Forum Future

[Gavin Trott]

Hello All

I have now run the auswine forum for as long as I can remember, since before I even started in business, so certainly 20 – 25 years, probably more. Its actually one of the ‘older’ original web sites on the WWW I reckon?!?!

Its always been free, so everything at my expense, in $ terms, and in time terms.

I’ve certainly ‘met’ some interesting characters along the way, and had my share of needing to ‘moderate’, as some people, on forums seem not to be able to discuss and debate, and have someone disagree with them, without it seeming to become personal.

This seems to be happening again, and, well, I’m just a bit tired I reckon.

So, I’ve decided that that is enough for me, ready to retire from it.

If anyone is interested to take it over, please think about it, and let me know and I can help with moving the forum, passing you the domaine perhaps, and a bit about how its run (or not, if you don’t need any help! :--)

Alternatively, if no one is interested in taking it over, then I think I’ll just close it, and move on.

Let me know what you think?

[RobK]

Hey Gavin,

I did post this elsewhere but not everyone might find that, so I'll post it here. Thanks for the heads up. I have run a few forums in my time and I can't say that it has ever been that much fun. One of those forums is still going and costs the owners a fair bit to run. I gave one away when solicitors started jumping all over it threatening legal action (defamation) and is one of the reasons I ended up studying law. Half the people in that forum couldn't grasp the concept of defamation nor on forum rules and just getting on. Another forum just ended up wilting as new forms of social contact sprang up. Facebook has killed this sort of forum and I prefer it more than the new style. I'm a member of a Qantas crew forum and I enjoy catching up but the dramas are overflowing all the time. Breach of copyright, defamation and I'm over it.

You've done a great job and if someone sticks their head up, it would be great. If not, you've done a great job and I thank you for your efforts.

All the best

Rob

[Hacker]

I published this post on another thread but feel strongly about it so it is here too.

Hi Gavin, I totally understand but am extremely saddened as this forum means soo much to me, especially over the last couple of years with COVID meaning we couldn’t be social face to face. This forum to a large extent helped fill the gap. I don’t know the answer but I hope there will be one as this is the ONLY wine forum that has no agenda. And it is free.

Gavin, you have been a generous host, offering great wines at great prices. I am truely in your debt. Thank you, most sincerely.

[Mahmoud Ali]

Also from the other thread:

Similar emotions/thoughts - I've ridden the wave of previous flare-ups and never really gave them much mind. 20 years of TNs and banter will be a real shame to lose. Perhaps announce as a new thread as "Wax Seals over Corks" is not the most visible thread. Thankyou for your efforts over the years - I must have joined early 2000 or thereabouts with a long hiatus, but the notes in between have been very educational. Indeed yours must have been one of if not the first. Winestar was there for a bit but I enjoyed coming back to this forum when I rediscovered my enjoyment of wine.

I agree that it would indeed be a shame to lose all the valuable information, opinions, and tasting notes.

At this point it would be remiss on my part not to admit to being partly responsible for some of the "flare-ups". Usually it would involve me expressing something in an awkward or cavalier way and someone or another would get upset. Try as I might to explain or re-frame my position, it seemed, at least to me, that the other person would never let up and often used invective (I've been called a thief and a cheapskate!). I probably should not have continued with the discussion and for that I apologize but it is often difficult to remain silent when one's words or argument is twisted or misread. Often I felt there was a visceral element coming from the other side and I very much tried to remain level headed and dispassionate in replies, though not always of course.

If it helps you in changing your mind Gavin, in the interests of other forum members, and to help keep this very valuable forum alive and well, I can offer to not post or reply anymore.

Thanks for all the years of service to an appreciative wine loving community.

Cheers .......................... Mahmoud.

PS: Kenzo, a long time ago I stumbled on another wine forum (I can't remember if it was Winestar or something else) and joined in order to make a comment on something, I can't recall what, but it wasn't long before I was called a Callingwood supporter. Being Canadian I had to look it up before I could respond. The funny thing is that the person who accused me of it had the audacity to say that he wasn't aware of it having any pejorative meaning. Oddly enough he was called Jamie. Anyway, I stopped going there. It is partly with you in mind that I am happy to make my offer to Gavin.

[Scotty vino]

Be a massive shame to lose the AUS wine forum. Ive learned so much on here and I'm really appreciative to all the contributors. We've had wine makers and respected critics poke their heads in from time to time which goes to show where it's at.

The positives massively out number the negatives from my perspective. Despite some of the wet lettuce fighting/disagreements. Which really don't bother me at all. There's this thing called a scroll function.

I would happily pay an annual subscription fee to keep it active. For some of the us the amount of use we get out of it it would be a small price to pay IMO. That, or I'm happy to grab 6'er of wine off you Gav to keep the ball rolling. What do you have a bit much of? I'll grab some!

[phillisc]

Be a massive shame to lose the AUS wine forum. Ive learned so much on here and I'm really appreciative to all the contributors. We've had wine makers and respected critics poke their heads in from time to time which goes to show where it's at.

The positives massively out number the negatives from my perspective. Despite some of the wet lettuce fighting/disagreements. Which really don't bother me at all. There's this thing called a scroll function.

I would happily pay an annual subscription fee to keep it active. For some of the us the amount of use we get out of it it would be a small price to pay IMO. That, or I'm happy to grab 6'er of wine off you Gav to keep the ball rolling. What do you have a bit much of? I'll grab some!

Ha ha ha ha ha
Wet lettuces, good one that Scotty Vino...I'd go so far as to say for someone...add a generous serve of narcissistic mayo.
Yep the debates or whatever they are called, amuse me no end...the trite remarks less so.

Thanks Gavin for all you have done. Have just purchased some Adelina Shiraz Mataro from the Australian Wine Centre, will be a good comparison with Wendouree (vineyards are next door to each other). Have also picked up some of their 2021 Rieslings. Sorry that I haven't brought more

Nice to have met 2-3 people here in SA, and sincerely appreciated the inputs from Hacker, Graeme G, Tigger K, Sam, Sean and apologies to others that I have overlooked. Thanks Roger Pike, time spent with you was both generous and enjoyable.

Have a good festive season everyone, I know I will, dodged a cancer bullet for now, new job is great, children that are doing great things, and about 350-360 dozen wines to knock off...what's not to love.

mjs hope to see you in Coonawarra at some stage.

Cheers and whatever the outcome Gavin, thanks. I've finally found now, its good to reload, review, reset. All the best for your future endeavours.
Craig

[JamieBahrain]

It’s been a superb forum Gavin. So many people you have never met would be very grateful of the information and connections they received here. I’ve met so many people on this forum that are making great strides in the wine industry, most who lurked or posted infrequently. Some of the original characters who posted here moved on to lauded roles as wine journalists and authors. Their talents were always stand-out though it’s amusing they rubbed shoulders with many of us amateurs here.

I hope many on the forum got as much out of the connections made here as I. Visibly in off-lines, some of participants seem quite regular. I loved the Adelaide offlines. Never understood why they didn’t persist though I know they’ve splintered into some regular get togethers. Very generous events, funny too, I remember one at the twilight of the Robert Parker era where a local SA producer’s wine undrinkable. We were all gagging- a 99 pointer! Alas, we knew the Parker-era was done and you asked us not to mention the Frankenstein of a Shiraz on the forum.

I was recruited from auswine for international tasting groups and then did similar. Some of the folks I got involved in our tasting groups so talented they are heading up professional wine societies worldwide. Many too, just wine lovers posting here, made the game their profession.

I’m sorry you have been dragged into any riffs on the forum and that’s the reason you are done. Why would you even be involved? If people take themselves that seriously to bother you, I could imagine the frustration. I actually think the ignore function should have been promulgated so you can choose to endure sermon and political agenda or you can choose not.

Sorry if an eulogy but the most important point I hoped to make was you have been a terrific service to wine lovers.

[Mike Hawkins]

Sad news indeed… and thanks Gavin for the financial, time and other resources you’ve poured into this. I will definitely miss this as part of my day. Heck, with the extra time I might have to sign up to Facebook (actually that will never happen).

[mychurch]

Gavin

I think I have been a member since 2000 and will miss this if it goes. No doubt its a thankless task with lots of hassle for you both in terms of time and money. Some other sites take contributions, if its just a matter of money, and I'm sure some of us would happily buy an Auswine Members Case via the main site, if that will help. Time though is the hardest thing to loose as you get older and I can understand if you dont have enough any more

[Raymo]

I'll be brief:

1. Firstly, thanks, Gavin, for a fantastic forum that has entertained and informed me for so very long

2. Everything has an end, and with each passing year I am increasingly aware that that applies to people to. It was my birthday this week and already this year I've lost a father, a brother and two aunts.

3. New forums have risen to prominence elsewhere (e.g. Winefront) and it's obvious that there has been a drift away to those multi-faceted venues (combined reviews, forum-type discussions, special articles etc.).

4. As Kenny Rogers sang: know when to hold 'em, know when to fold 'em.

My sincere and grateful thanks for all you have made possible for us by allowing us to access this forum over the years, and best wishes for the future.

Close curtain. Lights up. Mind the step on the way out.

[phillisc]

Raymo, sorry to hear of your dad, very upsetting.
Its been 13 years since my father died, he was largely responsible to introducing me to some fabulous old wines in the early 80s...very few days go by when he is not in my thoughts.
I am sure you will have a quiet moment or two of reflection, particularly at this time of year.

Cheers Craig

[GraemeG]

Will certainly be a shame to see it go.
Does seem a pity that a wine-producing country of 25m can't apparently sustain an active and lively 'wine-place' on-line, but I get that times are a-changin', and that things which were topical twenty years ago might look a bit quaint to those coming later.
Hard to picture a wine community working on snapchat or instagram though!
Vale Auswine Forum.

[Sean]

deleted

[marsalla]

HI Gavin,

Thanks for running this forum over the years. I have never really posted much, but enjoyed others insights. I initially came to this forum when I was living in Italy, with four kids at home, now back in Australia with the last leaving school this year.

Cant really see the point in arguing over the internet with someone who disagrees with you , but there you go.
I never really got around to getting to an offline, maybe one day,

All the best
Sean

[ticklenow1]

I will also be very sad to see the end of this wonderful forum. I have learned so much off the many posters on here with much better palettes and much more knowledge than me. I only started my wine journey in 2002 and have enjoyed the places it has taken me and the people I've met. I have very much appreciated the fact that Gavin has run the forum and provided us wine lovers with a place to gain knowledge, post our experiences, enjoy the banter and read about wine in general.

But probably the thing I've enjoyed the most about the Auswine Forum, is the wonderful people I have met. From offlines, to seeing others in tasting rooms, catching up for meals or having a game of golf, it's been great to meet new people with an interest in wine. Thanks to all the generous posters on here, as without participation, the forum just doesn't work.

The Brisbane forumites are a dedicated bunch of wine heads and it's always great to catch up with them. Hopefully we can keep the group going. The friendships formed are something that wouldn't have come about without this forum. So for that, I am forever grateful to Gavin.

I wish you all the best Gavin and thanks for spending the time, money, and most of all, effort, in giving us a place to talk wine. It would be fantastic if someone was to take over the forum and keep it running, but by the sounds of it, it's a massive undertaking. Maybe a small fee to cover costs could convince someone with the time to take up the cause?

Cheers
Ian

[Red Bigot]

Anyone seriously considering taking over the running here probably already knows it's not the expense, it's the time it takes to do it properly.

Direct hosting costs should be less than $500/year, could be covered by setting up a donation facility rather than subscriptions.

I don't know how much time Gavin spends on moderation, member management, maintenance etc., probably not a huge amount in actual hours, but difficult to find when you have a business to run as well and you have to do it pretty much every day. Moderation action can be tiresome, but I thought it was a lot less work since Ric (TORB) and I moved on to our own things.

It's a great retirement hobby waiting for someone to jump at.

[Davo]

Hi Gavin, I stopped visiting forums back in 2010 (just checked for accuracy) for a couple of reasons. I got sick of the BS here but mainly that other forum, now defunct, and I thought it inappropriate to keep posting as I was now also representing a couple of wineries and didn't wish to be like others who were pushing their barrows at someone else's expense.

I did miss the good bits, info about new wines/wineries, the occasional offline tasting, and the good folk I did meet in person and have maintained friendships with over the years.

Even though I no longer visit it will be a strange feeling knowing you are no longer around. The forum I am sure will be missed.

All the best whatever you decide.

[mjs]

Gavin,

Really appreciate all of your work on Auswine Forum over the years. I've been involved since the early 2000's IIRC. The people and the conversations have been terrific. OK, there has been a bit of on-line differences from time to time, unfortunately it seems par for the course that society seems to be heading down these days. Overall though, I think Auswine hasn't been too bad in that respect. If you want a really aggressive and dysfunctional forum, I would point you to aushifi, of which i was a member for many years but it just completely degenerated into an aggressive, lack of respect cesspit.

I remember some fabulous off-lines in Melbourne in the late 2000's and I even managed to get to a few in Sydney in 2013/14 when I was working there on a weekly basis. Lots of fun and an opportunity to meet similarly mad wine enthusiasts as well as those who were perhaps just starting the journey. There was also a great burgundy group spun out of Auswine in Melbourne a few years ago. Clearly Covid has severely curtailed such activities in the last couple of years, unfortunately. I have been back in Adelaide for a year now (where the hell did those twelve months go?), so I look forward to some off-line or other wine activities here as well.

I have been on three Oz based wine forums over the years, one ceased some years ago, now sadly Auswine, thanks again Gavin, I just hope that Brian continues to enjoy his retirement hobby!

Cheers to all forum members and best wishes for a safe festive season.
Malcolm

[JDSJDS]

I am based in British Columbia, Canada, but used to visit Australia fairly regularly back in the day. My wife and I had many great trips, including of course many visits to wine regions and wineries. Coonawarra, Barossa, McLaren Vale, Clare, Mornington, Hunter Valley, Yarra, Rutherglen, Goulburn and Grampians all come to mind. I checked my profile and see I joined the forum in January 2005 (almost 17 years ago!!) to get insider advice as to what wineries and wines to try when I was visiting or buying here in BC. I did manage to attend one Adelaide offline 12 or 15 years ago and had great fun doing so.

Many thanks to Gavin for keeping this forum going for so long. I don't post much now but have learned a lot through the forum over the years. It will be a shame to lose such a resource, more so for the 'local' participants I would imagine. Where else will I be able to keep track of the annual Wendoree multicoloured mailouts and Rockford release discussions?!? They were great, funny annual traditions. I hope someone else decides to keep it going, or Gavin changes his mind, but no doubt it would take up a fair bit of time for whoever moderates.

Thanks to all for everyone's participation in this forum over these many years!

[Rossco]

Very sad day when a great forum is closed by the actions
of a selfish few. I thank you Gavin for keeping it going as long as you could, and hope that someone is able to take over.

I have met all my offline wine guys from this forum, and you have truly enabled me to form friendships, and experience wines one can only dream about.

Such a shame future wine enthusiasts won't get to experience what I (and all of us) have come to love and cherish about the joys of wine & discussions with like minded individuals.

Thank you Gavin for everything

[Red Bigot]

Very sad day when a great forum is closed by the actions of a selfish few. I thank you Gavin for keeping it going as long as you could, and hope that someone is able to take over.

I haven't visited here enough in recent years to see the effect of these "selfish few", so don't know the extent of the hassles involved. However a couple of comments:

1. As some/many of you know, I've been running a wine forum for 11 years now, it's mostly only available to paid subscribers. This seems to have the effect of attracting members who place higher value on their membership and respect for others and they play nicely pretty much all the time. Although I spend a very large amount of hours on my forum (I'm retired), almost none of it involves "moderation" per se and although I very occasionally delete posts or lock a thread, I've only had to mention the option of membership cancellation twice in 11 years.

2. If this forum continues without the formal association with Auswine as a wine merchant, the new "owner" should consider the changes that could or should happen as it becomes Ok to mention where buys were made and where good offers of desirable wines are available. Indeed at one extreme it could include advertising for wine and wine-related products. This may attract new members, including maybe some from the Australian Frequent Flyer Forum Wine section, which is free (with advertising) but suffers in format due to being a small part of a larger Forum, The Wine Front subscribers and some from mine (some are already dual members). Opportunities for expansion of the membership diversity here, but potentially more time required to manage and moderate.

Such a shame future wine enthusiasts won't get to experience what I (and all of us) have come to love and cherish about the joys of wine & discussions with like minded individuals.

Maybe a bit dramatic, it's not the end of the world, there are other avenues and someone may yet take over the running here. Surely there must be someone among 1600+ members who would be capable and want to do that?

[Mahmoud Ali]

There are plenty of adjectives that might have been used but selfish is probably not the correct one. Just saying.

[sjw_11]

Hi all,
I am sad to see everyone being so fatalistic about the future of the forum ... I don't think it is dead quite yet.
(and I think most of the time we all play nice, with just the occasional "handbags at dawn")

Well just to let you all know, I have been talking with Gavin and I have set up a new hosting package. We will look to transfer the site and see how that goes. It may take a little time to work out the technical details and possibly upgrade the software etc, so bear with us if there are any problems in the process!

Best,
Sam

[RobK]

Hi all,
I am sad to see everyone being so fatalistic about the future of the forum ... I don't think it is dead quite yet.
(and I think most of the time we all play nice, with just the occasional "handbags at dawn")

Well just to let you all know, I have been talking with Gavin and I have set up a new hosting package. We will look to transfer the site and see how that goes. It may take a little time to work out the technical details and possibly upgrade the software etc, so bear with us if there are any problems in the process!

Best,
Sam

Good work. All the best with it.

Rob

[brodie]

Hi all,
Well just to let you all know, I have been talking with Gavin and I have set up a new hosting package. We will look to transfer the site and see how that goes. It may take a little time to work out the technical details and possibly upgrade the software etc, so bear with us if there are any problems in the process!

Best,
Sam

Thanks Sam, let us know how we can help

Brodie

[Alan Foo]

Postby sjw_11 » Tue Dec 07, 2021 6:49 pm

Well just to let you all know, I have been talking with Gavin and I have set up a new hosting package. We will look to transfer the site and see how that goes. It may take a little time to work out the technical details and possibly upgrade the software etc, so bear with us if there are any problems in the process!

Best,
Sam

Wow! good on you Sam. We will look forward to coming back here again and thank you.

[Scotty vino]

Hi all,
I am sad to see everyone being so fatalistic about the future of the forum ... I don't think it is dead quite yet.
(and I think most of the time we all play nice, with just the occasional "handbags at dawn")

Well just to let you all know, I have been talking with Gavin and I have set up a new hosting package. We will look to transfer the site and see how that goes. It may take a little time to work out the technical details and possibly upgrade the software etc, so bear with us if there are any problems in the process!

Best,
Sam

Top effort Sam. Hope you can keep it going.

[mychurch]

Great news Sam

[via collins]

Nice phoenixing Sam!

Kudos.

[Mike Hawkins]

Thanks Sam!