Jura Wine Dinner with Wink Lorch
Jura Wine Dinner with Wink Lorch
Jura is the darling of the Wine Bar scene at the moment, it’s so out there that it’s cool. Wine lovers all around the world have done all the usual suspects and are looking for interesting, outside the square, conversation starting style wines that challenge the senses - Jura wine offers this in spades.
When you think writers of Burgundy, you think Andrew Jefford and the New France, Bordeaux with Clive Coates and the Wines of Bordeaux, with Jura you think of Wink Lorch. Admittedly there is a dearth of books on the region at the moment and Wink is somewhat of a trailblazer. Wink has done a great job in providing an insight of the region, its history, geography and the vineyards, wines and people that make it so unique.
Rare Wine Dinners were lucky enough to have Wink as a special guest to a Jura Wine dinner they hosted. 14 enthusiasts were able to chat with Wink and her partner over the course of the night and sample some great wines matched with some amazing food.
The event took place at Studio Neon, a ‘Guestaurant’. Where 3 chefs were allowed to let their imaginations run wild without the constraints of a normal restaurant, think 3 flatmates who all happen to be top notch chefs inviting you over to their place which just so happens to have a commercial grade kitchen it and you get the idea. They were free to find their own ingredients, try out new things and put a lot of work in matching what can be difficult wines. For the food to almost steal the show against the wine speaks volumes of how accomplished the dishes were.
I wasn’t really sure what I was expecting from Wink as a person, from her photos I had a strange Pam Ayres vibe for some reason. After chatting to her beforehand with some bubbly, we got to see what a warm and lovely person she was and how passionate she was about the Jura Region. She made everyone feel at ease and in no time was like an old friend you’d meet up for dinner and wines, albeit with an encyclopaedic knowledge of Jura.
The wines ranged from 2 year old Reds to 70+ year Vin Jaune and everything in between. Being Jura they taste reds before the whites. The juxtaposition of the reds to the whites is quite strange with the whites being the big hitters in both style and aging ability and the reds being quite light and floral and consumed slightly chilled.
The Final line-up of the wines and menu was as follows.
Frederic Lambert Crémant du Jura
Waygu Ox tongue cooked over binchotan white charcoal
Sourdough from wild cockatoo bakery Seaweed butter
Flight 1
2009 Hughes Béguet Ploussard Champ Fort
2009 Hughes Béguet Trousseau 'So True'
Cured Kangaroo Pepper berry- wild herbs-smoked egg yolk
Flight 2
1999 Daniel Dugois La Grevillière
1995 Caves Jean Bourdy Côtes du Jura Rouge
“Charcoal beefâ€Â
Flight 3
2009 Les Dolomies En Rolion Savagnin
2010 Les Dolomies Les Combes Chardonnay
Sea urchin Tapioca Australian sea lettuce-sea foam-finger lime
Flight 4
2012 Frédéric Lambert Les Gryphée
1992 Daniel Dugois Chardonnay
63 Degree hens Egg, Savoury granola- chicken skin, sweet vinegar
Flight 5
2009 Frédéric Lambert Savagnin
1996 Benoit Badoz Vin Jaune
“Fish of yesterday†This fish dish is prepared from fish caught yesterday and vegetable collected from the markets this morning
Flight 6
1975 Chateau Chalon, Henri Maire Vin Jaune
1942 Georges Meurgey Vin Jaune, Chateau Chalon
18 month aged Comté Celery-walnut-caraway- grapes
Flight 7
2011 Hughes Béguet Straw Berry
New season fig 90% cacao- blue cheese- molasses
1947 Jean Bourdy Marc de Jura
Black olives
Tasting Notes
Frederic Lambert Crémant du Jura
Probably could have done with a bit more chilling. Lemon with very light aromatics, nice tangy acidity in balance with a creamy mouthfeel.
2009 Hughes Béguet Ploussard Champ Fort
Rhubarb on the nose, with a hint of stems, cherry, rose water and Turkish Delight. There was also a hint of reductiveness which subsided after airing. Wink mentioned that the wine was a lot darker than normal. Medium tannins and metallic notes coming through and some tomato leaf at the end. This is a nice simple wine without too many pretensions and would make a great casual wine for someone looking for something different to the normal Aussie Red.
2009 Hughes Béguet Trousseau 'So True'
Immediately noticeable is a more refined nose and palate, more regal for want of a better word. Nettles, tomato leaf, violets, a very light style. Tart while maintaining a good balance with the fruit, the acidity is quite refreshing and would benefit with a bit of chill. I could drink this stuff like a lager, sessional and a lot of fun.
1999 Daniel Dugois La Grevillière Trousseau
Red fruits, dark cherry, again a very straightforward wine which I don’t use in a bad way, it’s a wine that doesn’t pretend to be something it’s not. Has a lovely balance, albeit not overly tannic more wiry than muscular. Even with 16 years on it, it seemed eminently youthful and showed how wonderfully it ages, with the age giving it a bit more complexity and the beginnings of some secondary characteristics and some earthiness coming through.
1995 Caves Jean Bourdy Côtes du Jura Rouge
Strawberry sweetness, sesame oil, with a real sense of purity. Dusty tannins providing a good grip with acidity and fruit integrating nicely. On the back of the palate it exited with a real tartness and freshness. Some sous bois and funk providing lots of interest and a real meatiness to the overall feel of the wine.
2009 Les Dolomies En Rolion Savagnin
Spicy and vibrant with a hint of oxidative caramel that is such a feature of Jura wines. Very light style of wine with some oaky and butter notes lending to a creamy softness on the palate. A lick of acid provides the balance and keeps it all in check.
2010 Les Dolomies Les Combes Chardonnay
Very lean and mineral nose, lemon sherbet, grapefruit prominent, lots of air to it in that it’s almost like an ethereal mist of smells above the glass. Very intense on the palate – taut and racy with some oak. The tartness carries through the nice length, this would be fantastic with a creamy dish and indeed it was with the sea urchin tapioca.
2012 Frédéric Lambert Les Gryphée
Green apple cider, very oxidative, with a real purity and hint of residual sweetness as a foil to the tart characteristics. The 12months this spends on lees gives it a rich creamy feel. The length on this was amazing, it just didn’t want to go away evolving to a nice nuttiness as you work it around your mouth.
1992 Daniel Dugois Chardonnay
A nice sweet and oxidative nose, burnt lemon and coconut with a hint of heat. Very smooth almost bourbon like (strange but true). Seaweed and iodine came to the fore as it sat in the glass, an amazingly youthful for a 20+ year old wine. Very persistent moving to a sweeter feel on the back palate. The complexity of this wine was almost like 4 seasons in one day a veritable cornucopia of styles.
2009 Frédéric Lambert Savagnin
Showing a more restrained oxidative nose with some acetic aromas. Nutty with caramel notes - quite sweet yet acidic on tongue (very strange sensation), very good length, it leaves your whole mouth buzzing with the acidity.
1996 Benoit Badoz Vin Jaune
First of the Vin Jaunes and it’s a style if you are not used to, comes at quite a shock to the senses. Very earthy, sherried notes, and lots of spice, very aggressive in the mouth, almost salty. Crushed nuts and almond paste. Oxidative characteristics and iodine coming through with more air.
1975 Chateau Chalon, Henri Maire Vin Jaune
A real richness to the oxidative nose with a dash of orange marmalade. Lots of nuts of various flavours. Very full on palate with a huge length that went on forever. This wine just personifies why Jura is so wrong, yet so right, it’s a wine that is hard to pigeonhole as it just doesn’t conform to anything you know about wine. Yet it ticks all the boxes of complexity, balance, length, interest and drinkability. Brilliant wine.
1942 Georges Meurgey Vin Jaune, Chateau Chalon
Grassy-ness/seaweed, sesame, sweet soy/teriyaki notes, salty and nutty, heaps going on. It is still quite tannic with oodles of acid which in a 70+ year old wine is amazing. Lovely length an almost ethereal nature about it, it just seemed to hover in your mouth and finished with a lovely salted caramel aftertaste. Wow, a real treat to be able to drink this and a wonderful example of how well Vin Jaune can age.
2011 Hughes Béguet Straw Berry
Very rich almost fortified nose, rhubarb, strawberry shortcake (not sure if some cognitive suggestion happening from the name of it as it has nothing to do with Strawberries being a vin de paille, or straw wine, anyway I digress). Thicker and more unctuous, red cordial, a really nice sweetness to it and very mellow.
1947 Jean Bourdy Marc de Jura
This was kindly donated by one of the attendees, this is a spirit at around 50+% alc. An eaux de vies that is renowned for its ability to last forever. Even as a cask strength Single Malt Whisky fan this singed all the hairs in my nose. I could smell it across the table as they were brought out. It put me in the mind of a Highland Whisky with heather, sultanas and hints of iodine. A very unique style. I would have liked to try a few drops of water in it like I do for some cask strengths if I find them too overwhelming.
Waygu Ox tongue cooked over binchotan white charcoal
The Ox tongue was unbelievably tender, I was a bit hesitant after being scarred by the ‘Becasse’ experience. The smoky charcoal offset it wonderfully.
Sourdough from wild cockatoo bakery Seaweed butter
Seriously good, seaweed butter = brilliant
Cured Kangaroo Pepper berry- wild herbs-smoked egg yolk
Very Moorish, it came on a small lavash like cracker which held it all and really went well together.
“charcoal beefâ€Â
the 'charcoal' was from black garlic, onion and sesame, and was sous vide.
Sea urchin Tapioca Australian sea lettuce-sea foam-finger lime
This was amazing, rich and creamy with heaps of different flavours, textures happening. Brilliant match with the wine.
63 Degree hens Egg Savoury granola- chicken skin- sweet vinegar
Very fun dish, once you’d broken up the poached egg and mixed it all in with the granola it was almost Bircher Muesli like.
“Fish of yesterday†This fish dish is prepared from fish caught yesterday and vegetable collected from the markets this morning
So fresh and milky like soft flesh, matched really well with the vegetables. Unusual fish as well.
18 month aged Comté Celery-walnut-caraway- grapes
Was a bit left of field, a sort of grated cheese plate with some celery mixed in to provide a counterpoint to the wine. Very nicely done or worked well.
New season fig 90% cacao- blue cheese- molasses
Nice tart figs went well with the super rich ice-cream.
Black olives
These were actually dark chocolates shaped to look like olives, embedded on toothpicks to complete the illusion.
Studio Neon and some people pics
Wink with Greg and Shannon from Rare Wine Dinners and the bottles
Do yourself a favour and grab a copy of the book, great read http://jurawine.co.uk/jura-wine-book/
When you think writers of Burgundy, you think Andrew Jefford and the New France, Bordeaux with Clive Coates and the Wines of Bordeaux, with Jura you think of Wink Lorch. Admittedly there is a dearth of books on the region at the moment and Wink is somewhat of a trailblazer. Wink has done a great job in providing an insight of the region, its history, geography and the vineyards, wines and people that make it so unique.
Rare Wine Dinners were lucky enough to have Wink as a special guest to a Jura Wine dinner they hosted. 14 enthusiasts were able to chat with Wink and her partner over the course of the night and sample some great wines matched with some amazing food.
The event took place at Studio Neon, a ‘Guestaurant’. Where 3 chefs were allowed to let their imaginations run wild without the constraints of a normal restaurant, think 3 flatmates who all happen to be top notch chefs inviting you over to their place which just so happens to have a commercial grade kitchen it and you get the idea. They were free to find their own ingredients, try out new things and put a lot of work in matching what can be difficult wines. For the food to almost steal the show against the wine speaks volumes of how accomplished the dishes were.
I wasn’t really sure what I was expecting from Wink as a person, from her photos I had a strange Pam Ayres vibe for some reason. After chatting to her beforehand with some bubbly, we got to see what a warm and lovely person she was and how passionate she was about the Jura Region. She made everyone feel at ease and in no time was like an old friend you’d meet up for dinner and wines, albeit with an encyclopaedic knowledge of Jura.
The wines ranged from 2 year old Reds to 70+ year Vin Jaune and everything in between. Being Jura they taste reds before the whites. The juxtaposition of the reds to the whites is quite strange with the whites being the big hitters in both style and aging ability and the reds being quite light and floral and consumed slightly chilled.
The Final line-up of the wines and menu was as follows.
Frederic Lambert Crémant du Jura
Waygu Ox tongue cooked over binchotan white charcoal
Sourdough from wild cockatoo bakery Seaweed butter
Flight 1
2009 Hughes Béguet Ploussard Champ Fort
2009 Hughes Béguet Trousseau 'So True'
Cured Kangaroo Pepper berry- wild herbs-smoked egg yolk
Flight 2
1999 Daniel Dugois La Grevillière
1995 Caves Jean Bourdy Côtes du Jura Rouge
“Charcoal beefâ€Â
Flight 3
2009 Les Dolomies En Rolion Savagnin
2010 Les Dolomies Les Combes Chardonnay
Sea urchin Tapioca Australian sea lettuce-sea foam-finger lime
Flight 4
2012 Frédéric Lambert Les Gryphée
1992 Daniel Dugois Chardonnay
63 Degree hens Egg, Savoury granola- chicken skin, sweet vinegar
Flight 5
2009 Frédéric Lambert Savagnin
1996 Benoit Badoz Vin Jaune
“Fish of yesterday†This fish dish is prepared from fish caught yesterday and vegetable collected from the markets this morning
Flight 6
1975 Chateau Chalon, Henri Maire Vin Jaune
1942 Georges Meurgey Vin Jaune, Chateau Chalon
18 month aged Comté Celery-walnut-caraway- grapes
Flight 7
2011 Hughes Béguet Straw Berry
New season fig 90% cacao- blue cheese- molasses
1947 Jean Bourdy Marc de Jura
Black olives
Tasting Notes
Frederic Lambert Crémant du Jura
Probably could have done with a bit more chilling. Lemon with very light aromatics, nice tangy acidity in balance with a creamy mouthfeel.
2009 Hughes Béguet Ploussard Champ Fort
Rhubarb on the nose, with a hint of stems, cherry, rose water and Turkish Delight. There was also a hint of reductiveness which subsided after airing. Wink mentioned that the wine was a lot darker than normal. Medium tannins and metallic notes coming through and some tomato leaf at the end. This is a nice simple wine without too many pretensions and would make a great casual wine for someone looking for something different to the normal Aussie Red.
2009 Hughes Béguet Trousseau 'So True'
Immediately noticeable is a more refined nose and palate, more regal for want of a better word. Nettles, tomato leaf, violets, a very light style. Tart while maintaining a good balance with the fruit, the acidity is quite refreshing and would benefit with a bit of chill. I could drink this stuff like a lager, sessional and a lot of fun.
1999 Daniel Dugois La Grevillière Trousseau
Red fruits, dark cherry, again a very straightforward wine which I don’t use in a bad way, it’s a wine that doesn’t pretend to be something it’s not. Has a lovely balance, albeit not overly tannic more wiry than muscular. Even with 16 years on it, it seemed eminently youthful and showed how wonderfully it ages, with the age giving it a bit more complexity and the beginnings of some secondary characteristics and some earthiness coming through.
1995 Caves Jean Bourdy Côtes du Jura Rouge
Strawberry sweetness, sesame oil, with a real sense of purity. Dusty tannins providing a good grip with acidity and fruit integrating nicely. On the back of the palate it exited with a real tartness and freshness. Some sous bois and funk providing lots of interest and a real meatiness to the overall feel of the wine.
2009 Les Dolomies En Rolion Savagnin
Spicy and vibrant with a hint of oxidative caramel that is such a feature of Jura wines. Very light style of wine with some oaky and butter notes lending to a creamy softness on the palate. A lick of acid provides the balance and keeps it all in check.
2010 Les Dolomies Les Combes Chardonnay
Very lean and mineral nose, lemon sherbet, grapefruit prominent, lots of air to it in that it’s almost like an ethereal mist of smells above the glass. Very intense on the palate – taut and racy with some oak. The tartness carries through the nice length, this would be fantastic with a creamy dish and indeed it was with the sea urchin tapioca.
2012 Frédéric Lambert Les Gryphée
Green apple cider, very oxidative, with a real purity and hint of residual sweetness as a foil to the tart characteristics. The 12months this spends on lees gives it a rich creamy feel. The length on this was amazing, it just didn’t want to go away evolving to a nice nuttiness as you work it around your mouth.
1992 Daniel Dugois Chardonnay
A nice sweet and oxidative nose, burnt lemon and coconut with a hint of heat. Very smooth almost bourbon like (strange but true). Seaweed and iodine came to the fore as it sat in the glass, an amazingly youthful for a 20+ year old wine. Very persistent moving to a sweeter feel on the back palate. The complexity of this wine was almost like 4 seasons in one day a veritable cornucopia of styles.
2009 Frédéric Lambert Savagnin
Showing a more restrained oxidative nose with some acetic aromas. Nutty with caramel notes - quite sweet yet acidic on tongue (very strange sensation), very good length, it leaves your whole mouth buzzing with the acidity.
1996 Benoit Badoz Vin Jaune
First of the Vin Jaunes and it’s a style if you are not used to, comes at quite a shock to the senses. Very earthy, sherried notes, and lots of spice, very aggressive in the mouth, almost salty. Crushed nuts and almond paste. Oxidative characteristics and iodine coming through with more air.
1975 Chateau Chalon, Henri Maire Vin Jaune
A real richness to the oxidative nose with a dash of orange marmalade. Lots of nuts of various flavours. Very full on palate with a huge length that went on forever. This wine just personifies why Jura is so wrong, yet so right, it’s a wine that is hard to pigeonhole as it just doesn’t conform to anything you know about wine. Yet it ticks all the boxes of complexity, balance, length, interest and drinkability. Brilliant wine.
1942 Georges Meurgey Vin Jaune, Chateau Chalon
Grassy-ness/seaweed, sesame, sweet soy/teriyaki notes, salty and nutty, heaps going on. It is still quite tannic with oodles of acid which in a 70+ year old wine is amazing. Lovely length an almost ethereal nature about it, it just seemed to hover in your mouth and finished with a lovely salted caramel aftertaste. Wow, a real treat to be able to drink this and a wonderful example of how well Vin Jaune can age.
2011 Hughes Béguet Straw Berry
Very rich almost fortified nose, rhubarb, strawberry shortcake (not sure if some cognitive suggestion happening from the name of it as it has nothing to do with Strawberries being a vin de paille, or straw wine, anyway I digress). Thicker and more unctuous, red cordial, a really nice sweetness to it and very mellow.
1947 Jean Bourdy Marc de Jura
This was kindly donated by one of the attendees, this is a spirit at around 50+% alc. An eaux de vies that is renowned for its ability to last forever. Even as a cask strength Single Malt Whisky fan this singed all the hairs in my nose. I could smell it across the table as they were brought out. It put me in the mind of a Highland Whisky with heather, sultanas and hints of iodine. A very unique style. I would have liked to try a few drops of water in it like I do for some cask strengths if I find them too overwhelming.
Waygu Ox tongue cooked over binchotan white charcoal
The Ox tongue was unbelievably tender, I was a bit hesitant after being scarred by the ‘Becasse’ experience. The smoky charcoal offset it wonderfully.
Sourdough from wild cockatoo bakery Seaweed butter
Seriously good, seaweed butter = brilliant
Cured Kangaroo Pepper berry- wild herbs-smoked egg yolk
Very Moorish, it came on a small lavash like cracker which held it all and really went well together.
“charcoal beefâ€Â
the 'charcoal' was from black garlic, onion and sesame, and was sous vide.
Sea urchin Tapioca Australian sea lettuce-sea foam-finger lime
This was amazing, rich and creamy with heaps of different flavours, textures happening. Brilliant match with the wine.
63 Degree hens Egg Savoury granola- chicken skin- sweet vinegar
Very fun dish, once you’d broken up the poached egg and mixed it all in with the granola it was almost Bircher Muesli like.
“Fish of yesterday†This fish dish is prepared from fish caught yesterday and vegetable collected from the markets this morning
So fresh and milky like soft flesh, matched really well with the vegetables. Unusual fish as well.
18 month aged Comté Celery-walnut-caraway- grapes
Was a bit left of field, a sort of grated cheese plate with some celery mixed in to provide a counterpoint to the wine. Very nicely done or worked well.
New season fig 90% cacao- blue cheese- molasses
Nice tart figs went well with the super rich ice-cream.
Black olives
These were actually dark chocolates shaped to look like olives, embedded on toothpicks to complete the illusion.
Studio Neon and some people pics
Wink with Greg and Shannon from Rare Wine Dinners and the bottles
Do yourself a favour and grab a copy of the book, great read http://jurawine.co.uk/jura-wine-book/
Re: Jura Wine Dinner with Wink Lorch
Thanks for the detailed report. I was wondering how the evening went. I wish I could have flown over to attend.
Re: Jura Wine Dinner with Wink Lorch
Sounds awesome Dave, nice write up
You can find me on Instagram at oz_oenophile
Follow for my little wine journey.
Follow for my little wine journey.
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Re: Jura Wine Dinner with Wink Lorch
Lovely write up.
I've never written up my old Jura nor Madeira dinners. I never got either. I'm happy if the wine world catches on and funds siphoned their way relieving pressure off More desirable wines and regions.
I've never written up my old Jura nor Madeira dinners. I never got either. I'm happy if the wine world catches on and funds siphoned their way relieving pressure off More desirable wines and regions.
"Barolo is Barolo, you can't describe it, just as you can't describe Picasso"
Teobaldo Cappellano
Teobaldo Cappellano
Re: Jura Wine Dinner with Wink Lorch
No offense Jamie, but saying other regions than Jura are 'More desirable' doesn't apply to all, it must be said. I love both Madeira and Jura wines, but of course not all of them. Like any region, some are better than others and I enjoy the points of difference that good Jura wine adds to my world wine experience. IMHO Savagnin is a fantastic grape, and the Vin Jaunes at this tasting were fantastic and equally as memorable to me as the great aged Burgundy, Barolo or Bordeaux that also stick in my memory.
Much of the wine world has already caught on, Jura is hot property in trendy wine bars in NYC, Sydney and I'm sure others, although more the reds than the whites. Issue is that there is such tiny quantities of both, it's never going to be the next big thing, so everyone is happy I guess!
Cheers
Tim
Much of the wine world has already caught on, Jura is hot property in trendy wine bars in NYC, Sydney and I'm sure others, although more the reds than the whites. Issue is that there is such tiny quantities of both, it's never going to be the next big thing, so everyone is happy I guess!
Cheers
Tim
Re: Jura Wine Dinner with Wink Lorch
I doubt it will ever be a region a lot of people move towards...They're not going to be a wine for everyone...but when people are looking for something different, that is just one of the regions where people start gravitating to because they're different. Stinky, cheesy, high acid, oxidative style (for a lot of them)...that isn't going to appeal to a lot of people...
Jura's scarcity will always be kept in check by their lack of popularity except amongst some of the geekiest of wine geeks...I'm of the opinion that people aren't necessarily going to the Jura because they feel the wines are better because objectively I'd probably say there are a lot places that make "better" wine...but when some people have tried a lot of different wines they just want something different and interesting..."really good" gets boring...and "the best" gets incredibly expensive...So barring being able to drink "the best" regularly, I'd go for interesting+really good for a fraction of the cost...
I'd put Loire Cab Franc in the same type of category....
This is different than say, Barolo/Barbaresco, Super Tuscans, Rhones and German Rieslings..which I would say are less popular (thankfully) but could easily catch on and jump in price...
Jura's scarcity will always be kept in check by their lack of popularity except amongst some of the geekiest of wine geeks...I'm of the opinion that people aren't necessarily going to the Jura because they feel the wines are better because objectively I'd probably say there are a lot places that make "better" wine...but when some people have tried a lot of different wines they just want something different and interesting..."really good" gets boring...and "the best" gets incredibly expensive...So barring being able to drink "the best" regularly, I'd go for interesting+really good for a fraction of the cost...
I'd put Loire Cab Franc in the same type of category....
This is different than say, Barolo/Barbaresco, Super Tuscans, Rhones and German Rieslings..which I would say are less popular (thankfully) but could easily catch on and jump in price...
Re: Jura Wine Dinner with Wink Lorch
would be very surprised if anything from Jura jumped in price, I agree they are certainly a "different" alternative to mainstream stuff we drink, but they are not for me. I prefer to add sugar to my coffee, not my wine. Went to a Chalon vertical in Lyon in 2012, left thinking I am glad I don't have any in the cellar!!!
they are currently trendy in Paris too, and I remember seeing some on lists in Melbourne in January. I'm with Jamie, would love to see them become the darling of the wine world, so the mega-rich can fight over rare bottles of Arbois or vin jaune, and leave the good stuff for the rest of us
they are currently trendy in Paris too, and I remember seeing some on lists in Melbourne in January. I'm with Jamie, would love to see them become the darling of the wine world, so the mega-rich can fight over rare bottles of Arbois or vin jaune, and leave the good stuff for the rest of us
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Re: Jura Wine Dinner with Wink Lorch
Looks awesome!! I'm eyeing the Bordeaux focussed dinner they're putting on later in the year. Was there any discussion on when the possible date would be for that dinner?
Re: Jura Wine Dinner with Wink Lorch
felixp wrote:would be very surprised if anything from Jura jumped in price, I agree they are certainly a "different" alternative to mainstream stuff we drink, but they are not for me. I prefer to add sugar to my coffee, not my wine. Went to a Chalon vertical in Lyon in 2012, left thinking I am glad I don't have any in the cellar!!!
they are currently trendy in Paris too, and I remember seeing some on lists in Melbourne in January. I'm with Jamie, would love to see them become the darling of the wine world, so the mega-rich can fight over rare bottles of Arbois or vin jaune, and leave the good stuff for the rest of us
There are some Vin Ouille Jura Chardonnay that aren't stinky...and they'll compete with a lot of 1er Cru White Burgs..but without the premox problems...but definitely, by far, Jura is not going to be mainstream..I don't think ever..but so what?
What I'm surprised about is...apparently you've tried a lot of different wine from a lot of different areas..but what you like is still really narrow (comparatively to many on here). You've obviously been drinking/tasting wine for a long time and have the funds to try a lot of different things..but if after so many years of trying so many different things, if you know what you like (and I'm going to guess that hasn't changed a whole lot over the years)...why do you continue to go to try different regions you know you'll hate? Maybe the times between these tastings are actually quite large but it doesn't sound like it. To me it is the same thing as a red wine drinker that doesn't like whites, constantly going to try whites and constantly hating it..why bother? Maybe trying something every long awhile just in case you might somehow like it is reasonable..but certainly I'd not waste time drinking wine I hated. Do you feel the examples you've tried are not representative of the region? Or do you think your palate might have changed in the last 6 months?
Re: Jura Wine Dinner with Wink Lorch
felixp wrote: I prefer to add sugar to my coffee, not my wine.
Didn't pick you as a 'Natural' wine advocate.
Re: Jura Wine Dinner with Wink Lorch
They are certainly mainstream in Germany where they come over on a day trip to buy a boot load. Cheap and great value.
I'd drink those glorious chardonnays every day of the week if I could afford them
I'd drink those glorious chardonnays every day of the week if I could afford them
http://vinsiders.com.au
Re: Jura Wine Dinner with Wink Lorch
Red Smurf wrote:felixp wrote: I prefer to add sugar to my coffee, not my wine.
Didn't pick you as a 'Natural' wine advocate.
Can't say I understood the orriginal comment. Was it saying the wines of the Jura are too sweet? Too acid?
Paul.
Re: Jura Wine Dinner with Wink Lorch
pstarr wrote:Red Smurf wrote:felixp wrote: I prefer to add sugar to my coffee, not my wine.
Didn't pick you as a 'Natural' wine advocate.
Can't say I understood the original comment. Was it saying the wines of the Jura are too sweet? Too acid?
Yeah, was weird confusing. But Wrong either way, most often they are just right, but we don't all appreciate the overall style. I say tomato, you say tomado etc... each to their own.
But in a nice way, often Jura do show a nice kick of acid, especially the Vin Jaunes.
Re: Jura Wine Dinner with Wink Lorch
pstarr wrote:Red Smurf wrote:felixp wrote: I prefer to add sugar to my coffee, not my wine.
Didn't pick you as a 'Natural' wine advocate.
Can't say I understood the orriginal comment. Was it saying the wines of the Jura are too sweet? Too acid?
That the wines are Chaptalized.
For some sure, but not all.
Many ripe wines add acid.
Re: Jura Wine Dinner with Wink Lorch
They add sugar in other "good" regions as well...Including Bordeaux and Burgundy...
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Re: Jura Wine Dinner with Wink Lorch
pardon the non-sequiter, but Dave, could you let me know what camera and lens you are using.
as always, your photos are bloody splendid!
as always, your photos are bloody splendid!
Re: Jura Wine Dinner with Wink Lorch
last time I was in Jura was 1969 , so no, I do not go to wine regions I "hate" However, why do you insist in making up flase quotes here?? I'm not the only victim, I see!! Are you are journalist for Fairfax by any chance?? Please try to read the message before you mis-quote, it is becoming a very undesirable habit of yours.
I simply stated that the wines are not for me, and that their lack of popularity will ensure they will never achieve stratospheric pricing, which is a good thing!!!
I can't see where I said I "hate" the wines, can you??
There are many many wines I dislike, but like the Halliday argument had a few weeks ago, "hate" is much too strong a word.
I went to a Chalon tasting with my son in Paris, cause he happens to live 20m from a grog shop and is good mates with the owner. Happy now?
Yep, I have tried more wine regions than I care to remember, and have kept drinking the regions I like. That does not make me a "narrow" drinker, whatever that means, but I certainly prefer the wines of three French regions in particular, Bordeaux, Burgundy and Rhone. Clearly, I am not on my own there, and unfortunately the popularity of these regions is reflected in their price.
And yes, I have worked hard and have the funds to be able to purchase very expensive wines, although in general my limit is about $750 a bottle, as beyond that you are paying for label, not what is in the bottle.
However, I would have though my perspective is as valuable as yours, Polymer, and a mix of opinions about anything vinous can only lead to a robust discussion and therefore enhance the value of this board.
I simply stated that the wines are not for me, and that their lack of popularity will ensure they will never achieve stratospheric pricing, which is a good thing!!!
I can't see where I said I "hate" the wines, can you??
There are many many wines I dislike, but like the Halliday argument had a few weeks ago, "hate" is much too strong a word.
I went to a Chalon tasting with my son in Paris, cause he happens to live 20m from a grog shop and is good mates with the owner. Happy now?
Yep, I have tried more wine regions than I care to remember, and have kept drinking the regions I like. That does not make me a "narrow" drinker, whatever that means, but I certainly prefer the wines of three French regions in particular, Bordeaux, Burgundy and Rhone. Clearly, I am not on my own there, and unfortunately the popularity of these regions is reflected in their price.
And yes, I have worked hard and have the funds to be able to purchase very expensive wines, although in general my limit is about $750 a bottle, as beyond that you are paying for label, not what is in the bottle.
However, I would have though my perspective is as valuable as yours, Polymer, and a mix of opinions about anything vinous can only lead to a robust discussion and therefore enhance the value of this board.
Re: Jura Wine Dinner with Wink Lorch
I didn't misquote you...If you feel I said you WENT to wine regions you hated, you might want to re-read it again:
"
why do you continue to go to try different regions you know you'll hate?
"
So are you saying I'm misquoting you on the going to the region? Because I didn't say that...Or because hate is too strong a word? Yes, you didn't use hate but you inferred a huge disliking to it but my apologies if hate is too strong of a word. But if you'd like me to take some directs quotes that would infer a VERY strong dislike for the wines(which I'm sure some would interpret as hate), I'd be glad to do that...
But if you are unhappy with my choice of words, let me change what I said to be more accurate:
Why do you continue to try wines (via tastings) from regions where you dislike the wines?
I'm just curious as to why...Since you do use that to try to lend yourself credibility on a region..and in other threads as well....You've consistently stated how you keep trying wines from all over the world and you dislike these wines..I'm just curious as to why you end up going back to them regularly for a tasting...Your opinion, of course, is your opinion...I'm not discounting it...I'm not trying to convince you that wines from other regions are actually to your liking...But if you're going to state you try wines out of your comfort zone quite often and how you try these wines from other areas on a regular basis but you dislike them, then I have to ask what makes you go back to tastings of these regions to try wines you dislike if you know you will dislike them. Is it because you think you might have a change in your palate? Is it because you think you're missing something from these regions?
Like for me, I'll try more Pinot from Tasmania even though in general I'm not a fan, but I do that because I know they're shifting styles all the time and there are a few wines I do enjoy from there. I know Australian wineries shift styles often enough (sometimes 2-3 times in decade) so it is worthwhile for me to give them a go to see where they're at and how they're developing...but I also don't dislike them enough to ever say I'm glad I don't have any in my cellar or to call a wine list that has them a bad list..
"
why do you continue to go to try different regions you know you'll hate?
"
So are you saying I'm misquoting you on the going to the region? Because I didn't say that...Or because hate is too strong a word? Yes, you didn't use hate but you inferred a huge disliking to it but my apologies if hate is too strong of a word. But if you'd like me to take some directs quotes that would infer a VERY strong dislike for the wines(which I'm sure some would interpret as hate), I'd be glad to do that...
But if you are unhappy with my choice of words, let me change what I said to be more accurate:
Why do you continue to try wines (via tastings) from regions where you dislike the wines?
I'm just curious as to why...Since you do use that to try to lend yourself credibility on a region..and in other threads as well....You've consistently stated how you keep trying wines from all over the world and you dislike these wines..I'm just curious as to why you end up going back to them regularly for a tasting...Your opinion, of course, is your opinion...I'm not discounting it...I'm not trying to convince you that wines from other regions are actually to your liking...But if you're going to state you try wines out of your comfort zone quite often and how you try these wines from other areas on a regular basis but you dislike them, then I have to ask what makes you go back to tastings of these regions to try wines you dislike if you know you will dislike them. Is it because you think you might have a change in your palate? Is it because you think you're missing something from these regions?
Like for me, I'll try more Pinot from Tasmania even though in general I'm not a fan, but I do that because I know they're shifting styles all the time and there are a few wines I do enjoy from there. I know Australian wineries shift styles often enough (sometimes 2-3 times in decade) so it is worthwhile for me to give them a go to see where they're at and how they're developing...but I also don't dislike them enough to ever say I'm glad I don't have any in my cellar or to call a wine list that has them a bad list..
Re: Jura Wine Dinner with Wink Lorch
As I said, the Chalon tasting was unavoidable, given I was personally invited by the host!!!!
There are many very popular wine regions/wine styles I don't get, I will name the three most popular..... Italy, Germany and Sauternes. Not only do I still make a serious effort to go to tastings, indeed, I still even BUY the stuff. It still annoys me that I don't like these wines, so I am actually on a mission to keep tasting until I discover what it is that everyone else sees in the stuff. Call me crazy, but I simply refuse to give in!!!
Not that interested in the Loire and Alsace, but still go there for the food, scenery and vibe. Both places amazing, as is driving around the Mosel and sitting on the balcony on a Tuscan villa.. So there is more than one reason to go to a vinous region... most old world vinous regions happen to also be extraordinarily beautiful. In fact, if you take out the towns of St Emilion, Bordeaux, Beaune and Dijon, then Bordeaux and burgundy are possibly the least interesting regions to go if you do not care for wine.
There are many very popular wine regions/wine styles I don't get, I will name the three most popular..... Italy, Germany and Sauternes. Not only do I still make a serious effort to go to tastings, indeed, I still even BUY the stuff. It still annoys me that I don't like these wines, so I am actually on a mission to keep tasting until I discover what it is that everyone else sees in the stuff. Call me crazy, but I simply refuse to give in!!!
Not that interested in the Loire and Alsace, but still go there for the food, scenery and vibe. Both places amazing, as is driving around the Mosel and sitting on the balcony on a Tuscan villa.. So there is more than one reason to go to a vinous region... most old world vinous regions happen to also be extraordinarily beautiful. In fact, if you take out the towns of St Emilion, Bordeaux, Beaune and Dijon, then Bordeaux and burgundy are possibly the least interesting regions to go if you do not care for wine.
Re: Jura Wine Dinner with Wink Lorch
via collins wrote:pardon the non-sequiter, but Dave, could you let me know what camera and lens you are using.
as always, your photos are bloody splendid!
Canon 7D with a 17-55 f2.8 (I usually use a 15-85 f/3.5-5.6)
PS the photos should be much better I kept on having issues trying to hold the zoom and focus. Thing nearly went sailing across the room by the end of the night.
Re: Jura Wine Dinner with Wink Lorch
felixp wrote:There are many very popular wine regions/wine styles I don't get, I will name the three most popular..... Italy, Germany and Sauternes.
Ok I can almost understand Germany as a 'wine region', given the vast majority of German wine we are exposed to is Riesling, and not everyone likes sweeter wines. But to say you don't get 'Italy' is totally shocking, and almost unbelievable. Nice post though, don't give in!! Keep trying!!!
Re: Jura Wine Dinner with Wink Lorch
Felix..I'm really not talking about going to the regions themselves...but thanks for the added info...I do agree that Bordeaux is a pretty boring region to visit (outside of the wine). I think Burgundy is quite interesting though as is the Loire (although the Loire is really more like several different regions because of the size)..
And thank you for the response...but I do have another question though..So if you're buying wines you dislike...how are you making a determination on which ones to buy? Is it based on reputation, critic scores, price or were they the ones you disliked the least?
With Italians, I'm a bit surprised you don't like Super Tuscans as they can be very Bordeaux like, especially when they get older...although based on what I see as your preferences I can see why you dislike some of the other regions...
And thank you for the response...but I do have another question though..So if you're buying wines you dislike...how are you making a determination on which ones to buy? Is it based on reputation, critic scores, price or were they the ones you disliked the least?
With Italians, I'm a bit surprised you don't like Super Tuscans as they can be very Bordeaux like, especially when they get older...although based on what I see as your preferences I can see why you dislike some of the other regions...
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Re: Jura Wine Dinner with Wink Lorch
Thanks for the report: very insightful. Over the past couple of years I've been seeking out a few Jura wines. They're difficult to track down, though a local-ish merchant stocks several & recently I discovered an importer/retailer. The top stuff is not cheap & I can't say I enjoy everything from the region. Recently tried & liked a Macvin, which most purists dismiss as a wrong 'un.
Wink Lorch's book is well worth a read, IMO.
Wink Lorch's book is well worth a read, IMO.