if this wine had some whole bunch components. Nice aged wine with some character, I liked the integrated oak and grape tannins. Highly Recommended **** value @ $30
daz
[/i][/b]
Tahbilk Shiraz/Malbec 1990 American vanillan oak dominates the nose. Plummy shiraz fruit is still there on the palate, admirably supported by sweet oak, the malbec adding savouriness. A dry finsih with prominent tannins that make me wonder if this wine had some whole bunch components. Nice aged wine with some character, I liked the integrated oak and grape tannins. Highly Recommended **** value @ $30
daz
[/i][/b]
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Daryl Douglas
- Posts: 1361
- Joined: Fri Sep 05, 2003 7:23 pm
- Location: Nth Qld
Re: Sunday drinking reports and corks!
TORB wrote:Hi Good Peoples,
If I disliked corks before, I now beginning to seriously hate what they are doing to wine. Three nights ago I opened up a 1992 Leasingham Classic Clare Cabernet Sauvignonand it was badly corked. So I opened up a 1994 Peter Lehmann Mentor and it was oxidised.
As outlined here previously, Wirra Wirra was kind enough to replace a corked 1996 RSW with another one of the same vintage from their museum stock. I opened it last night only to find the bloody thing badly oxidised.
So instead, I opened a Primo Estate 1996 Joseph This wine has thrown a huge, chunky crust and definitely needed decanting. The colour was a concern as the browning indicated a wine of a much greater age. Initially the nose showed very little complexity and was dominated by very ripe blackberry. After only a short time in the glass, the real character of the wine started to emerge with sweet red and blue berries being the dominant aromas. Initially, chewy tannins dominated the uptake but the buried fruit is sufficiently powerful to poke its head up and be noticed. Blackberry, blueberry, chocolate, five spice and aniseed finish with adequate persistence. With time, the true colours emerged and the class of the wine showed. Perfectly balanced, the fruit shone through and it was vastly improved by food. Rated as Excellent.
Now what have you guys when drinking?
Opened a bottle of Cullen Mangan 2002 recently. The cork was saturated, the wine corked, oxidised and totally offensive. Removed the cork from my last bottle of the same wine - very enjoyable. I do have some concerns with any Cullen wines sealed with cork, the inconsistency of the seal having been shown to me with at least one bottle of the premiun cab/merlot showing streaks to almost to top of the cork. I've also experienced big, large, humungus bottle variation in 2001 Cullen chardonnay sealed by cork. There may be some handling problems with screwcapped wines, the potential for the soft alloy to be damaged, but it seems to be best seal around. The cork in a bottle of Tahbilk Shiraz/Malbec 1990 opened recently was 2/3 soaked, the waiter's friend failed to remove the last 1/2 cm of the cork. The wine hadn't suffered, luckily.
Yep, roll on screwcap wines from the cheapest to the most expensive.
daz
Last edited by Daryl Douglas on Mon Mar 28, 2005 6:01 am, edited 1 time in total.
Quick impressions from a somewhat battered memory.
Clos Clare Shiraz 2002, sensational vibrant blueberry dominant fruit with heaps of pepper dominating the rest of the spices.
St Halletts "Old Block" 1994, bloody ripper. Plenty of primary Barossa fruit still evifdent to go with the develoing secondary licorice and leather.
Grant Burge "Meschach" 1998, The wife liked it but I think it is rapidly fading into obscurity, especially when compared with the sensational depth of fruit still evident in the 2000 I tried a couple of weeks ago.
Heritage "Rossco's" Shiraz 2002, Did someone mention fruit. Hell this has more fruit than the local fruit wholesaler. Excellent drop at a more than reasonable price. Now, if I can only keep my hands off the rest of them for about 6 more years.
Veritas "Heinrich" 2002 Wow, only 40% Mataro going by the label, but man, what Mataro. It dominates this GSM to the max. Ginger, fresh mown hay and black fruits with smooooth tannins. Bloody good drinking for the price.
Veritas "Retro 55" 2002. Hey this is a nice everyday drink. Nothing to tease the brain but plenty to keep the buds happy. Pleasant stuff.
Saltram "Mamre Brook" 2002 Cab Sauv. If you havn't bought 10 doz of this you are nuts. The best, bar none, VFM wine I have had in years. More fresh fruit than the Sydney Mardi Gras, but it ain't just simple juice. There is plenty going on in there. This wine is busier than a wasp in a fat boys lunch box. (Yes I stole the line, so sue me.) And even better after 24 hours of air time. Bloody stunning for the $. And the Shira ain't far behind
Peter Lehman "1885" Shiraz. Very nice Barossa shiraz, possibly a little overpriced when compared to the Mamre Brook at around $10 to $15 a bottle cheaper but still a very well integrated wine with plenty going on to keep you interested. CD only.
Magpie "The Thief" 2003 Mouverdre Grenache. Made from the free run juice of both varieties, before they got serious with the heavier pressings. Not at all my style really, too much sickly sweet red berry fruit. Maybe chilled and served on the verandah on a stinking hot day with an antipasto platter. Nah, I would take the Retro 55 from the same stable any day for that job. Others liked it however, but then Julie always was a lover of sweet grenache based juice.
Oh, and the best OZ PN I have had for under $150 pb at less than 1/6 that price. And no I ain't going to tell you what it was or even what state it came from as supplies are very tight and I wish to keep mine coming. As Ma Prem Shiela said, "A girl has to keep some secrets" Actually I lied, she really said "Tough Titties!"
Clos Clare Shiraz 2002, sensational vibrant blueberry dominant fruit with heaps of pepper dominating the rest of the spices.
St Halletts "Old Block" 1994, bloody ripper. Plenty of primary Barossa fruit still evifdent to go with the develoing secondary licorice and leather.
Grant Burge "Meschach" 1998, The wife liked it but I think it is rapidly fading into obscurity, especially when compared with the sensational depth of fruit still evident in the 2000 I tried a couple of weeks ago.
Heritage "Rossco's" Shiraz 2002, Did someone mention fruit. Hell this has more fruit than the local fruit wholesaler. Excellent drop at a more than reasonable price. Now, if I can only keep my hands off the rest of them for about 6 more years.
Veritas "Heinrich" 2002 Wow, only 40% Mataro going by the label, but man, what Mataro. It dominates this GSM to the max. Ginger, fresh mown hay and black fruits with smooooth tannins. Bloody good drinking for the price.
Veritas "Retro 55" 2002. Hey this is a nice everyday drink. Nothing to tease the brain but plenty to keep the buds happy. Pleasant stuff.
Saltram "Mamre Brook" 2002 Cab Sauv. If you havn't bought 10 doz of this you are nuts. The best, bar none, VFM wine I have had in years. More fresh fruit than the Sydney Mardi Gras, but it ain't just simple juice. There is plenty going on in there. This wine is busier than a wasp in a fat boys lunch box. (Yes I stole the line, so sue me.) And even better after 24 hours of air time. Bloody stunning for the $. And the Shira ain't far behind
Peter Lehman "1885" Shiraz. Very nice Barossa shiraz, possibly a little overpriced when compared to the Mamre Brook at around $10 to $15 a bottle cheaper but still a very well integrated wine with plenty going on to keep you interested. CD only.
Magpie "The Thief" 2003 Mouverdre Grenache. Made from the free run juice of both varieties, before they got serious with the heavier pressings. Not at all my style really, too much sickly sweet red berry fruit. Maybe chilled and served on the verandah on a stinking hot day with an antipasto platter. Nah, I would take the Retro 55 from the same stable any day for that job. Others liked it however, but then Julie always was a lover of sweet grenache based juice.
Oh, and the best OZ PN I have had for under $150 pb at less than 1/6 that price. And no I ain't going to tell you what it was or even what state it came from as supplies are very tight and I wish to keep mine coming. As Ma Prem Shiela said, "A girl has to keep some secrets" Actually I lied, she really said "Tough Titties!"
2000 d'Arenberg The Coppermine Road Cabernet Sauvignon $AUD50
Had with a boneless leg of lamb for Easter. (Yum!)
Black fruit but not an intense nose. Some strong tannins which slowly let go after and hour in the glass. Nice blackberry and currants on the palate but a somewhat short finish. Not the best vintage from the McLaren Vale. An ok wine but far from great.
Had with a boneless leg of lamb for Easter. (Yum!)
Black fruit but not an intense nose. Some strong tannins which slowly let go after and hour in the glass. Nice blackberry and currants on the palate but a somewhat short finish. Not the best vintage from the McLaren Vale. An ok wine but far from great.
Had 3 out of the last 4 days off which has been great.
Spend Friday up at our vineyard Hoddles Creek plunging some of our 05 Pinot and the rest of the weekend chilling out. Here is some of the wines I have had:
Epis & Williams Cabernet Sauvignon 2000: I don't where this wine is going to go. Starting to show some green characterists which I find distracts from the wine. Quite herbal and lacking and up-front fruit.
Hoddles Creek Chardonnay 2004: bottled about 2 weeks ago and still quite closed. The nose is not giving much away but the palate is starting to open up. Probably more fruit driven at the moment compared to the 2003 and time will tell whether this will change. Quite lemonally with a pretty good acid backbone.
Coldstream Hills Reserve Pinot Noir 1997: at it's peak now, and drinking brilliantly. Heaps going on and is quite multi-layered and complex.
cheers
Anthony
Spend Friday up at our vineyard Hoddles Creek plunging some of our 05 Pinot and the rest of the weekend chilling out. Here is some of the wines I have had:
Epis & Williams Cabernet Sauvignon 2000: I don't where this wine is going to go. Starting to show some green characterists which I find distracts from the wine. Quite herbal and lacking and up-front fruit.
Hoddles Creek Chardonnay 2004: bottled about 2 weeks ago and still quite closed. The nose is not giving much away but the palate is starting to open up. Probably more fruit driven at the moment compared to the 2003 and time will tell whether this will change. Quite lemonally with a pretty good acid backbone.
Coldstream Hills Reserve Pinot Noir 1997: at it's peak now, and drinking brilliantly. Heaps going on and is quite multi-layered and complex.
cheers
Anthony
Good wine ruins the purse; bad wine ruins the stomach
Spanish saying
Spanish saying
1994 Penfolds Bin 389 Cabernet /Shiraz
Still dark thick red. Ill-distinguished, muddled nose - neither cab or shiraz . Four square palate and out of balance with drying hard tannins - more like a poorly -made barolo than an oz red. Pretty disappointing -no better after a couple of hours of opening though more open and minty on the nose. Average at best.
Cheers
Paul[/b]
Still dark thick red. Ill-distinguished, muddled nose - neither cab or shiraz . Four square palate and out of balance with drying hard tannins - more like a poorly -made barolo than an oz red. Pretty disappointing -no better after a couple of hours of opening though more open and minty on the nose. Average at best.
Cheers
Paul[/b]
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bacchaebabe
- Posts: 1222
- Joined: Fri Aug 15, 2003 5:04 pm
- Location: Sydney
Bit of a boozy easter so an AFD today.
Friday with a lot of seafood at a friend's apartment trying not to be blown away by the wind:
01 Seppelt Salinger
Loving this. Nice and honey and light and great with oysters with Tetsuya's Oyster sauce (how good is that stuff?)
An 04 NZ Savignon Blanc that I can't remember for the life of me
Truely NZ's gift to the world. So clean, so fresh and lovely passionfruit flavours that go down so easily on a hot (or not so hot as the case was) day. I think it was Stone something - the label. I know it's a $15ish wine but just can't remember.
04 Mesh riesling
More clean lime flavours. A great wine. I think this was the last of the six I was going to drink upfront and now have six left to cellar and see what happens over time. Got on very well with the prawns.
96 Taylors St Andrews Riesling
A lovely well developed riesling. Very toasty kero honey flavours. Much darker than the Mesh obviously. Can still go a few more years but is drinking quite nicely now. Complimented the Perch and scallops very well.
And now for the reds as the afternoon developed into a drinking session.
96 Penfolds 389
Quite a big wine still. Very dark red and still really a bit hard to get into. Thought I'd try this after all the 389 and 1996 vintage conversations of late but it really needs a few more years I think. Enjoyable now and we did decant it but only about half an hour prior. Still, it went quick enough.
96 Hardy's Tintara Shiraz
This is a bit more like it. Much more fruit coming through and right for drinking. Still very dark and no signs of fading really. Lots of licorice.
00 Wild Duck Creek Springflat Shiraz
Darker purple and much more youthful and alcoholic. Still quite fruity and in your face but nice to drink too. Can go a few more years but Ok to drink now.
Saturday night a 99 Capel Vale Chardonnay with my mum, a lamb roast and a DVD. Not sure why we were drinking a chardonnay with a lamb roast but I think it had something to do with my mum preferring whites and me having a god awful hangover. This is a bit tired but drinkable enough. A bit too butterscotchy really. Primary fruit all gone.
At a picnic yesterday with friends leaving our fair shores for the US.
02 Croser
A long time favourite with these friends. A very reliable sparkling wine indeed. Nice brioche and subtle honey and plenty of bubbles.
96 BVE Black Pepper shiraz
This is really singing. Nice dark red and no pepper on the nose or on the palate. Fruit has integrated nicely to become a very well structured wine. Just entered its drinking window and will go for a while yet I predict. Went particularly well with the plethora of cheeses we had.
95 Wirra Wirra Angelus Cab Sav
Very strong blackcurrent nose which was just divine. By this stage we had got to the chocolate (it is easter!) and this was a perfect match. We had two bars of lindt - the truffled one (can't remember exactly what it was called but it's got bits of crunchy stuff in it and is just divine). This was quite sweet in comparison to the 99% (yes, 99%) Cacao version. This is the most bitter and almost flat chocolate I've ever had. It is just pure cacao with no sweetness at all. This is hard core triple x chocolate and not one for the faint hearted. Coming back to the truffle one which orginally felt quite bitter but decadent, it was like a sweet lollie. The only thing that could cope with the bitterness of the chocolate was the wine and this was just magnificent. Obviously there was a lot of chocolate and mocha in the wine and this complimented the real chocolate perfectly as it was sweeter than the dark chocolates so really lifted them. After these chocolates we had a basic cadbury easter egg and if I can compare it to coffee - which is the only analogy I can think of - the truffle version was like a very, very good latte, the 99% was like a very strong short black and the cadbury's easter egg was like a nescafe blend 43. Very grainy, dull and flavorless. Not recommended (the cabury easter egg that is, the wine is definitely recommended and drinking at its peak)
No wine and no chocolate today.
Friday with a lot of seafood at a friend's apartment trying not to be blown away by the wind:
01 Seppelt Salinger
Loving this. Nice and honey and light and great with oysters with Tetsuya's Oyster sauce (how good is that stuff?)
An 04 NZ Savignon Blanc that I can't remember for the life of me
Truely NZ's gift to the world. So clean, so fresh and lovely passionfruit flavours that go down so easily on a hot (or not so hot as the case was) day. I think it was Stone something - the label. I know it's a $15ish wine but just can't remember.
04 Mesh riesling
More clean lime flavours. A great wine. I think this was the last of the six I was going to drink upfront and now have six left to cellar and see what happens over time. Got on very well with the prawns.
96 Taylors St Andrews Riesling
A lovely well developed riesling. Very toasty kero honey flavours. Much darker than the Mesh obviously. Can still go a few more years but is drinking quite nicely now. Complimented the Perch and scallops very well.
And now for the reds as the afternoon developed into a drinking session.
96 Penfolds 389
Quite a big wine still. Very dark red and still really a bit hard to get into. Thought I'd try this after all the 389 and 1996 vintage conversations of late but it really needs a few more years I think. Enjoyable now and we did decant it but only about half an hour prior. Still, it went quick enough.
96 Hardy's Tintara Shiraz
This is a bit more like it. Much more fruit coming through and right for drinking. Still very dark and no signs of fading really. Lots of licorice.
00 Wild Duck Creek Springflat Shiraz
Darker purple and much more youthful and alcoholic. Still quite fruity and in your face but nice to drink too. Can go a few more years but Ok to drink now.
Saturday night a 99 Capel Vale Chardonnay with my mum, a lamb roast and a DVD. Not sure why we were drinking a chardonnay with a lamb roast but I think it had something to do with my mum preferring whites and me having a god awful hangover. This is a bit tired but drinkable enough. A bit too butterscotchy really. Primary fruit all gone.
At a picnic yesterday with friends leaving our fair shores for the US.
02 Croser
A long time favourite with these friends. A very reliable sparkling wine indeed. Nice brioche and subtle honey and plenty of bubbles.
96 BVE Black Pepper shiraz
This is really singing. Nice dark red and no pepper on the nose or on the palate. Fruit has integrated nicely to become a very well structured wine. Just entered its drinking window and will go for a while yet I predict. Went particularly well with the plethora of cheeses we had.
95 Wirra Wirra Angelus Cab Sav
Very strong blackcurrent nose which was just divine. By this stage we had got to the chocolate (it is easter!) and this was a perfect match. We had two bars of lindt - the truffled one (can't remember exactly what it was called but it's got bits of crunchy stuff in it and is just divine). This was quite sweet in comparison to the 99% (yes, 99%) Cacao version. This is the most bitter and almost flat chocolate I've ever had. It is just pure cacao with no sweetness at all. This is hard core triple x chocolate and not one for the faint hearted. Coming back to the truffle one which orginally felt quite bitter but decadent, it was like a sweet lollie. The only thing that could cope with the bitterness of the chocolate was the wine and this was just magnificent. Obviously there was a lot of chocolate and mocha in the wine and this complimented the real chocolate perfectly as it was sweeter than the dark chocolates so really lifted them. After these chocolates we had a basic cadbury easter egg and if I can compare it to coffee - which is the only analogy I can think of - the truffle version was like a very, very good latte, the 99% was like a very strong short black and the cadbury's easter egg was like a nescafe blend 43. Very grainy, dull and flavorless. Not recommended (the cabury easter egg that is, the wine is definitely recommended and drinking at its peak)
No wine and no chocolate today.
Cheers,
Kris
There's a fine wine between pleasure and pain
(Stolen from the graffiti in the ladies loos at Pegasus Bay winery)
Kris
There's a fine wine between pleasure and pain
(Stolen from the graffiti in the ladies loos at Pegasus Bay winery)
Over the last week or so drinking was never better with a couple of specials for me and the family.
Dalwhinnie Shiraz 2001
Pulled the cork and let it sit for a couple of hours as per Attila's recommendation. The bouquet was blueberry, spice and perfumed, not overbearing but showed finesse. It literally exploded in the mouth with intense savoury flavours and long tannins. After about an hour it started to go dumb and had me perplexed, the colour was deep opaque, cork was fine it started out gangbusters so I began to worry. By the end of a long lunch it had found its way back, the initial mouthfilling explosion had disappeared and was replaced with richer flavours of black fruit and spice. The thing I like about Dalwhinnie is its distinct flavours and individuality. Highly Recommended.
All Saints Grand Tokay
What a way to finish off the weekend, toffee, raisins, rich dark fruit cake soaked in brandy, all this and more but enough has been said about this wine before so I won't go on, suffice to say it went very well with chocolate cake. When will Rutherglen fortifieds be registered by the Australian National Trust, we don't realise how lucky we are to be able to afford the incredible quality that comes out of this region. Superb
Colin
Dalwhinnie Shiraz 2001
Pulled the cork and let it sit for a couple of hours as per Attila's recommendation. The bouquet was blueberry, spice and perfumed, not overbearing but showed finesse. It literally exploded in the mouth with intense savoury flavours and long tannins. After about an hour it started to go dumb and had me perplexed, the colour was deep opaque, cork was fine it started out gangbusters so I began to worry. By the end of a long lunch it had found its way back, the initial mouthfilling explosion had disappeared and was replaced with richer flavours of black fruit and spice. The thing I like about Dalwhinnie is its distinct flavours and individuality. Highly Recommended.
All Saints Grand Tokay
What a way to finish off the weekend, toffee, raisins, rich dark fruit cake soaked in brandy, all this and more but enough has been said about this wine before so I won't go on, suffice to say it went very well with chocolate cake. When will Rutherglen fortifieds be registered by the Australian National Trust, we don't realise how lucky we are to be able to afford the incredible quality that comes out of this region. Superb
Colin
Let us have wine and women, mirth and laughter. Sermons and soda water the day after.
Kris,
I agree on the quality of the '96 BVE Black Pepper and how big the 389 is as I had both last weekend. Don't be missled by the "Black Pepper" label as it was never meant to reflect any pepper in it (although I can't remember why they chose that monicer).
Wines I had this weekend were:
'99 Heggies Eden Valley Riesling. Stunning wine, yet showing more development than expected for a screwcap.
'00 Mouton Cadet. Good early drinking style Bordeaux, but lacked personality.
'99 Giaconda Pinot.
Jeepers, for the amount of flack the Pinot gets from some people I was suprised how enjoyable it was. Took a good hour to really open up & sing too.
'01 HPR Pinot Noir. From Hugh Robinson on the Mornington Peninsula, a hard to find label that was excellent and a cut above most other Peninsula Pinot.
'00 Ata Rangi Pinot. Corked, bugger!
'87 John Riddoch. I believe this to be a poor vinatge? Bloody good wine!
Rory
I agree on the quality of the '96 BVE Black Pepper and how big the 389 is as I had both last weekend. Don't be missled by the "Black Pepper" label as it was never meant to reflect any pepper in it (although I can't remember why they chose that monicer).
Wines I had this weekend were:
'99 Heggies Eden Valley Riesling. Stunning wine, yet showing more development than expected for a screwcap.
'00 Mouton Cadet. Good early drinking style Bordeaux, but lacked personality.
'99 Giaconda Pinot.
Jeepers, for the amount of flack the Pinot gets from some people I was suprised how enjoyable it was. Took a good hour to really open up & sing too.
'01 HPR Pinot Noir. From Hugh Robinson on the Mornington Peninsula, a hard to find label that was excellent and a cut above most other Peninsula Pinot.
'00 Ata Rangi Pinot. Corked, bugger!
'87 John Riddoch. I believe this to be a poor vinatge? Bloody good wine!
Rory
-
Daryl Douglas
- Posts: 1361
- Joined: Fri Sep 05, 2003 7:23 pm
- Location: Nth Qld
bacchaebabe wrote:An 04 NZ Savignon Blanc that I can't remember for the life of me
Truely NZ's gift to the world. So clean, so fresh and lovely passionfruit flavours that go down so easily on a hot (or not so hot as the case was) day. I think it was Stone something - the label. I know it's a $15ish wine but just can't remember.
That'd be a Stoneleigh Marlborough Sauv Blanc. Have been a fan of this wine since discovering the 2002 vintage and have seen retail prices varying from $13 (on special at Dan's in Mackay Qld) to $18 at other outlets. The local barn (recently airconditioned
) has it for $16-17 and it's been on my favourite local Thai restaurant's (Qld's best asian restaurant 2004) wine list for $22-$23 for at least a couple of years. Goes well with the Thai food so have had it on each of the several occasions per year that I've been there (over the last few years). Very good qpr wine.
daz
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bacchaebabe
- Posts: 1222
- Joined: Fri Aug 15, 2003 5:04 pm
- Location: Sydney
Hi all,
This is my second post.
Some friends came over a couple of days ago and brought with them an '84 Grange and an '86 (I think) Campbells Bobbie Burn. We started with one of our favourite Pinot Grigios, Fattori e Graney and finished with a T'Gallant Moscato.
The deal was they brought the Grange if we served truffles, which I managed to source through a friend's hubby - he regularly gets them from Tassie in the winter, but managed to get some in fresh from France. I managed to secure about 40 gms.
First course was a sniff of the jar in which I had held the truffle overnight with some eggs. Second, scrambled eggs (that had been kept with the truffle overnight). Served with the Pinot Grigio.
Third was pasta with a cream, white wine, porcini, parsley, egg (left overs from the truffle) and shaved truffle - More of the Pinot.
Fourth: green beans and sliced steamed kipfler potatoes on a smear of garlic, with wagyu beef (one minute a side) that I had marinated in rice wine, shaved truffles and Murray River salt flakes - Served with the Grange and then the Bobbie Burn.
We served the wine in Reidel glasses. We only have 2 red and 4 white wine glasses from the range - but even the Reidel white wine glasses are better for red than the Woolworth specials which were the alternative. Our guests were given the red wine glasses for the Grange but we exchanged briefly to see whether the glasses could make a difference at this level. Did they ever! In the white wine glasses the Grange was an exceptional drop, full flavoured and complex (apologies as I don't have the words for this) and, if I didn't then try the red wine glasses, would have sworn it was the best wine I had ever had (except possibly for an ancient Chateau Lafite Rothschild that I exchanged for 3 tickets to Expo in the late '80s - that's another story). But on trying the Grange in the Reidel red wine glasses - what an absolute pleasure! It was smoother, and ever so slightly less acidic (only detectable to me in a such a direct comparison) - the French plonk, which I think now retails about twice the Grange, has been eclipsed!
The Bobbie Burn was fab too, but not in the same league. The fruit appeared to dominate. Not as complex nor as subtle as the Grange, but this was probably to be expected.
Hope that was not too long winded. Great night was had by all - probably the best ever. The whole experience has rekindled my interest in buying and keeping wine. Hence my joining Auswine.
Oh... almost forgot, peaches and home made panna cotta with the Moscato for desert.
Other wines during the week included Tamar Ridge Reisling, Sauvignon Blanc and Pinot Noir, Henschke Henry Seven (which I think is a blend of Cabernet, Grenache and Viognier) and a Fire Block Shiraz - this is more our usual fare.
Regards,
Allan
This is my second post.
Some friends came over a couple of days ago and brought with them an '84 Grange and an '86 (I think) Campbells Bobbie Burn. We started with one of our favourite Pinot Grigios, Fattori e Graney and finished with a T'Gallant Moscato.
The deal was they brought the Grange if we served truffles, which I managed to source through a friend's hubby - he regularly gets them from Tassie in the winter, but managed to get some in fresh from France. I managed to secure about 40 gms.
First course was a sniff of the jar in which I had held the truffle overnight with some eggs. Second, scrambled eggs (that had been kept with the truffle overnight). Served with the Pinot Grigio.
Third was pasta with a cream, white wine, porcini, parsley, egg (left overs from the truffle) and shaved truffle - More of the Pinot.
Fourth: green beans and sliced steamed kipfler potatoes on a smear of garlic, with wagyu beef (one minute a side) that I had marinated in rice wine, shaved truffles and Murray River salt flakes - Served with the Grange and then the Bobbie Burn.
We served the wine in Reidel glasses. We only have 2 red and 4 white wine glasses from the range - but even the Reidel white wine glasses are better for red than the Woolworth specials which were the alternative. Our guests were given the red wine glasses for the Grange but we exchanged briefly to see whether the glasses could make a difference at this level. Did they ever! In the white wine glasses the Grange was an exceptional drop, full flavoured and complex (apologies as I don't have the words for this) and, if I didn't then try the red wine glasses, would have sworn it was the best wine I had ever had (except possibly for an ancient Chateau Lafite Rothschild that I exchanged for 3 tickets to Expo in the late '80s - that's another story). But on trying the Grange in the Reidel red wine glasses - what an absolute pleasure! It was smoother, and ever so slightly less acidic (only detectable to me in a such a direct comparison) - the French plonk, which I think now retails about twice the Grange, has been eclipsed!
The Bobbie Burn was fab too, but not in the same league. The fruit appeared to dominate. Not as complex nor as subtle as the Grange, but this was probably to be expected.
Hope that was not too long winded. Great night was had by all - probably the best ever. The whole experience has rekindled my interest in buying and keeping wine. Hence my joining Auswine.
Oh... almost forgot, peaches and home made panna cotta with the Moscato for desert.
Other wines during the week included Tamar Ridge Reisling, Sauvignon Blanc and Pinot Noir, Henschke Henry Seven (which I think is a blend of Cabernet, Grenache and Viognier) and a Fire Block Shiraz - this is more our usual fare.
Regards,
Allan
Last edited by bigkid on Mon Apr 04, 2005 8:42 pm, edited 2 times in total.
Thanks Elvino. Unfortunately this is not the regular occurrence I would like it to be at our place. Truffles are usually a once year thing for us - I can't justify that kind of expense. The Grange was all the tempting I needed. This was a particularly big night and absolutely worth it. Thoroughly enjoyed it.
All the best.
Allan
All the best.
Allan
Over the weekend,
Tatachilla Foundation Shiraz 2000 - Lovely wine great balance and drinking really nicely though no hurry to drink now.
Leasingham Classic Clare Shiraz 1997 - Always been a fan of their wines and this was no exception, classic leasingham shiraz drinking beautifully. Do agree with TORB that thier style has somewhat changed over the last few releases ( re. 2002 bin 61 ) to a more drink now style. Lets hope they dont do this with the Classic Clare range also although I wouldn't know as have not tasted any more recent than the 98's. So many wines, so little coin
Kingston Estate Echelon Shiraz 2001 - Nice wine that appears to be somewhat fading since last tried a year ago. Still drinking it was far from unpleasant and was a great match with the Spag Bol.
Tatachilla Foundation Shiraz 2000 - Lovely wine great balance and drinking really nicely though no hurry to drink now.
Leasingham Classic Clare Shiraz 1997 - Always been a fan of their wines and this was no exception, classic leasingham shiraz drinking beautifully. Do agree with TORB that thier style has somewhat changed over the last few releases ( re. 2002 bin 61 ) to a more drink now style. Lets hope they dont do this with the Classic Clare range also although I wouldn't know as have not tasted any more recent than the 98's. So many wines, so little coin
Kingston Estate Echelon Shiraz 2001 - Nice wine that appears to be somewhat fading since last tried a year ago. Still drinking it was far from unpleasant and was a great match with the Spag Bol.
St Peters 99 and Blackjack 01
No tasting notes, just impressions:
St Peters - Didn't have a decanter, so poured them into Riedels an hour beforehand. The balance, complexity and long finish of this wine impressed me greatly - could've drunk this all night long if I had more bottles!
Blackjack - Enjoyed this, nice fruit which methinks needs more time to surface. Overshadowed by the quality of St Peters.
St Peters - Didn't have a decanter, so poured them into Riedels an hour beforehand. The balance, complexity and long finish of this wine impressed me greatly - could've drunk this all night long if I had more bottles!
Blackjack - Enjoyed this, nice fruit which methinks needs more time to surface. Overshadowed by the quality of St Peters.
98 Seppelt Reserve Great Western Shiraz
I enjoyed this. Had me thinking how it will age, probably has 5 years.
97 Reynell Shiraz
Old fashioned wine. Oak needs to mellow, and I think the fruit will hold while this happens.
02 Peter Lehmann Semillon
Great quaffer.
97 Garden Gully Sparkling Shiraz
Beautiful wine, balanced and not too sweet. A real surprise.
95 Majella Sparkling Shiraz
A bit too savoury for me.
97 Crofters Cabernet Merlot
Too much cedary oak. It overpowered the fruit, and I could not finish the glass.
01 Ballast Stone Shiraz
A simply, well made wine with everything in balance.
96 Edwards and Chaffey Cabernet
Not a bad wine, pretty boring, and not very variatal, but acceptable.
97 Edwards and Chaffey Shiraz
Initially opened up with a great nose, but the oak quickly took over, and the palate was flooded with oak, and was too much for me.
98 Normans Old Vine Shiraz
Had 2 bottles, both were horrible. Over oaked, no fruit, yuk.
98 St Huberts Cabernet
One of the few Yarra reds in my cellar. It was quite good, and needs a bit more time.
91 Lindemans Limestone Ridge
An aged Coonawarra, which was still very sound, but a bit old and boring for me.
I enjoyed this. Had me thinking how it will age, probably has 5 years.
97 Reynell Shiraz
Old fashioned wine. Oak needs to mellow, and I think the fruit will hold while this happens.
02 Peter Lehmann Semillon
Great quaffer.
97 Garden Gully Sparkling Shiraz
Beautiful wine, balanced and not too sweet. A real surprise.
95 Majella Sparkling Shiraz
A bit too savoury for me.
97 Crofters Cabernet Merlot
Too much cedary oak. It overpowered the fruit, and I could not finish the glass.
01 Ballast Stone Shiraz
A simply, well made wine with everything in balance.
96 Edwards and Chaffey Cabernet
Not a bad wine, pretty boring, and not very variatal, but acceptable.
97 Edwards and Chaffey Shiraz
Initially opened up with a great nose, but the oak quickly took over, and the palate was flooded with oak, and was too much for me.
98 Normans Old Vine Shiraz
Had 2 bottles, both were horrible. Over oaked, no fruit, yuk.
98 St Huberts Cabernet
One of the few Yarra reds in my cellar. It was quite good, and needs a bit more time.
91 Lindemans Limestone Ridge
An aged Coonawarra, which was still very sound, but a bit old and boring for me.