Varietal slang and contractions

[Waiters Friend]

G'day

Without being a total wine wanker, I am finding some contractions of varietal (and other wine) terms a little irritating. Not much, but enough to prompt this discussion. I even hear wine makers use some of these - they're no doubt convenient, and save wear and tear on the oral equipment (and perhaps the brain). For example:

Rizza (= riesling). This sounds so "ocker than thou" and should be a regular at a footy match, if ockers drank wine instead of beer. I can hear the cry from the stands now (well, pre-COVID), "You bloody rizza!".

Chardy (= chardonnay). The Kath and Kim parody of Kardy was only slightly worse.

Savvy (frequently followed by "blonk"). Savvy is in the Oxford English dictionary, but not as a grape variety. Is "Sem Sav" half a one?

Cab Sav (= cabernet sauvignon). They can't even spell the contraction correctly. Admittedly, this is again easier on the laughing gear (2 syllables instead of 6) and maybe exponents of this consider it a labour saving device. But say this noble name with a broad ocker accent - yes, you're cringing now.

Are there any others that annoy you? Or are you quite OK with these adulterations of the Queen's French?

Cheers
Allan

PS: Where did the term "plonk" come from to refer to wine? Plonk is a sound you hear in the WC

[JamieBahrain]

"Plonk" has been used for a long time.

I'm not a fan of "Rizza" but each to their own dude.

[kaos]

You probably don't even like Spazza Mazza Nazza for spaghetti marinara!!

[TiggerK]

Call yourself an Australian Allan? Surely it's the classic Australian language claim to fame that it finds ways to shorten anything to fewer syllables?? Language is an ever changing thing. With all due respect for my elders (but not by much ), I suggest more wine, more drums, more testosterone and less grumpy old man!!

Insert 'Old Man Yells at Clouds' meme picture....

but yeah agree on plonk. And do find 'a nice drop' mildly generic.

[phillisc]

Allan, guilty as charged on Rizza. I do find it slightly annoying when I hear a glass of fizz or bubbles...it's either Champagne or Sparkling.
Cheers Craig

[Mahmoud Ali]

I suppose much depends on early exposure to wine slang. I'm quite comfortable with the the abbreviation of Cabernet (both of them) and Sauvignon Blanc, and don't mind the terms such as luncheon claret, plonk, and industrial swill. Rizza and Chardy just doesn't do it for me and I don't use it. Then again, I'm not Australian.

PS: Where did the term "plonk" come from to refer to wine? Plonk is a sound you hear in the WC

I looked it up and it seems there is an Australian connection. According to Wikipedia:

"Plonk is a non-specific and derogatory term used primarily in British and Australian English for cheap, low-quality wine. It is believed to come from Australian slang, in reference to blanc (the French word for "white"), before it became naturalised in Britain. Despite the reference to the colour white, the term is not limited to white wine, and can as easily indicate a red wine or rosé. In this context, the phrase has even spawned the title of a novel which evokes the perceived tackiness of the 1980s.

In Australia, plonk packaged and sold in a cask or simply in a bag is commonly called "goon".

While not commonly used, the term has also been adopted in other Commonwealth countries such as Canada."

I have not heard the term used here but in any case I flat out refuse to use the word goon.

Cheers ................... Mahmoud.

[sjw_11]

Goon of fortune ...

[Ian S]

Rizza always sounds too much like Rizla for my liking, though frankly I don't like it pronounced in full when the s becomes a z!

Chard or Chardy? Not too fussed, especially when a trashy TV series had a character called Chardonnay, so I rather took to the abbreviation as something to take my mind off such tosh.

Cab Sav - guilty as charged. I can empathise with the criticisms, but it's short and clear

I'm also reasonably comfortable with the well-known acronyms of SSB, GSM, etc. used to denote blends

Neb for nebbiolo? I wouldn't abbreviate like that myself, but wouldn't mind others doing it. I do abbreviate Burgundy down to Burg though and Bordeaux to Bdx, plus Beaujolais to Bojo (though will probably stop using it as it's sometimes used as an abbreviation for the buffoon)

My worst offence is probably C9dP, but it's just so convenient

[Chuck]

Can cope with most except Cab Sav. Oooh I hate that

[daver6]

Call yourself an Australian Allan? Surely it's the classic Australian language claim to fame that it finds ways to shorten anything to fewer syllables?? Language is an ever changing thing. With all due respect for my elders (but not by much ), I suggest more wine, more drums, more testosterone and less grumpy old man!!

Insert 'Old Man Yells at Clouds' meme picture....

but yeah agree on plonk. And do find 'a nice drop' mildly generic.

That's Al to you

[Duncan Disorderly]

I dispense with the Sav, and just go with Cab.

A Kiwi mate likes to use the term ‘Savvy’ for Sauvignon Blanc, but in a theatrical, tongue in cheek way, which is quite amusing.

[Barney]

I'm not too fussed although do cringe when I overhear people asking for a "Cheeky Chardonnay"....what does that mean ?, maybe comes with a bit of tude....(attitude according to my kids).

And have no problem with Savvy....doesn't deserve to be named correctly IMHO....

[DaveS]

I'm not too fussed although do cringe when I overhear people asking for a "Cheeky Chardonnay"....what does that mean ?, maybe comes with a bit of tude....(attitude according to my kids).

And have no problem with Savvy....doesn't deserve to be named correctly IMHO....

I usually shorten it by saying ‘cheeky chard’.

It’s just the Aussie way isn’t it? Plenty of words get shortened. I don’t think I know anyone that says Cabernet Sauvignon. I don’t see an issue with the abbreviated forms but that’s just me!

[phillisc]

I always thought it was Cardonnay with a heavy Cockney accent...as in that pathetic character who played the trophy bimbo in that UK series footballers wives.
No disrespect to women and marched yesterday with my health colleagues, but one Chardy has never done it for me and two, when that show came out it ruined forever any chance that I would imbide.
Cheers Craig

[Cactus]

I think I would annoy you guys. I pronounce Pinot Noir often with a hard T on Pinot and Noir pronounced Noyer.

I also tend to pronounce Champagne with a hard G.

Why? I dunno, it just ammuses me. I dont ever wanna take life too seriously.

[WineRick]

When I worked at Brown Brothers, Milawa, late last century, they had a 'Spaetlese Crouchen' (proper name for a mis-named 'Clare Riesling - bit like Hunter River Riesling which was Semillon!). Being sweet, it sold well - not as well as their Spaetlese Lexia - but if you worked Cellar-Door on a busy weekend it was bloody hard to keep a straight face when someone mangled the pronunciation. The winner was 'Split-knees Crutchen' - and don't get me started on Gewürztraminer!

[sjw_11]

When I worked at Brown Brothers, Milawa, late last century, they had a 'Spaetlese Crouchen' (proper name for a mis-named 'Clare Riesling - bit like Hunter River Riesling which was Semillon!). Being sweet, it sold well - not as well as their Spaetlese Lexia - but if you worked Cellar-Door on a busy weekend it was bloody hard to keep a straight face when someone mangled the pronunciation. The winner was 'Split-knees Crutchen' - and don't get me started on Gewürztraminer!

I have a ceremonial Brown Brothers Crouchen Riesling 2002 in my cellar ... It was one of the first pack of wines I bought when I turned 18 and for no particular reason than that it lives on (or more likely doesn't live on, but nevertheless remains in bottle).

[Mahmoud Ali]

When I worked at Brown Brothers, Milawa, late last century, they had a 'Spaetlese Crouchen' (proper name for a mis-named 'Clare Riesling - bit like Hunter River Riesling which was Semillon!). Being sweet, it sold well - not as well as their Spaetlese Lexia - but if you worked Cellar-Door on a busy weekend it was bloody hard to keep a straight face when someone mangled the pronunciation. The winner was 'Split-knees Crutchen' - and don't get me started on Gewürztraminer!

I have a ceremonial Brown Brothers Crouchen Riesling 2002 in my cellar ... It was one of the first pack of wines I bought when I turned 18 and for no particular reason than that it lives on (or more likely doesn't live on, but nevertheless remains in bottle).

Speaking of ceremonial Brown Brothers bottles, I have a pair of them. One is the Spaetlese Lexia that you mention, from the 2000 vintage, something that I brought back to Canada because somebody told me that it develops character with some time in the bottle. The other dates back to before Brown Brothers withdrew from the North American market, a 1990 Shiraz/Cab/Mondeuse.

Question is, will either or neither stand the test of time. Somehow I have a feeling that the sweet wine will pass muster.

Cheers ...................... Mahmoud.

[Ian S]

From memory, the Shiraz/Cab/Mondeuse was the odd one out in their traditional varietal and early drinking range. It always had a long drinking window in the Aussie wine annuals. Thus whilst it might be on the downslope, I'd look forward to it with positive expectation. This from someone who always fancied grabbing a bottle, but never saw it in the UK, so my comments are necessarily 2nd hand.

[WineRick]

Might be surprised with both Brown's wines; the sugar will have preserved the Sp. Lexia quite a bit and the Mondeuse will have given legs to the Shiraz/Mondeuse/Cab. Mondeuse - in it's youth is like a cross between Nebbiolo and Durif, certainly no shortage of tannin. I also enjoyed their Shiraz/Mondeuse - had a bottle of 1967 a few years back, and an early seventies 5 years ago and both were holding up well. What are the levels like?

[WAwineguy]

My worst offence is probably C9dP, but it's just so convenient

Wasn't he a robot in Star Wars?

[WAwineguy]

This thread reminds me of the Four Yorkshiremen Sketch from Monty Python:


Graham Chapman: Nothing like a good glass of Chateau de Chassilier wine, ay Gessiah?

Terry Jones: You're right there Obediah.

Eric Idle: Who'd a thought thirty years ago we'd all be sittin' here drinking Chateau de Chassilier wine?

MP: Aye. In them days, we'd a' been glad to have the price of a cup o' tea.

[WineRick]

My worst offence is probably C9dP, but it's just so convenient

Wasn't he a robot in Star Wars?

What is the 9 for - are you making Charlie Melton's mistake!

[Ian S]

My worst offence is probably C9dP, but it's just so convenient

Wasn't he a robot in Star Wars?

What is the 9 for - are you making Charlie Melton's mistake!

Very knowingly - yes. Hence the acknowledgement of the offence, but the convenience (and ironic humour) makes me happy to use it.

[Mahmoud Ali]

Might be surprised with both Brown's wines; the sugar will have preserved the Sp. Lexia quite a bit and the Mondeuse will have given legs to the Shiraz/Mondeuse/Cab. Mondeuse - in it's youth is like a cross between Nebbiolo and Durif, certainly no shortage of tannin. I also enjoyed their Shiraz/Mondeuse - had a bottle of 1967 a few years back, and an early seventies 5 years ago and both were holding up well. What are the levels like?

It was indeed the sugar that made me think that the Sp Lexia might still be enjoyable. Regarding the Shiraz/Cabernet/Mondeuse, the fact that you had a '67 and early 70s that had held up is inspiring. Thanks.

The levels on both the wines looked good the last time I saw them. Whenever levels are low the bottle in question is marked for imminent drinking.